Welcome back to another episode of the born Mogul podcast where we help men we are here become more effective exceptional and extraordinary and we speak about the 6f method the pillars Family Faith Fitness fashion Focus finance and finance that’s the last one and today we have a man of I would say
He’s multifaceted he has a few different of the pillars but we’re going to speak about faith family Finance in particular we have one of my Great Brothers Here Kevin Wiggins he is a a husband he’s a father a man of Faith he’s a former Collegiate athlete uh he’s an
Entrepreneur how you doing bro good man thanks for having me here man I appreciate welcome brother welcome welcome welcome welcome welcome Lamont how you feeling I’m feeling good man I’m feeling good bro like I like I like the way the podcast is going we got what
Four or five episodes in um and bro I love the feedback I love what we got going on here man so I’m excited we’ve had some great feedback but I mean I think that’s based upon like we’ve had great guests so far right so it’s like
You know I’m just kind of I’m just kind of here but everybody else is like they’re giv us such great knowledge and today we have a very very spectacular man I mean I respect a whole lot I mean I love very very much and I’m looking to
Digging into his story yeah and just speaking to him about several different things so Kevin I want to talk about being a a black father I want to talk about being an entrepreneur about being a husb hband I want to talk about your background about some experiences you
Had as a child and you having a very very present father and how that’s affected you as a man and how you father your child now so let’s get into it man so yeah let’s take us back to the young Kevin right and I got to call him Kevin
Right now because we’re being professional because I know him as something else I I know something else no you know because he is my brother in cap office aternity and so we go back uh almost 10 years now coming up this year so uh you know this
Is a man that I met when I was 20 years old I think and we joined together and uh you know I love him very much man but I got to call I got to call him Kevin or Mr Wiggins on the podcast go wi
Man Mr wigg is dead right take us back to your childhood where are you from so originally I’m from Newport News um shout out bad yes sir so uh I actually grew up in a military home father was uh in the Army for 22 years um so I was
Born in Colorado moved out here um and then you know fortunately I didn’t have to have the life of moving around as a military child so that was a great benefit um you know establishing relationships so on and so forth down in Newport News um but yeah so I grew up
Majority I would say I was out here since I was like three two or three years old okay um so yeah so Newport News is pretty much all I know so you don’t know much of Colorado n not at all I want to get back out there but yeah
That was that was like that’s a destination spot for me man yeah yeah definitely Colorado yeah Colorado I’m trying to I’m trying to get there later on in life I heard I heard it’s beautiful out there so we got a few I guess a couple Brothers out there well yeah Justin
Still out there I think uh so we got one out there still yeah so that’s what’s up man born and raised in Newport News basically yep so um you know what I’m saying went to uh school all down in Newport News uh element elementary through high school um and then you know
Most of my life I well I wouldn’t say most like half of my life lived on base so like I was saying part of a military home my dad was in the military um and my mom you know she was um a spouse in the military so if you don’t know
Anything about being a spouse in the military you really can’t have those jobs that are concrete because the military can say you know you got to go at any time so yeah growing up you know um I would say you know I had a really good childhood um even if we struggled
My parents did a great job and you know not making letting me and my sister see kind of concealing it yeah yeah yeah you know I remember my parents of course um I remember my parents both of them working two jobs but at the time I didn’t you
Know all that that was going on so you know um they provided for us you know I’m I’m blessed and thankful for that um real quick I’m sorry so for for perspective for people who aren’t from Virginia Newport News we got Alan Iverson Michael Vic um we got Al war
From Chesapeake but it’s only 20 30 minutes away yeah we got Ronald Curry Ronald Curry that’s right Ronald Curry also prel Whitaker who was very very um legendary boxer yeah so we got some talent in VA man we got some Talent especially in this in the 757 for sure
For sure defitely yeah yeah okay so so growing up with your father who was he a career military man yeah yeah so he joined the military straight out of high school at 18 um you know met my mom um few years after that down in North Carolina when he was stationed there um
So they did a lot of bouncing around um like I said pretty much they went from uh where my dad’s from originally in Omaha Nebraska um then went to North Carolina they’ve been to Germany they’ve been to you know Colorado so on and so
Forth um but yeah grew up uh you know a good amount of my time in Newport News uh dad was in the military majority of that time once he retired in I think like 2004 we moved off base um so then that’s when I kind of got a taste of the
Life of the civilian life as I like to call it you know um cuz before then all I really knew was that military lifestyle um you know being on base and so where yall at for uses yeah for y y it’s what joint based Lang eust now um
But yeah so after we moved off there that was kind of like a a culture shock a little bit um because when you’re on base you’re around a certain group of people obviously everybody’s in the military so everybody’s accustomed to that type of living or that type of
Upbringing um but when you move off base you know you got people from all over um and it’s a Melting Pot especially in Newport News as news is different yeah yeah so it’s people from all over so um that was definitely you know a culture shock but you know I think my upbringing
