Thank you foreign Thank you Thank you Oh hey everyone it’s Dr jeria C Audio here with dig deep conversations with Christian leaders I am your host Dr jaria C Audio author leader mentor and change agent if you are tuning in for the very first time make sure that you type in the comments my first time I
Want to welcome you to the show uh dig deep conversations with Christian leaders is a show that I’ve been doing since uh 2020 I want to say I took a little bit of a break but we are now back there are conversations about a lot of different topics I have different
Christian leaders that I have close relationships with friendships with or that I just admire coming on to the show um to just kind of talk about all types of different things we’ve talked about delivered from divorce uh being single we’ve talked about um you know being raised as a preacher’s
Kid all types of different topics and tonight’s topic is no different it’s actually a very special topic it’s going to be a series of Three episodes if you were here on last week we started the series finding the divine in the divine nine and so this conversation this
Series of conversations is focused on talking with folks who are Christian leaders who are also active in Black Greek letter organizations and so I’m so thrilled to have my guest for this evening if it is your first time watching I see there are a lot of folks
That are tuning in TK is here Nikki is here and I told I was on the phone with Nakia earlier now and I told her since she ain’t doing nothing tonight you should watch my show and make sure that you comment because I’m gonna shout you
Out so hi Nakia hi Coda thank you so much for tuning in and watching um I’m so excited to bring on my guests to have this conversation we’re going to be talking about sort of breaking down different misconceptions that are out there about black Greek letter organizations so fraternities and
Sororities especially those of us that are Christians you have seen a lot of people denouncing their organizations and this is not a knock against them really and truly it’s whatever your personal conviction is and my mind though I think what better way to find out from people or find out about
Organizations than to talk with the people who are actively involved in those organizations so without further to do I’m going to bring on my guest let’s welcome our guest for the evening hi ladies hello hi so excited that y’all said yes thank you thank you thank you for being
Here and as you all can see they are wrapping their sororities I love all of it I love it so now if there’s any Deltas that are tuned in make sure you shout yourselves out if there’s any Zetas that are watching make sure that y’all shout it out uh we do have another
Guest who will be joining us terribly uh but for right now we’ve got our guests that are here so what I’m actually going to have you all do is introduce yourselves just give us your name uh the sorority that you’re representing um tell us a little bit about sort of what you do
Um as far as your Christian leadership or just in general and then how long you’ve been with your organization so let’s start with utk what’s up everybody thank you so much Dr jeria for having um us here collaboratively um in Sisterhood Brotherhood all things fraternity sorority I’m very excited about this particular conversation
Finding the Divine and the divine nine I am TK The Zeta and yes I am throwing all the signs I’m doing everything that you probably do not expect from me tonight on this particular platform because this is the conversation for it so I’m so happy to be here with you and um joining
My girlfriend uh Chantelle of course she’ll give more about herself I mean she’s adult um so anyway uh I just wanted to throw that out there as well but we are repping uh what we actually stand for and thank you so much once again to all that are out here in this wonderful
Audience and and we will be partaking in a very robust conversation this evening I love it now before we move on I need you just back up just a little bit and show off the shirt you gotta show off the gear for tonight I mean just fresh just clean just clean okay Came ready love it love it let’s go to you next good evening everybody thank you so much again Dr Julia you are a jewel and so we are so happy to be with you on tonight I am Chantelle biddings um I am a member of Delta Sigma Theta sorority Incorporated period
Um yes I am uh also a licensed clinical professional counselor um in Ministry I am a part of our youth leadership along with my husband who’s the youth pastor at our church um I do hope things in the church local National jurisdiction-wise you know all the things that we do
Um and so I um I’m actually probably uh the the newest member to a Greek letter organization I am just celebrating my one year anniversary in Delta Sigma Theta on Sunday um and so yay excited to see all my sorrows online I see them joining us and so we’re
Excited to be here with you awesome thank you thank you again for saying yes for agreeing to the conversation um just to in case if anyone is wondering no I am not a part of any Greek organization um this is just something that I felt needed to be talked about it’s something
That I’ve always been interested in and I’ve had conversations with other Christian leaders that are active in their organizations and I started to have conversations and ask questions about you know what are your thoughts about people that think you know this is idol worship you know there’s hazing
These are this is demonic that sort of thing and so as I started to think about that and and have conversations with folks a little bit more I really just wanted to bring folks to the table to the conversation to dig deep into this topic and that’s exactly what we are
Going to do tonight so I hope that you all are ready we’re going to get into uh the first question of the night here um if you ladies could just tell me a little bit about why you chose your particular sorority so um let’s start with Miss Delta I’m
Gonna call you miss Delta I love it I’m here for it so um I will say that uh Delta simulator so we’re already Incorporated um as TK will say I’m sure it’s the best sorority in the world um and so our organization of college educated women who are moving and shaking leaders
In our communities um in our respective Fields um I have always admired women of Delta Sigma Theta sorority they’ve been some very um key figures in my life professionally spiritually education wise and so of course when you interact with so many powerful wonderful leaders in the world you want to know
More about it so you do your research you talk you have the conversations um and you make a good decision for you which is what I hope that we we talk more about on tonight you make the best decision for you and so um Delta Sigma Theta is the only way for
Me and so that’s why I chose it right TK for me all right all right well I will share that I’m I’m also new to um the the white and blue and it is something that had been a part of just a aspiration um all of my life I was very intrigued
By sororities and I think I was more intrigued by sororities because um it was like this Secret Society if you will because I grew up in the Church of God in Christ so that was the only sorority I already knew about was coaching so I was right girl that
Was my sorority that was what I was a part of and um but I was very intrigued by um this thing that was called fraternities and sororities and my only worldview of that was from television so you know of course watching a different world and trying to understand I think