Also helped me with that um to be able to because I went to the Boys and Girls Club and so on and so forth so that helped a lot with um being able to navigate that was your father cuz I think the sense of a military male typically is like they’re very very
Strict did you have a strict father uh I wouldn’t say strict I would say structured structured okay yeah yeah yeah so um structur strict lived in a structured household um you know it was it was what was expected from you um and I guess if you you can correlate that to
The military but I think you can correlate that to life you know okay um you putting expectations and what you expect to be done or a way to do it you know in the military they have structured down to the te you know you’re waking up every day going to PT
Then you’re coming back you’re going to your job you have certain things to do certain goals to make you know with me actually working with the government and um for the federal government you know I kind of see that as well even from the civilian side just how they move which
Is different from you know how you do your job so that’s so is that what you do now yeah yeah so I I work for a DOD now you know contracts and Acquisitions yeah so um but you know we work with a lot of military so they wanted when they
Wanted you know and it has to be a certain way so I think that’s kind of the upbringing that I had I wouldn’t say it was strict but it was like ited yeah when it was structured to so as far as strict versus structured like what are
Some examp ex cuz most people I know I grew up strict mean and my mom said bro you can’t do this I mean so where you giv freedom to do certain things yeah yeah so I think strict when I think of of you know being in a strict household
It’s a lot of NOS a lot of you can’t go here you can’t do this um you know things of that aspect whereas structured is um you have guidelines to stay within um you know um so like a operating procedure yeah operating procedure you
Know you you get to um strict I I see as protected you know um not as protected as being like a father figure of parents protect more so like keep yeah yeah like you’re not going out there with them so on and so forth granted you know I had
Those times too but it was more so like make your own mistakes and learn from them you know as somebody that’s growing up because I know we’ve all seen you know when you get out into the real world a lot of people that’s lived in strict households or out yeah like
Over from there so so you know with having that structure of course I was able to fall but you knew that your parents were there you know what I’m saying to to help you when you did fall in those times so you know I I wouldn’t
Say I was like the worst kid but I wasn’t the best kid either you know I I had my mistakes um growing up but you know it was my parents there to guide me through and you know being present still you know it’s a it’s a a blessing that
They were present to you know help me navigate those scenarios so I’m sorry can I ask you this how’s your relationship with your parents oh it’s great yeah it’s yeah so that that’s one thing that I really noticed between a structured environment versus a strict environment where the relationship of a
Parent with a strict environment probably it’s either it exists but it’s not as as Bountiful as somebody who had a structur environment because like I’ve noticed with my sons and my daughter like I give them the opportunity to make mistakes and like that gives them the freedom to
Come back to me and tell me certain things that happened where when I made a mistake at my mom’s house I’m like bro she can’t find out you know what I mean like I I was too scared to even let her know what I was doing you know what I
Mean so no I think I think that’s good but go ahead go ahead yeah so I just I’m thinking about when you moved off off base how old were you when you moved off base uh I was just starting middle school so you know that was was a that
Was a a peak time you know very pivotal time yeah yeah so um just started middle School actually started a new Middle School um CU I was in like the talented and gifted program they have that in Newport News um so a lot of the friends
That I grew up with going you know to elementary school they were in another middle school so I basically had to go to a new Middle School in sixth grade um I might have knew a few people because of you know outside Sports and playing
The recck league so on and so forth yeah um but I think I probably walked in there knowing maybe two people maybe three at the most so I had to make all new friends and kind of um you know navigate my way through that so yeah I asked that question because anybody
That’s like from this area they know that Newport News is like kind of its own world right so when you go from being on base and living there for several years to now that veil of protection is gone and you’re exposed to the actual ecosystem of Newport News yeah I think
It’s a culture shock and so how did you deal with that uh I you know that’s a great question um I think I just had to pretty much navigate that myself um and kind of learn on my own you know especially in Middle School um and but like I said having that those
Relationships through Sports helped a lot you know um being on different teams and um being in different programs i p i play a basketball since I was nine so okay you know everybody wasn’t just from the military uh you know or living on base um you had people that were from
Downtown or people that were from Williamsburg or people that were from you know across the water coming together on this Melting Pot like Newport News of a basketball team and Williams is that so I play I played for Boo Williams um at the Sports plex no
This was way before the Sports plex yeah way before yeah this is when Boo Williams just was a a organization oh I got um yeah so I started playing actually started playing I want say it was 10 and under but I was eight okay so you know with me being tall and
Everything like that that kind of helped me also you know develop in basketball um but develop in relationships you know navigate and know how to intermingle with people not only people of my age but older you know kids so all my life I pretty much hung around the older kids
Okay so I think that’s kind of what helped me when I got in you know like the Middle School it was like you know I could to navigate because I was used to being around I wasn’t the shy kid that was in the corner you know I I was still