That’s really where we first started to hear and see um what this whole experience was about and so I was my curiosity was Pete and because of that I sought to feel that that desire of wanting to know more about what was so bad about the sororities and I know we’ll get into
That in just a little bit but um I wanted to know what was so bad about it and trying to find out what was so bad about what we knew as fraternities and sororities just because because of my background so I want to be very clear
Here and set the stage and um you know preface my commentary with how I was brought up and and the environment that I was brought up in as a um as a Pentecostal as a pastor’s daughter as a Church Girl I wanted to know what was so bad about sororities
What was so bad about uh this world of fraternities and so in trying to um to to find the answer to what was so bad about it I started running into what was good and um I didn’t find the bad what I started finding was good and um a part of me is
Colorado Springs and so Colorado Springs of course there there were no um answers there so it was not until I moved to the South um where I started hearing about this in this tangible way was like I could feel it I could touch it I could see it and
It was like these were real people it wasn’t a secret society they were real people and so as I started to um research and as I started to reach out um and then because I was in an area of Memphis Tennessee that actually Embraces the divine nine in the fabulosity that
They do because I was a part of that um I escorted by different organizations as well so being courted by those organizations also allowed me to have um you know to be able to ask questions and have those valuable conversations so that’s pretty much how I chose I will
Get into my story a little bit later about why I chose Zeta Phi Beta sorority Incorporated um the final women of uh 1920. I came in um in the Centennial year uh of 2020 I crossed in January of 2020. um and I was very proud to do that so I
Will get into a little bit more but yes Zeta is the way I chose to go and um I believe as Chantelle already stated she was wrong but I will share the final women of Zeta Phi Beta sorority Incorporated are the best um and so I’ll go ahead and put that out
There too so y’all can go ahead and blast that in the comments I don’t care what color you’re wearing seriously we have a dove I mean like the Holy Spirit lives with us it’s just come on now oh bless it Lord I already agrees I don’t even know this
Man and he agrees with you so listen come on I just want you to know the spirit dwells here okay okay because all right we have Pastor Aj Johnson has joined us from five Beta Sigma Pastor Johnson how are you doing thank you for coming on this evening sir I’m good
I’m good can you hear me yes yeah we can hear you all right cool cool cool cool man it’s an honor to be on with TK to zaded with you Dr uh Joe and with uh sister Renee is it did I get it right sister so
I got it I got it your name just like disappeared I’m sorry but it’s uh it’s an honor to be on with you all thank you thank you so much again for saying yes um I know when you’re busy and all of you I was busy and hectic
Schedules uh but we are just actually getting started so it’s perfect timing um if you could just give us a little brief introduction who you are um why you chose Phi Beta Sigma um and just a little bit about sort of what you do that’d be great and then
We’re gonna get into the rest of the questions for tonight certainly um well my name is uh Aj Johnson uh I’m the senior pastor of urban hope Refuge Church in the city of Hartford and uh I have I fulfill a lot of roles in the community because uh you know as Sigma
Men we truly believe in community so I’m over capacity with my roles in the community um but I’m the deputy chaplain for the Connecticut General Assembly um the vice chair of the Hartford board of education uh in immediate past president of the Delta Pi Sigma chapter 5 Beta Sigma fraternity Incorporated and
When I say past president I I immediate past president I mean that with my whole soul immediate past president and if any of you have served in any uh e-boards or in the leadership of your potenti your organization you understand that uh it ain’t really a volunteer organization it’s your work and your
Organization um I’m a son of a uh of the late Apostle Dr William milis Johnson Jr who uh was just like a general of social justice he believed that um if you were to do the work of Christ you would have to translate love into tangible services so my whole being is community
Um and uh it just you know do my father and my mother I’ve just learned how how to work um now how did I get to Phi Beta Sigma fraternity Incorporated um it’s very interesting because I grew up Pentecostal when uh TK said she grew
Up in a car I grew up Pentecostal as well and I grew up uh with the understanding that you don’t um you don’t join secret societies and it was something that uh I I looked at growing up in Connecticut Connecticut as you know um Dr Joe is that uh Connecticut is 98
White you know 98 white I didn’t see my first black teacher until I got to High School uh and she was an AKA and I just was amazed that there was a black person that was in AKA um back in Hartford we used to do the African and African American Day parade
And I would see the different organizations come and go um it wasn’t until I got to college um and and I went to Seminary so it was quite interesting I waited to my senior year to pledge the alumni chapter because I was just so unsure
About if I would go to heaven or hell being in an organization like I I was not sure and so I I took the risk and I looked at my community and when you go down south so here’s a weird thing about organization is that um I hope that we explore in this
Journey right uh I’m like I’m fairly light-skinned right but when you go down to South Carolina if you’re my complexion you’re a Catholic right you’re a Catholic and you know I came from from up North so I knew how to dress it was nobody else dressing me
Growing up in the Pentecostal Church you that so automatically I was deemed a Kappa right uh and so um it wasn’t until I was working at Express and one of the guys who worked there who was light-skinned like me I mean he was he was a decently handsome guy man I was
Like man dude I you know guys appreciate other guys and there’s no sensitivity to it the guy the guy was all right so I was like bro you must be a capital and he looked at me and said no I’m a sigma and I said what he was like well think
About what Sigma means Sigma means the sum of all you don’t have to look one way to be in our organization and he just blew my mind with that he he blew my mind with that and um you know I started my journey for Sigma so
Um that that’s how I got the sigma and uh I’m I’m happy I’m happy I I made this decision I love that thank you we are all uh Pentecostal Children of the church up here tonight so I’m very happy and excited let why not watch Pastor Johnson
Now okay because you know we we can go all right um no I’m very excited to have you all on here and to hear you all stories um about how and sort of why you chose your particular organizations I do think that one of the questions that I asked