Talk and crack jokes and like to have fun and so on so forth so instead of you know people sitting over there like oh there’s the new kid pointing and stuff like that it was kind of like a oh yeah come rock with us you know what I’m
Saying and again you were talented athletically and academically too right you had both things working for you so at what age did you recognize that you were actually pretty good in basketball uh honestly it was just kind of at a young age you know it was kind of like I I I
Just gravitated towards it I always I was with my dad at the gym when he used to go play pickup when when you know when I was younger um so I was always you know trying to shoot at the goal and hanging around you know dribbling and
Stuff like that so um when I started playing rec league it was just like from there you know it was up from there um so I was always taller than everybody you know that was always an advantage too you know that kind of made you know of course if you’re you’re good at
Something your confidence grows with it as well right but like I said grow getting on that a team when I was eight you know and everybody else is 10 yeah yeah yeah but seeing that I could still you know play with them and you know
Hold my own that’s kind of when I was like all right well you know this is this is something that we can do long time was basketball your first love uh Sports wise you know I played a lot of sports growing up I played basketball baseball football so I I
Didn’t play soccer CU I was never a runner um never a runner um but actually I love baseball um when I was younger yeah okay I was I’ve heard that a lot bro I’ve heard that a lot yeah so I was a pitcher you know like in rec league um but you
Know I never really took it to the next level as far as like middle school high school but I love playing baseball when I was younger like let me ask you this man because of your height does people push you into basketball yeah most definitely definitely I think I think
Now we’re in a different time in a different space where it’s kind of like open for everybody to kind of navigate and see what you want to do yeah uh but back in that time you know you the tall’s kid either playing basketball or football you’re not really going to play
Baseball or soccer or you know even gymnastics for that sense you know what I’m saying so that was a thing um I think you know even with my dad playing basketball it was like a um uh navigate towards basketball or football type of thing so did they ever
Force well not not forc but did they ever kind of put in your head that you your father’s a successful military guy join the military nah no you know my dad always told me especially you know being in the Army he was saying um you know
You’re free to do what you want to do you know make your life decisions and he always told me like if you do join the military don’t join the Army like he was like like join the AR join the Air Force of the Navy hey my brother said the same
He Army yeah yeah he been at four uses for almost 20 years yeah yeah so you know I think it’s different people’s perspectives or you know of course their experience but yeah my dad was like nah if you going to do this like Air Force
Or navy okay don’t do the Army but yeah my dad he wasn’t real big on like go to the to the um military you know it I think they both of my parents they wanted big for me and my sister you know can can I ask a question real quick so
With you being the new kid on a block right and you not being shy and and wanting to interact with other kids like how did that help you as an adult in regards to networking that’s a great question oh yeah that’s a really good question um that honestly it was kind of
Like the uh start of being an extrovert you know back then getting that experience um you know the friends that crack jokes and you got to have tough skin um I mean funny enough enough I almost got expelled in middle school because of jokes that me yeah so so were
You bro you’re the big guy were you the bully n no actually actually no like that’s that’s the what the opposite of okay good I think because I was tall and uh you know back then I was in my uh what they used to call the Husky days
Husy remember if you were husky you were Hush Puppies as a kid remember the hush puppies I did not wear Hush Puppies I ain’t going to hold you on that I did not wear hush puppies but uh yeah so you know I was like the tallest kid and like
I said today’s world is different and you know with me having a daughter now is I talk to my wife about this all the time because she’s tall too you know with both of us growing up she’s two years my uh wife is two years younger
Than me but in that time period And in that space being tall wasn’t you know it was like that was something to joke on or something man out so you know with me being tall and you know a little bit bigger than everybody it was kind of like well let’s
Find something to you know crack hey look bro I ain’t going to hold you bro when he walked in I’m like this this [ __ ] Goliath bro I told you I like Daniel bro you know you know Sean’s been here a number of times I I was like well
Sha was the power forward I was like but Kevin is a center on the team so he’s he’s he’s tall in the shot yeah I think I might got an inch or two on Sean yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah funny enough I’m I’m met Sean a so oh is that yeah yeah
Yeah that’s what’s up so that’s the that’s one of the benefits of aou but like I was saying I mean just being tall um you know that was one of the things you just had to it came with the territory so you had to have tough skin
Because at the end of the day somebody was going to find something to crack on you about of course you as you know growing up in Newport News That’s bro that’s all they do all they do bro anyway bro newer news is like a mini New York bro cuz everybody from New York
They they gravitate toer news and then all they kids are hit between Richmond and but like I would a part of me is happy that I actually spent a few years of my life there like coming up cuz I was in Demi at 1.2 I went to EPS
Elementary for a year I went to sedgfield I went year SFI for a year sedi is in new per news I believe then I went a credit in for a year so like I bounced around you know a pretty these are all the good places those good places I don’t know might