On Facebook just to try and get some engagement and get some people interested in the conversation was you know if I were to pledge a sorority which one do you think I would and it’s interesting always interesting to hear the comments because I think sometimes we um sometimes we assume things based on
Personality types that we think belong in each of the organizations and so I do want to ask a bit of a question about that how do you all like when people when you talk to folks about the fact that you were going to be joining these organizations what were their reactions
Like were people supportive were people just like nope like you going to hell and um so TK can we start with you with that question when you first decided that this is what you wanted to do what were the reactions to people well here’s the reaction I didn’t tell anyone um
I will share though that um my whole life most people thought once I you know started becoming uh very attached and involved um in church setting my own pathway most people thought I would be an AKA in the Church of God in Christ globally was shocked when I um uh you know shared
With the world in January the night that I crossed that I crossed blue and white uh they couldn’t believe I was a Zeta and so I never shared with anybody that I was doing this in fact I mean I’m telling you the the world was like it
Was they were just so they were turned on their axes to know that I pledged Zeta but um I pledged in that sense because of the fact that um I really did believe in their core values and it just fit for me it fit for me
Um I didn’t see it as a personality I didn’t see it as a look and I know there’s a whole lot of things out there even on social media that shares like what a um you know what a person looks like inside of these sororities and what their personality types are I didn’t
Share it with anyone in fact uh I will I will take this time right now to tell you that when I called home I called home with a sense of fear I mean I am grown I pay my own cell phone bill I do a whole lot of things by myself
Um I am married and I called home with this sense of um fear all to find out um that you know as I as I knew the Lord was with me and I’m being very serious here I knew the Lord was with me in this decision because it was he and I
Um I didn’t share this with anyone I did this um almost undercover because I didn’t want anyone to know that I was um pledging um and I went through this entire process by myself I didn’t know anyone in my family who had pledge um in fact because my father was a
Preacher and a pastor and I had not heard anything good about sororities or fraternities um I I didn’t want to disappoint them I didn’t want to bring a sense of shame on them and again you all understand I crossed in 2020. so I’m well involved in the church I’m I’m ingrained I’m
Ingratiated I’m stable uh I’m not doing this out of a sense of rebellion you know how we got tattoos and got the second piercing he was like now see I I told you I can do it on my own I didn’t do this out of that that type of
Attitude but when I did call home and I expressed to my parents that I was not asking their permission to join a sorority I was letting them know that I would be Crossing and what that entailed guess what I found out oh you find it all out go ahead I found out
That my mother pledged Zeta stop it stop what this time I’m going through this by myself I went and I shared now with the the chapter president and I said my mother is a Zeta like what does that mean for me and she says what that means
Is that you are Legacy yeah so besides the dove meaning that the spirit of the Lord reigns with data um besides all of that I knew then when she mentioned the word legacy she says you know there are some things that you don’t even have to do
Because you are Legacy what is your mother’s name you know she started gathering information and I found out that this preacher this pastor this this guy I’d been living with all of my life um now he shares that he was getting ready to cross Phi Beta Sigma and uh was not allowed to
Because of the church and so I started finding these things out then I found out my aunt was a Zeta these were things that we never talked about and because I grew up in the military and traveled all over and did not have that level of um immediate family connectivity and I was
Not raised as Pastor said I was not raised around the traditional African-American culture I was not raised around that um I didn’t have an understanding I didn’t know that these were conversations that were necessary to have so when I announced to my parents in 2019 uh December of 2019 that I would
Be Crossing January the 20th and I started having these conversations I knew that this is where I really needed to be so had I went a different way because somebody else said this is the profile you fit and I knew you know at that point it was solidified for me that
State is where I needed to be but that’s my story I’m happy to um to to that I pledge uh that way graduate chapter and now I brought my sister in so yeah I’m like on that path of rebellion I want everybody to be everybody’s going business everybody I
Don’t care I don’t care if you preaching singing praying look Valerie Daniel said I preach I teach I sing I shout if you do it you can be a Xavier listen right so all I’m saying is is that um you have to stick with your conviction and you
Cannot you cannot go as Pastor said with that typical um profile or or that you know that thing personality or or look to say this is where I belong and this is what I’m supposed to be listen I know the akas are the pretty girls I know these Deltas
Are stepping high in those in that red but I do know one thing Zetas know how to bring it we just know how to do it and I you know listen I’m on that path death to tell the world that we know how to blaze the pattern we know how to
Trailblaze and so we are here and I love what I did decide uh to do so that’s really how I I got here so you just like completely blew my mind about the fact that like both of your parents your mother pledged father was getting ready
To cross like that just but I had heard it preached against all of my life so yes here it not being talked about in the best way right yeah was really why that sense of fear um was there to share that with my parents because again I’m not doing this
Out of a sense of rebellion I’m not 19 I’m not running away from home I’m not trying to do something that somebody told me not to do I’m doing something now with Consciousness it’s a it’s a conscious decision and because of that Consciousness I still want to protect my
My my parents I want to protect my positioning and what I bring even in the church sector you know and not that I thought I would lose a position it really you know positions are not that that huge for me but I didn’t want to bring any shame or any embarrassment on
Anybody but I wanted to I I I really wanted to do this so yeah I like I said as I researched for the bad I found the good in what sororities actually brought so yeah I love that um Pastor Johnson let’s go to you next when you decided that this is the path
That you wanted to take what you wanted to do did you share with anyone if you did what was sort of the feedback or when you crossed you know did the folks that were of the Christian mindset have anything to say what was your experience like yeah no I appreciate that and I
Appreciate the energy that TK is bringing to this conversation I really do because I think we need more energy inside not just Zeta but I’m sure like all of us need to have that that energy that I think and that passion that she’s has about her organization