Be mixture between downtown and Midtown I think I lived on 22nd Street when I went to CR in 22nd is cuz my grandma stayed on 23rd so 22nds was Hood yeah but uh at sville that was the new park era yeah so I think so at that point in
Time they were trying to like uh mix the two so that it wasn’t so Hood in one area and so affluent in another they were trying to actually like bridge the gap you know you know it’s it’s uh when you grow up in those kind of areas man
You know you get tough skinned like you said I’m yeah I’m grateful for you know so I think there’s a positive to it Kevin I want to take us to your your high school career like so you’re in high school you’re playing basketball you’ve you know gone away from baseball
Because obviously you’re very likely I’m sure a dominant player in high school tell us about your high school basketball career and you being recruited by certain schools and things like that and how did you come to the decision to finally choose one school take us there yeah so
I played football um for a little stent in high school too but um like I was explaining to you all earlier uh when I got those you know injuries and stuff like that and it was kind of keeping me away from the basketball court cuz I
Play a year round it was more so like a n I’m just going to stick to basketball because you know this is what I’ve always grav gravitated to um but to go back to your question earlier um you know how did I really know that I was you
Know the basketball was my my my route or whatever like that but um I was always like you said I was kind of better than you know others when it came to it so at high school um as a freshman I was playing JV but also playing
Varsity so I was at the same time yeah yeah so granted I won’t get any burned on Varsity but I’m practicing with Varsity you know what I’m saying so they they get you ready for you know for what’s to come um but yeah so just be
Doing that you know I had that skill set that was you know better than you know some others at my age or you know in my position or in the area and stuff like that um but I also with that coming kind of naturally I really wasn’t the one
That was like waking up at 6:00 a.m. putting in you know up 100 shots and so on and so forth it’s like I’m showing up to practice and you know of course I’m going to practice a little bit outside of it but I didn’t wasn’t the one that
Had to put in you know hours and hours and hours just to so you just had a natural T yeah yeah so it just kind of came naturally yeah I was a guy spending hours and hours and hours and still good yeah so so that’s how I kind of
Knew that basketball was a sport too kind it kind of it was natural football was where you know I wasn’t the best on the field so that’s when I was kind of like uh I’m not and then you know back then they just see your height and see
Your size they like go on the offensive line I’m like I’m playing football put me at tight end put me at linebacker end somewhere exactly and obviously as you see the world as it is now that would have been ahead of their time you know they would have put a 66
You know 200 lb kid at tight end you know who knows where I I he may be in the NFL he may be in the NFL I’m here for a reason that’s so like I want to say so there was something that um I saw this thing on um Instagram the other day
Where a guy was literally saying uh he went to University he did very well in University and he was about to graduate and they were like well you know have you thought about getting your Masters and he’s like no and they asked him why not so he didn’t a reason so he
Ended up getting his Masters and then during his master’s program they said well have you thought about getting your PhD he’s like no and they said why not he’s like well I don’t have a good reason so he end up getting his PhD the moral of the story was like he never did
Anything with any of those agrees but he was actually Living For What other people expected him to do there you go and I think a lot of times we I fell into that trap but I told you with the church and you know a lot of times we
Don’t really know where we’re supposed to to be in life and we’re trying to find a path that we’re trying to get other people to direct us where our path is and it’s something that we got to figure out ourselves and like with you know with you saying with you know
Football and stuff like that like it’s difficult because as a kid you really don’t know what you’re supposed to do you don’t know what you’re here on Earth for right and you’re listening to coaches yeah you’re listening to coaches man parents you know a lot of times you
See even today you see parents living their dreams through their children living viar through them yeah exactly so you know you have like you said you have coaches trying to navigate you which way to go I mean I had coaches on the football team saying we need to beef you
Up we need to put you know some some pounds on you but in my head I’m like well you not think you’re just thinking about football you’re not thinking about me ex basketball if I put on 50 extra pounds how am I going to get up and down
This court you know what I’m saying and you’re not saying okay well let’s get you stronger you’re just saying like we got to beef you up to be on this offens all about their agenda right exactly exactly so um that’s a great point that
You that you you brought up a lot of of times you see people that are trying to find their way especially children um and I’m sure we going to get into that a little later but you know you have to let them figure out their way keep them on a path you know
As as you said earlier but at the same time let them find their way through life and decide what they want to do what it’s almost like like the bowling analogy right you bold but sometimes you can have uh what is those the guards guard rails right so okay so I’m I’m
Protect you from going into the gut but I’m not going to let you I’m not going to let you go all the way right so you can still Bowl yourself but I’m here as like a a veil of protection right okay bro so I think I think there’s one thing