Um I mean so for me my brother we’re nine years apart and he grad he went to Berkeley College of Music in Boston and you know my brother was the rebel like he was the the but I shouldn’t say a rebel but he created his own path
Right and my brother grew up playing drums in church and he got a you know he was just one of the baddest drummers to come out of like New England right he um got a free ride to college to Berkeley College of Music um toured with pink and 98 Degrees and
Joe and uh Jessica like toured all these different places but when he would come home from school I noticed he had a brand on his arm and I was just so intrigued I was like yo what what is that he’s like yo you ain’t ready for that bro you know again
We’re nine years apart so he already knew how he was raised he was like no no don’t even go home and talk about it so forth and so on because again we grew up in a very very traditional Apostolic Pentecostal church right and so um my first the person I talked to was
Was him um but I already knew what I was gonna get with him he’s gonna say go do it you know forget all that go go do it um but when when I it is most interesting the church I was youth pastor at in Columbia South Carolina one of the the
Um young people in the Youth Department one of the leaders was a sigma and invited me in right and this is from church right like this is a youth leader that’s that was under me at the time um but older than me it was a weird situation
Um and it invited me in in the most in the most loving and and caring way and it was you know my experience just was I’m not gonna say it was easy but it was certainly an experience um I mean once I started looking at Greek letter organizations I started to realize that
There were a lot more Bishops and elders and apostles that that were in these organizations that never talked about it like they never came to the international conventions with their Greek attire owner you know and it’s just in private conversation you know Apostle so-and-so was a capitalist you
Know you know um you know a bishop so-and-so was an Omega you know mother so and so was a AKA like and it’s kind of like you know like what what’s up with that but then again I realized where I was you know I realized that you know According to some
Of our traditional Doctrine right um I should say man-made Doctrine sometimes but um some of our Doctrine uh it just wasn’t allowed to be talked about so well I I really didn’t have a network I really didn’t have uh but the gentleman who who brought me in from the church
Um to talk about it but once I crossed over I wrote my eyes opened up to everyone who who was in it did people treat me funny no because I’m like I’m a leader I know I’m a leader so the first thing I did was come to my International
Church convention and created a group me group chat I found every divine nine young person that was hiding invited him into a group chat and what I did was when we would you know like right right now I’m in Baltimore at our youth International youth convention but
Typically what I would do is invite them to do a community service project together right like let’s wear our shirts let’s represent all our organizations and let’s find some place in the city where we can where we can give back and then when we started doing that you
Started to see all of the older people say oh girl you know I’m at you know I’m gonna say that you know like like we busted a a pipe you know of Freedom you know so now you know when I come to the conferences it like I’m
Not going to say I made it cooler dude but I think we collectively said that we’re tired of this and we’re not about to be the generation that’s about to hide our letters and so you know this week you know uh tomorrow I plan on
Wearing my my Zeta I mean my Sigma um paraphernalia just to start the conference off right just so out the gate if it’s a young people conference young people need to see responsible uh people in these black Greek letter organizations and not what the Miss like the myths that we’re being told
Yeah I love that um thank you for sharing that I think it’s really important for our young people to kind of see that you know the generation before us is like you know you don’t go to the movies you don’t wear pants in church you don’t do this don’t do that
And now our generation is kind of like actually you know some of this stuff is not really in the Bible some of it you know whatever um and so I love that you are talking about kind of connecting the younger generation to um organizations and allowing them to feel seen even
Um you know maybe previously they weren’t feeling seen or that sort of thing so I really appreciate that Chantel let’s go to you because you I think are the new so um AJ let me ask you how long have you been part of Phi Beta Sigma
Man you’re gonna make me feel like it it like the deer is just kind of like go you know it’s the beginning okay guys yeah yeah I I um I call it far oh great fall away okay so I’m about 13 years 13 years in the organization gotcha okay and so um we
Know that Chantal you are the newest on here you just celebrated or we’ll be celebrating your Delta bursary one year um one year okay I know right I was like this is just such great timing um can you just share about your experience you know deciding to pledge
And kind of what that was like if you had conversations with people or when you cross kind of what were some of the comments and conversations that people had for you absolutely so yes I am the Neo of the bunch um and I absolutely um talked discreetly to women that I
Trusted so I had the benefit of having some wonderful mentors in my life um there were already members of Delta Sigma Theta sorority and so they were very helpful because again we all talked about how we were raised in the church you know and so for all of my life I
Heard the same things that everyone else has said I heard that that’s not what we do you know you’re part of the church and that’s enough for you right so I heard all of that um but as getting older and having these mentors that were in the church that
Were a part of Greek letter organizations I had conversations like look y’all I I didn’t live save this long to get this far in and mess up like I absolutely my goal in life is to please God that is number one um and I don’t want to do anything that
Would be go against that and so I have very real open honest conversations and I’m so grateful for the women that I talk to to say hey um let me know listen y’all this is what I want to do um I am invested I am dedicated this is
What I want to do and they were like we got you go for it you gonna be all right and we wouldn’t let you do anything that would lead you the wrong way um and so I appreciated that um openness I appreciated that honesty I appreciated the support and the genuine
Care for my soul first um and so I am grateful that uh we hear all these secret sorority things you know the secret things but I am grateful for being a part of an organization that really stands on what it says that we are founded on Christian principles and
We stand on that and we pray and we intercede for each other and we provide service in our communities and and we we are Advocates of change Delta means change and so we’re out here doing the work and not just talking about it but standing on that and being change agents