That the um that’s why I gravitate so much to Asian culture right into anime and to because like the thing is the path is the path but you have to figure out what the path is for you and like for a lot of for a lot of us we want
Somebody to tell us what our path is because it takes the responsibility off of us to go through the work to figure out where our is very true and you know as a father bro it’s it’s difficult because I’m like I got 17y old twins I
Got a 16-year-old son a 15y old daughter and it’s like all right well I can’t figure out your path for you and I understand you know through my life experiences where I I don’t want you to end up I know where I don’t want you to end up but there’s certain things that
If I didn’t go if my parents shielded me from certain things I would not be the man I am today right there’s a certain amount of char building that has to happen any any great movie any great TV show any great book you have to build character right but in order to build
The character the character has to go through things right and as a parent our job really is a character Arc right character Arc and we think our job as a parent is to protect them from the things they have to go through but that’s not that’s not the the case right
They are the main character in their story we’re the support cast so we’re their Neo I’m Morpheus so they have to go through the breakup they got to go through the heartaches they got to go through the the freaking bullets being thrown at them so they can dodge them in
A way that I never was able to do right and as a parent it’s so difficult because it’s like when do I step in and when do I back off and I think the masculine imperative is you have to be so connected to the masculine to be able
To say all right well I know how far you can go because as a as a mother right the nurturer is going to say no I don’t want my baby to get hurt and as a m it’s like all right well how much pain can he
Endure before he gives up you know what I mean and it’s like that’s a beautiful balance too though right it’s a beautiful balance beautiful balance because like if you don’t have if you if you have too much of one you become weak if you have too much of the other you
Become hardened and you have to be able to find the good balance because you don’t want to be the guy who is capable of doing damage and is willing to do damage at any cost you know what I mean you don’t want to be that guy you want
To be the guy that is capable of doing damage but knowing he has a strength not to so I mean it’s it’s again being able to sled a man’s throat and hold a baby in the same day well there you go there you go all right so Kevin take us to you
Get through High School you get recruited by several schools you choose Virginia State University why do you choose to go to that University in particular cuz they was paying the bills there we go there we go the most honest answer you can give n man go you
Know growing up my main thing was to go to school and not have my parents pay for it you know just to get a scholarship so yeah um you know I I had a a chance to go to William and Mary um but I would have had to pay for the
First year and then pretty much you know get a scholarship the rest of the year even though still being a part of the basketball team um that wasn’t I mean of course playing D1 you know was the ultimate goal um but you know with weighing all the options um going
On the visit to Virginia state you know um the culture there you know I really wasn’t aware and fond of HBCU growing up um I mean I I knew what they were but I didn’t know the aspect of it and I’m honestly growing up you know in Virginia first time I heard about
Virginia state was on College Hill you know when that was way back when it dropped and just kind of watching that from a perspective um my second introduction to them were was when they came to our school and they were pretty much doing like admittance on
Site yeah so they used to come to Woodside and um you know I can’t even remember they used to look at your transcript or not I swear but it it was it was on site like they would show up right and you walk up hey I want to go
To school really okay stamp it’s probably was that easy but it was more so like hey go get your transcript from the guidance coun off like what your what’s your what’s your GPA look like like 2.0 okay well what do you do oh well you know if you apply you’re
Accepted it’s like so I’m seeing people with 2.0’s and lower getting accepted and I’m like bro I’m never going to Virginia state like like nah this probably bro I was the guy 2.0 L I mean I mean like you said I I I was always
Good at school too you know so I had uh what like a 3.8 3.7 oh wow in high school so you know School came easy to me you know for the most part too well math um so you know I saw that and I was just kind of like nah this not the
School that you know I’m going to but you know God has a funny way of leading you to places where you’re supposed to be yeah um and a lot of times I found I found in my life that whenever I say I’m not doing something or like n that’ll
Never be me I’m not going here I’m not doing this God is the one that tells me I’m going to put you right right there like just to show you yeah just that you’re not really in control like I’m not I’m not going to Virginia state ask
You this Virginia state have you always been like a man of Faith or was it something that you found earlier yeah yeah definitely um grew up in church U my grandfather was a pastor oh okay um so you know we grew up in church um mom
Always had us in church yeah uh until you know we were able to drive then it’s like all right you get to church on your own because at the end of the day I’m not you know responsible for yeah you doing what you need to do to get
Yourself in heaven you know U my wife she tells the story all the time when her mom told her and her brother when they were at a young age that you know um I can’t get you into heaven you know so that’s something that kind of sticks
With me and even though my mom never came out and said that she exemplified that in the things that she was doing of course hey look man Paul said you had to work out your own soul salvation bro I tell my kids that all the time like look man you look you know
What the standard is if you ain’t willing to meet the standard look that’s on you you know what I mean like at this point in time you know when you get to a certain age you have to learn how to um accept the consequences for whatever
Decision it is that you make yeah and one one of the one of the verses that I love that I’ve lived by for the last 30 years man is Proverbs 35 and 6 lean not into your own understanding but in all your ways acknowledge Him He Shall
Direct your path exactly and when you when you lean on that bro like he’ll take you places where you never thought you’d be and put you in places where you meet you you rub shoulders with guys that you would never be in a position to rub shoulders with before right you know
What I mean you know with me just saying that I was never going to Virginia state I would have never had the um the the network that I have I would never you know had a brother like Dante that I came across you know I would have never
Met my wife you know because I probably would have been even if I went to another school you know you don’t meet the same people I met my wife through a mutual friend you know so that that connection probably wouldn’t have happened and you know it might have but
You never know but you know you’re on your designed path for for a reason can we can we um so again I’m I’m not um Bas based on my background I’m not qualified to be in a room with you guys but networking allows me to be in a room
With you guys how important is networking to like just the male masculine imperative right if you want to get far in life like how important is networking to an IND idual I mean I think that’s as a as a male definitely um you know whether professionally socially um networking you you meet some
Of your greatest friends you know what I’m saying you you gain some of your greatest knowledge through networking yeah um even you know being a part of Kappa um you had to network to become a part of that realm that’s right um you it’s not like you just wake up one day
And say okay well maybe maybe some people it might be I’m I’m I’m RCT yeah but let’s just say in college you don’t wake up undergrad and just say okay yeah I want to join this organization and you know you’re automatically in um so networking I
Think it gets you um you know far in life um because it it has to be men of value who recognize value that you value exchange right and again you we’re all in this room together right now and we’re here because we respect one another and there is value being
Exchanged here in conversation and lessons that are that are being taught and discussed and that’s what networking is right and so if you don’t bring value to the table as a man then no one’s going to respect whatever you’re going to bring because you don’t bring
Anything right right right so it has to be a value exchange the funny thing is we were all in in newer newsa one time right we were we all all there yeah so I was there for a few years you were there for a number of years and you GRE up
There there it’s crazy cuz we we all we probably all know people from new news are still in the same boat the same position they were 20 20 years ago you know what I mean and it’s like I think that’s the the most important thing is transformation and being able to network
With individuals who can get you to the point where you can Excel right yeah that’s right because if you even if you don’t have much value to add find a way to add value to the person that you see that you want to be at in life right so
You know it’s it’s a small things and I know um for me it was bro I if if I saw somebody that was extremely successful right so there was this one guy I knew he owned a company and I I came to him said bro let me just bro let me clean
The toilets just to figure out what it is that you do bro like let me work my way up and um he’s like bro you ain’t got to do all that you know what I mean watch too many movies he watching too many movies bro I was watching that Will
Smith movie with him and his happiness that’s right but it’s like but you have you got to be able to add some sort of value to I mean cuz everybody doesn’t have Vision right but if you are a man of vision if you are a man who can see yourself where you want
To be that’s the first part right but then the next part is action being able to show whatever value that you can offer to the world or to the man or to the woman that’s around you that can put you in a position to be better than
Where you are today um and I think that’s something that’s lost in the art of man right now right it is lost yeah it is lost because I where we are right now it’s almost like men want sympathy just for the experiences of being a man
Exactly right like being a man is is very very difficult in today’s world yeah and it’s it’s a sense of I’m a victim now like I’m a victim please help me right I don’t have much value to give you but still give me something in return right exactly and I think that’s
Where we are and and that that is the the biggest fallacy that we can ever really believe in because as a man you have got to have value in this world right whether that’s monetarily physically mentally provide something of value to your fellow man and female to
Be a man yeah exactly so yeah that’s what we are okay so you get to College you’re playing basketball you’re on scholarship Kevin and at some point you decide you want to become a man of cap alasi yeah why yeah um actually I I I um
Um uh I think my cousin for that I have an older cousin so you know going into college I knew that’s you know where I wanted to uh the organization that I wanted to join um but uh speaking to him more in depth um as him being a Kappa
Man it was you know the nail that I needed you know that was driven it was like okay yeah this is definitely what I want to do um and I think you know that has a big play on the the um the representation on campus as well you
Know definitely our our chapter was a great representation on campus they were doing great things um the men that you saw being a part of that chapter and of that organization you know they they had value as you you both said um so you know of course if you’re on a campus
That you know the organization you’re interested in isn’t really doing much or you know isn’t really holding their weight it might deter you from that but you know just to see that uh representation that they had on campus and what they were doing that was you