Um and so I’m I’m really grateful for that um experience I am grateful for my process I’m grateful for the women the 78 other women that I joined the organization with and yes we celebrate it on Sunday one year in Delta land congratulations I love that that’s awesome congratulations again
Um I want to ask you all this question what are two things uh that Christians who are opposed to fraternities and sororities get wrong about these organizations I know a lot of times when we’ve talked a little bit about this earlier you know it’s demonic there’s idol worship we’ll talk about the
Branding and The Hazing um so actually I’ll start with Pastor Johnson first with this question it is on the screen there and if you are watching or just tuning in this is uh dig deep conversations with Christian leaders I am your host Dr Teresa all Joe tonight we are talking about finding the
Divine in the divine nine really giving a chance for Christian leaders who are active in Black Greek letter organizations an opportunity to share their perspectives and their experiences as I hope to bring some wisdom and shed some light onto some things that I feel are misconceptions about Greek black
Greek letter organization so Pastor John let’s go to you first for this next question absolutely and I’m going to ask everybody that’s watching to share I’ll be hit that share button share it share it share it share it like please just share this conversation um because uh it’s it’s it’s important
Uh what are two things Christians who are opposed to fraternities and sororities get wrong about these organizations um one I think it’s the whole secret society thing because I’ve met some some church organizations and denominations that’s way more Secret uh and way more like insulated than a lot of fraternities and sororities right
Um you know the church has this uh Country Club thing going on so it like it kind of reminds me just on a deeper level but anyway um I think they get wrong as the secret society part I mean granted you have your your lbs and your ls’s that you
Build you know you take time to build relationships with um but it’s you know they’re they’re there are no secrets if you go to the website any organization’s website and you and you read you you on you you’ll you’ll get a clear understanding of what each organization is about
Um and so you know when people say it’s a secret I I’m still trying to figure out what the secret is I mean certainly there’s you know secret handshakes and greetings but you know I don’t see any I mean that’s no different than walking up to somebody
Saying praise the Lord right like you know if you know you know and you’ll know you’ll say praise the Lord back you know um so you know for me it’s um you know the one thing is just the myth of the the secrecy the other thing about it is
Um what I think people don’t understand that I think they should is like how much money these organizations actually raise the support Community efforts uh it’s it’s it’s admirable um they think it’s just a party so the first thing I would say just to answer
Your question is one is the myths of the secrets and two is they think it’s just a party organization and um you know we we do more than just party I I mean I’m not gonna lie I like a good party myself man I don’t like to
Be around that folks okay you know yeah I don’t like being around dead folks man like um but no I mean as much socializing as organization these organizations do they probably spend the most money on scholarships they probably spend the most community service time they probably spend the most uh black dollar initiatives
Um and then then anyone thinks or gives credit to so the first I would say is the myths of the secrets and two uh the partying aspect but there’s really a giving back aspect that people really don’t get a chance to see unless they’re close to it
Yeah I think a lot of people um or at least in my experience you know if you’re the way you’re introduced to Black Greek letter organizations is kind of what you think unless if you know people um or do sort of your own research and so as an undergrad like yeah parties all
The time you know um but not necessarily knowing about the philanthropy Behind these organizations about the scholarship and how you know just from my own research um these organizations really do push students college students or those individuals who are going back to school that sort of thing and help financially
And not just in college but also in other areas of life and so that’s something that I found to be incredibly interesting and then also as you said it’s not a secret society um you know I was sharing earlier there was a question last week about that the
Question was phrased um where it said you know the required hazing and the guests that I had on were quick to dispel that rumor um that you know hazing is not require there are policies against hazing and sure enough as I went onto the websites
That sort of thing I was able to see you know the anti-hazing policy and here’s how you can report something like that and so for me that was just very eye-opening um so Chantelle let’s go to you for the same question here um what are two things Christians who
Are opposed to learn these and sororities have been wrong about these organizations Um I’m gonna start with um the the the myth that it’s something demonic or uh against the word of God um in being involved in Greek letter organizations um and I think that a lot of people don’t understand that at the time that all of our organizations were founded
Um the the Bible Christian principles were words significant parts of founding these organizations like you will definitely hear prayer you definitely will have um chaplains councils in our organizations you definitely will have preachers pastors missionaries leaders in these organizations um and so founding on Christian principles we we all have
Um that foundation and our our organizations were very much Community Based leaders in the community fighting for the freedoms that we often take for granted um you know one of the first organized movements that Delta Sigma Theta did was marched in the suffrage march to promote voting rights for women
And so I think that we have to make sure that as we’re talking again there are books there’s websites you can about it you can do your research um but it’s it’s not demonic and um we absolutely believe the Bible we absolutely believe in God believe in
Jesus and and we stand on it and so I I think that is one thing that we need to dispel as we talk about those myths a little not demonic and then you mentioned a lot of the community where Community activism um that not just your organization but
All the organizations absolutely as well TK let’s go to you for this question what are your thoughts on two things that Christians who are opposed to fraternities and sororities get wrong about these organizations um well I’m going to take a turn in the conversation on that um I won’t talk
About it more from a church perspective more than I will just talk about it from a uh perhaps a an either cultural or just um our perception uh perspective and that is having to accept things that you normally would not accept um you know as a Christian that you’re having to somehow
Um bow down and be inside of these um you know accepting values that you just really do not accept and so I feel like you don’t have to do that you don’t have to change your personality you don’t have to change what you bring to the
Table you don’t have to shift what you believe you don’t have to just start accepting things because those are things that are supported perhaps by that organization you make a choice you are part of that organization just like you’re a part of anything else um there are things that are accepted
Even in our in our job organizations and those systematic processes uh we may not totally agree with them but it does not stop you from going to work and clocking in it just stops you now from involving or engaging yourself in those particular um activities so it’s a choice now what
You engage in because the world now is just super colorful the world is colorful so you cannot go in I cannot go in with a a very close coded perspective like this is the tradition this is what I believe listen there are things that have to be supported there are things
That have to be talked about because we are now talking to the world about world issues so um I know what I stand for I know what I believe I know in whom I believe but I cannot um close my mind to the idea that some of these other topics that are um
Somewhat controversial or bring challenge to us as traditional Pentecostals I cannot close my mind to the idea that that will not be something that I won’t have to take on so I think it’s just like you know if you decide to work in politics or you um you know you
Have to take on issues that they will challenge your level of tradition they will challenge what you know and what you stand on but you have to be clear about the choices you make and the things that you uh involve yourself in so one of those um things is is definitely having to
Change your whole perspective and when you come out somehow you know you’re you’re not going to be saved or you’re not going to have the heart for god um no as grown people let me just let me just stop there let’s not talk about salvation we’re not going to talk about
Being full of the Holy Ghost um we’re not going to talk about just having this pure mind all day long we’re just talking about human beings as a conscious individual walking in this earth you make decisions about things that you involve yourself in for engagement purposes period so
Um I just think that we have to be you know lifted above the idea that um you have to change who you are no I show up in all of my authenticity who I am I bring all of that to my sorority but there are things that I’m asked to
Be a part of that go against what I bring to the table guess what I bow out gracefully I know how to not put judgment on another person I know how to not make people feel guilty for the choices that they are making because they too have opinions
Um I am not all right and um they are not all wrong some of the things that I I choose not to involve myself and it’s not that it’s wrong right let me just say I’ll just say if it’s a jazz brunch I just know that my conviction may not
Be for me to sit in that environment but what they’re doing is not wrong right I know that when I’m in a set a setting and I’m there with my sisters of z5b and they you know they start scrolling it’s my choice maybe not to participate in
That because y’all have phones and y’all are screenshot in church and so y’all like sending stuff you know I have to make choices in those moments what we’re doing is not wrong right that’s what you have to you have to be um settled in the idea that there’s a
Level of maturity that comes along with choices I love that shoes um you allow not just grace of God to help you in that but you choose that based on just a natural level of Consciousness right right right yeah but but let juvenile come on right now I right now
You know wait wait a minute what okay you know that’s good decision with that conscious decision let me just share right here in this space with that particular conscious decision you shake hands with the consequence so whatever it is you decide that you’re going to do you’ve already come into Covenant relationship
With the consequence of that particular decision yes yeah that’s good that’s good juvenile comes on now and I just want to risk it all and I go for what I know if the song comes on and I go for what I know and I decide to risk it all guess
What I come into Covenant relationship with that decision right right right that’s good that’s really good that’s a word right there that’s a word I told you Pastor Johnson this is what we do okay it’s a word right there y’all got some Heavy Hitters on here all right
Project women we don’t play all right um but no I I love that because it’s you know last week my guest talked about it is a personal conviction and so for some people if you are convicted about if you’re going back and forth you know should I pledge should I not pledge that
Sort of thing if you feel convicted not to that’s your personal conviction and you know um if it doesn’t mean that you have to agree with everything that happens within the organization or the chapter even um so we shared a lot about that and it’s a personal thing just like
Salvation you know you have personal conviction some people are convicted by things that I might not be convicted by and vice versa um and you have to figure out what works for you um and so I really appreciate that you shared that TK um can you all share with me as we are
Coming to the end of our conversation can you also share with me maybe one of your favorite experiences um since becoming a member of your particular organization Chantel I’ll start with you first because you are again uh the Newbie here so can you just share with me one of your favorite
Experiences since becoming um a Delta um so many already in one year um but I will say that I am a member of the Chicago metropolitan alumni chapter and we I am a member of the inaugural line and so being the first line to come through the chapter is of course record-breaking
Um and to share that moment has been amazing um and so my chapter constantly is breaking the internet and so I love it I I love sharing that experience um but more personally I experienced a loss last year and just the experience of my 78 sisters um calling texting sending stuff being
There showing up in ways that I never could imagine I definitely have regular I have you know natural siblings but that addition to my life has been amazing in ways that I could never have imagined I love that hold on so so what number were you I am
Number three on my line in traffic okay single numbers all right oh I forgot okay so earlier Pastor Johnson mentioned lbs and L s’s can you just explain what that is for those of us myself that don’t really know yeah you know Line brothers uh are the
People that you walk through the process with and lying sisters or the uh the folks that you walk through you know their process with and that’s probably the tightest groups you’ll see in the organ in every potential organizations is um are the lines um but yeah that’s probably the tightest
You’ll see in the organization on the line brothers and mine sisters and so what’s like the significance with the number because I know some folks are like oh like you’re a number two Deuce deuce like that sort of thing like what’s the significance with the numbers
As well I don’t know you got to join to find out that’s why I’m gonna say that you got to join and find out you you got you got to pay the money that unpaid to be a part of this organization was going to be very very nice and I was