Know also a factor into you know joining at the time that I did so you know as soon I as soon as I could um I Didn’t Do It um you know sophomore year you know cuz I was focused on basketball and things like that but as soon as I knew
That I was ready you know having that talk with my uh my cousin and you know and that um that push forward and that’s when I was like okay yeah let’s let’s go it’s go time what do you think is the the biggest thing or maybe it’s multiple things you’ve gotten from
Joining that fraternity man um like you all said it’s the network that I’ve gained from it uh the network the fellowship um the memories um you know it’s it’s a lot of things that you you learn joining the organization especially you know the best Fraternity in the land uh
So just going through that that um learning phase you know as we were in college um just being around those different type of Brothers um you know being able to network with them and you know get gems and um have conversations with them that was that was a big thing
So you know that’s something that we can take with us you know until we’re gone just you can be anywhere in the world and you can run across uh uh a fellow Kappa man you know a fellow brother and you know that that love is already there
You know they will help you um so you know just knowing that you can navigate life like that um and even just being able to navigate the professional realm you know um just having that previous experience through Network I think that’s one of the biggest things of
Joining not only you know a fraternity but pretty much any organization you know um you can join a count organization you can join you know a business Professional Organization yeah but you gain that that sense of camaraderie by networking um so I think that’s that’s like the main thing right
There yeah and I’m I’m thinking about what you saying what you’re saying too and I go to the local YMCA here right and for about two or three months every single morning I would go in like around it’s like 555 5: a.m. to 6:15 a.m. and there’s always this older guy that’s
There working out he’s like in the 60s he’s in very very good shape and we’re all we’re constantly talking just talking talking talking and I see him I so okay all right Mr Thomas I’ll I’ll see you soon man all right and one day we’re walking out at the same
Time and he sees my license for he’s like wait hold on man you’re a brother and I’m like yeah wait wait you you part of the fraternity too and he had joined at Hampton University like in the 60s yeah right wow two months of us like just
Talking and having this Synergy we had no idea but there was something that was natural there right and for whatever reason we had a good relationship already and it it just shows you that you know you can join an organization and you guys can connect without even knowing that you’re really really
Connected and that’s the beauty of that right yeah yeah bro that’s that’s that’s beautiful bro because like coming from somebody who has no organization right I’ve always understood the importance of Brotherhood and it’s something that I’ve always wanted to be a part of right and then seeing you guys’ founder day which
Which happened you know not too long ago a couple days ago right Y and then seeing you guys like come together and just the camaraderie between all of y’all and y’all sharing your experiences and I’m like I told my wife I say bro I was honored to even witness that you
Know what I mean through probate likeo this is fre amazing you know I mean like I I think it’s important and um I didn’t know anything about that before I met you you know it’s a beautiful thing man and I I want to make sure I I really really put
This on record that it really it really is a beautiful thing and I know that the narrative out there can be negative sometimes and and perhaps people are have become afraid of joining fraternities but when when I tell you it is a very very beautiful experience I think you know if my
Life was done over and I couldn’t join Kappa yeah I don’t think I could be the man that I am right now deep all right I needed this in my life at that time so I encourage all men to join some organization well like you said whether it’s a fraternity or even
Your Professional Organization join something that’s bigger than you become a part of it meet people shake hands and these become your friends for life like you got to have this man right I mean it can even be an organization at a church you know that too just having you know
That that camaraderie amongst other brothers and amongst other men you know that takes that helps you know that helps guide you through life that helps you know being comfortable you know um to bounce ideas and bounce experiences off of other you never know what you might gain from somebody else Yeah by
Just being in those circles and and the doors that might open from just being in that Circle you know or being in those rooms so I would definitely like you said encourage any man to you know if it’s a organization that you were looking at joining or you know that you
Um had some interest in you know just go into those rooms yeah you know I think too man cuz like people frown upon competition for some reason but with men that’s something that we need bro like competition helps us get to the next stage in life right cuz iron sharpens
Iron so if we have bro if I didn’t have the band of brothers that I have around me now right like my motivation would be it it would still be there but it would be minimal it’s fleeting right it’sing it’s hard to inspire yourself every day
Yeah it is man it’s difficult and it’s like you know when I have uh when when I look at somebody like Andrew Tate and trist and Tate and I see the Brotherhood that they have is something that I Aspire my kids to follow because like I
Got four boys you know what I mean like I want them to be in a position where they can like know they have each other’s back but even if they don’t have each other other back in that way I know there are other organizations that they
Can join because I have some people who aren’t blood to me that are closer to me than my blood that’s how it goes man yeah that’s how it goes that’s how it goes okay Kevin so you get through college you finish playing basketball you join fraternity you graduate and you