Going to share that but perhaps I’d have to uh Reserve that commentary for another time okay all right well I appreciate it no I know talking about no secrets all right no yeah yeah yeah yeah we have some yeah you got to join it’s just like you know yeah
You know you can’t go to the church and I ask for the balance statement man you got to be another man fair enough fair enough Pastor Johnson let’s hear from you about your favorite experience since becoming a part of Phi Beta Sigma all right so my favorite experience
Um probably has you know one was Crossing into the organization um the second would be meeting Congressman John Lewis um when I graduated college and moved to DC I had an opportunity to um meet with him and he had a he had like a thing where he hired sigmas
And so I had like I I almost had a job at like in his office before my dad got sick and had to come home to Connecticut and uh you know take care of the church and take care of him but um my favorite moment was just leaving him hearing the stories
Of Selma hearing the stories of how he you know just the stories of how he went into Congress and like that that was probably one of my favorite favorite moments is meeting Congressman John Lewis yeah that’s amazing truly amazing and awesome um TK let’s go to you for our final
Question one of our final questions for the evening your favorite part about being part of the illustrious Zeta five beta well um it is just being able to come in and offer what I bring um a very reserved uh in any space that I show up in first and uh one of the
Primary things that kind of stood out for me was um during 2020 I we still had to have Founders Day and things of that nature but we were um not knowing that we were going to be going into a pandemic so 2020 um we started this journey
Um my birthday was in February I had a book signing um and it was my sorority sisters um not the mother’s board not the I’m not gonna go no further my sorority sisters that showed up to Barnes and Noble let me just let me just say that
Um and I’m just being very honest they showed up and it was like they brought people and I’m not from the place that I live in so I have no family here I have no family here in the city at all so you you can almost imagine how difficult
That is when you’re when you’re trying to do something new when you’re when you need that level of support um and to have my line sisters show up in the way that they did for me Crossing honestly January um in in 2020 my birthday was eight days
After we crossed so for them to crowd out Barnes and Noble the way that they did um and people are trying to figure out who is the person that they’re trying to show up for I’m nobody I’m like literally nobody but the way they showed
Up was in in just such a spectacular way it really truly blew my mind because I I have to just be very candid here I had not seen support like that um in any other area so I’m I’m being very gracious when I share that because we
Are all um you know our family is church that’s all we know that’s all we have um and and there are times you know yeah you you do get you know you you do get a little weary um and people do get tired of you people
Get sick of you um you know launching stuff they do they don’t want to keep seeing you dig deep okay straight right back let me let me calm down and come back but they don’t want to see you dig deep no you know the deeper you dig uh
The more stuff you’re coming out with you know you flashing and you’re you’re launching and you’re trying to do what you they get sick of you yeah so um you know it wanes on the people that you are consistently saying hey here I go again I’m doing something else and you don’t
Buy my bracelet buy my candy bar buy my book um and they’re the ones supporting you but I had not seen that level of support um on that type of you know that I had and so I’m just being very honest about that and the church has been kind to me
Trust me they have but I’m just talking about in in a moment of not knowing people and not them not knowing me me not knowing them eight days later somebody saw on social media that I was having a book signing I didn’t pass out any cards I didn’t say hey come somebody
Saw it and I and I started seeing them come in and I’m just thinking like to myself how did they find out that I was here and it was just the most unimaginable uh level of support that I had not seen from people let me say it like this from
People who did not know me yeah yeah anyone so outside of just you know Sisterhood and being on the line together My Lying sister showed up for me the ls’s they came out um and then moving and progressing um after hitting the pen endemic and then
Being able to in 21 really assist for Founders Day on a virtual platform and helping you know being able to you know help where I I could help was very um was was very it was powerful for me um and so I’m always I’m just always so intrigued when I’m in that space
Um because it’s different I I am a Church Girl I am a true church girl to heart so to be in an organization um that when I show up I show up to a church but there are no drums and there are no there’s not enough I’m like wait a minute
Um we’re missing praise and worship but we’re really not um you know it’s a it’s different for me and so it’s a challenge I have to say that it is a challenge for me to be a part of something that stretches TK outside of her natural comfort zone and
That’s really really what I found to be in in being a part of a sorority is and that’s a favorite for me because it stretches me so far out of the norm of what I’m used to right it places me into this dimension of difference right right
Right so being able to I’ve heard you know all three of you are sharing about the community that you’ve built uh within the organization but then also you know stretching you sharing um helping you all to kind of figure out different ways of growth um you know and and that feels very
Important to me um so thank you all for sharing I I appreciate your transparency um as we get ready to wrap up because we have reached our one hour mark I just want to quickly ask everyone if you all could just give me one quick takeaway that you would want those who are
Watching live those who will watch the replay if you’re watching the replay make sure that you use the hashtag replay and then this gets uh this episode gets converted into a podcast episode as well so if you’re listening via the pop cast what’s one takeaway that you want folks that are listening
To have from this conversation and then also how can people stay connected with you if people have um questions just about anything that you all have shared if you are open to answering those questions please just let us know how we can stay connected to you if you Pastor Johnson if you could
Type any of your contact information that you want shared in the private chat and we’ll just post that um up so we’ll actually have you go last Pastor Johnson TK why don’t we start with you one quick takeaway and then how you want folks to connect with you
Takeaway is be yourself if being a part of a fraternity or a sorority is something that you would like to be a part of I would first say pray seek the Lord for the direction of that and do not just join so that you can wear fabulous sweaters and big letters
Things of that nature because a lot of people join for that reason I would say join knowing that you are a part of something bigger than yourself and offer yourself to the community um if you are embedded in church still be that person bring translate all
Of that over into the community be the philanthropist be the person that people can look up to be the light and be authentic in your decision stick to that you may not do what I did you may not share you know you you may choose to
Share with others I chose not to but I chose not to share with others so that those could provide the ear muffs and the earplugs that I needed as I went through that process on my own that was a personal Journey it was a personal choice so I would say if that’s
Something that you want to pursue pursue and ask God answered David you shall recover all so be that person go out there you can uh connect with me on www.workingwiththedash.com and I also have a non-profit organization and I also have the first period chapter in the city of Memphis Tennessee where we
Do help young women and women at large we advocate for period poverty and so um I am that individual here in the city and I’m grateful to have that um opportunity and so connect with me for a consultation um you know I’m an author things of that
Nature a podcaster but I love this platform and thank you so much for having me thank you thank you thank you so much I love the work that you’re doing I’m so so excited to see what you come up with next and thank you so much again for sharing your experiences your transparency
Um I just am so blown away tonight’s conversation was amazing Chantel let’s go to you next what’s one takeaway and then how can folks stay connected with you um my takeaway would be if you are looking at any organization be ready to serve because that is what it’s all about
Um I think that as TK said that we we think about wearing the colors wearing the letters um wrapping your organization but we should really be thinking about the work of the organization and the mission and so that is where we want to focus and I I
Um oftentimes hear so much about the competition and the comparisons but you know TK is one of my best girlfriends and so it’s never competition it’s always celebration it is always respect it’s always Sisterhood um and so I want people to keep that in mind we wear different colors but we
Love each other so much um and we support each other so much um and so keep that in mind it’s about service and Sisterhood at the end of the day I love that I love it it’s a larger Sisterhood it’s just more than um than you know what colors you’re rocking what
Letters you’re rocking It’s a larger Sisterhood and I absolutely love that thank you so much how can we stay connected with you oh go to my website uh seebiddingstherapy.com you can also follow me on all social media platforms at uh Chantel biddings lcpc or C biddings therapy love it love it love it
Thank you again so much for coming on and sharing with me Pastor Johnson we’re going to finish with you uh one takeaway how we can connect with you and then if you would do us the honor of saying a word of prayer before we end for the evening
No doubt uh my one takeaway is find an organization um that you identify with right find an organization that you identify with and go hang out with those people because just because you like the colors you may not like the people okay you know I’ll tell you that all right so
Make sure don’t just see the colors and just go gun hold um into an organization but find something that you identify with again with me with Sigma here’s something I didn’t say with Sigma is that one of the founders the most honorable London F uh Morris was uh like a dean of theology
Um you know one of our Founders was a dean of theology right like and so when when that that spoke to me on as I was in Bibles um you know theology school that one of the organ um Founders had that in mind as they were building an organization um like Sigma so
Um find an organization that you identify with um you can find me you know I as you see I have on one of my hats I’m actually down here in Baltimore vending and doing a bunch of stuff at the youth conference but I’m just a psycho entrepreneur
Um but uh you can uh follow if you want some cool hats like this or some cool women’s hats oh you can go to www.ww brothers johnson1929.com and if you’re on Instagram you can follow me at AJ for the city if your old geezer like myself and you’re still on Facebook
Um because the Young Folks like we don’t use Facebook no more um but if you’re on Facebook just Aj Johnson um and I just want to say to you Dr um so uh one it was a pleasure meeting you at my wife’s 40 in the 40. yes celebration
And it’s just been an honor to follow your work and it’s been an honor to be on this platform with you um sharing your vision um and connecting people and digging deep and so I certainly wanna honor that and recognize that and um you know there
Is a Zeta chapter in uh Stanford and what you know in Connecticut that you can be a part of I will be sure to connect you with uh The Zeta chapter in Connecticut uh just so you can just meet them just so you can meet them I’m not
Saying you should join I think you should just meet them you know everything starts with a relationship but with that being that being said um let us bow our heads in a word of prayer Heavenly Father before we ask you for anything we just want to thank you for
Everything we want to thank you for this conversation we want to thank you for those that are listening that may have been in spiritual conflict around divine nine organizations Lord our hope is tonight that we have spoken Clarity that we’re not in a secret society that we’re
Not doing things that doesn’t please God and I would like to just thank our sister tonight TK for raising that we have choices to participate in what we want to participate in and so Lord we always choose you first and so we thank you for every blessing cover us and keep us
Now let the words of my mouth and in meditations in my heart be acceptable and I say oh Lord my strength and My Redeemer in Christ’s name I pray amen amen thank you all so much all right so as you are connecting with folks I’m
Going to send my guests to the back you all are welcome to hang out we can chit chat afterwards you all can connect with one another um if not thank you so much for tuning in um I want to make sure that I just give a couple of quick announcements here so
Connect with me on Facebook or Instagram Sharia C aldra on all social media platforms I do like the young people have a tick tock so you can follow me on Tick Tock as well shout out to The Tick Tock Generation Um also if you want to connect uh you
Can log into my website sign up for email alerts I do an email blast once a month just some updates newsletters um all about having an intentional being intentional about deepening your relationship with God that’s what dig deep is all about um I want to share with y’all that next
Week is our final episode in this series finding the Divine in the divine nine and I have to share who will be coming on so I have from Alpha Phi Alpha Reverend Elijah Oliver senior and from Alpha Kappa Alpha Dr Carla T Galbraith I’m so so so excited about this conversation
Um I cannot wait to share with these individuals they are again Christian leaders and active in their uh fraternities and sororities that is on next Wednesday at 8pm Eastern Standard Time uh I hope you all enjoyed the conversation thank you for tuning in if it’s your first time I hope to see you
Again on next Wednesday thank you again to my guests and have a great rest of your week I’ll see you right here next Wednesday
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