Get into real into the real life or to the real world as I call it and at this point had you already met your wife no uhuh so um when I graduated actually um I ended up moving back home uh well moved back home because I got accepted
To grad school so I was going to William and Mary for grad school um you know when I graduated I didn’t really know what I wanted to do I knew that I wanted to um in a sense I knew that I wanted to work with DOD but it’s so hard getting
In that door you know when that wasn’t afforded to me at the time I didn’t really know what you know where I wanted to go what I wanted to do so my next thing was you know let’s supply for grad school and see if I get in and once I
Got in it was like okay well you know um I was also in in in in limbo uh because I had one more year to play basketball so I was in Li limbo returning back to school although Virginia state didn’t have the um programs that I was looking
Into postgraduate you know um so I think the only thing that they had in the business real was uh like a economics degree or like a PMP project management certification um and I wanted to get my NBA so um you know I was kind of in limbo about that
Uh so and then like I said I graduated uh applied to grad school got accepted went and mared basically moved back home did that uh but you know honestly at that time that was and um that was when I grew the most spiritually um that was a time that I
Found myself kind of spiraling because I didn’t know exactly what I wanted to do like you said growing up it was um structure like I mentioned earlier being in a military household it was structured so you know Elementary School Middle School playing basketball you know a lot of times you see athletes
Once that ball stops bouncing or you know once you can’t put those cleats on anymore they get lost they don’t know what to do um you know I’ve always understood that it’s a certain time that you’re going to have to hang up the shoes but I didn’t know and especially
Not having the next thing right there for me um when you’re in that gray space you have to that’s where you have to find yourself um so that’s when you know I was kind of you know I was actually whing out I was drinking um you know I was just kind of
Like moving Reckless um and you know I just kind of had a coming to God you know um I’m not proud of it but um what happened um when I graduated we had gotten like an eviction um but you know we it never went through but basically
They tried to tell us that we had to leave because is that will Murray no this was at yeah so when we graduated I had family actually that came through for uh the graduation um but they basically were saying that we were making too much there was too much noise
On the stairwell which is crazy I don’t know how you can point that to apartment but right anyway long story short that came about um you know I was out in Petersburg for the summer um so you know we was living it up no no responsibilities I had um an internship with Walmart
Distribution um you know it was it was money in the pocket but it wasn’t you know real life yeah um so you know I was still kind of in between that space of being in college and being in the real world so I was just kind of moving
Reckless doing whatever I wanted to do can I pause it real quick because I think this is important a lot of guys cuz you being on the sports teams you add value right and and coaches see your value which means you are valuable to other men in your in your life right and
I think a lot of men get to the point where when they lose Sports they feel like they lose value right you know what I mean and it’s it’s extremely and it’s extremely difficult to transfer from there to there because now your value is in sports but that’s not that’s not
Actually your value your value is probably your work ethic your value was probably your leadership your leadership skills there certain things but a lot of what I found in counseling I’m not a counselor but what I found in counseling men is that they’ve always attributed their uh athletic accomplishments to
Their value but it’s like bro you got way more value there than what you think and they get lost in that and when they get to their so if it doesn’t you know if you don’t find your way like you did right it carries on until their 30s and
Their 40s and their 50s and a lot of times like they’re like completely lost to where the only thing they want to do is like end it yeah you know what I mean and like you said I mean I like I said earlier um that’s when I grew
Spiritually and I I thank my parents for you know that background and that upbringing because you know a lot of men that don’t have that upbringing or they may not know that way they have nothing to lean back on you know so so even though I was out here you know moving
How I was moving it didn’t feel right it didn’t you know it didn’t sit right with me so um you know that new year um it was like 2015 it was kind of like a tur and leaf for me um you know I wasn’t doing grade in grad school because I was
You know it wasn’t my focus um so you know I pretty much cut off the outside world uh dove in heavy until my mom actually got me a Bible when I graduated which is you know profound every time I think about it because it was a Bible
Going into the real world and my mom like you’re going to need this it was man’s Bible um so you know that was had to find that okay yeah yeah yeah I definitely I think that was one of my first ones too the man’s Bible yeah so
You know that was you know when you get it you’re like okay you know growing up I’m like I’ve been in church I got it you so but when you actually need it it’s like wow like moms have that intuition but you know throughout your life you kind of see like a mother’s
Intuition yeah BR look I will say this and this is probably a uh it’s probably not a good take but the Bible is extremely sexist it’s extremely sexist like it’s Pro the Bible is pran pro masculinity Pro leadership it’s Pro man it’s not it’s not anti-female at all
It’s not anti-female at all in any case of the world but it is prale right yes yes bro it is about accountability it’s about leadership it’s about obedience it’s about sacrifice it’s about everything a man encompasses in the real world right and these are certain things
That we see our greatest leaders of the faith go through and I think it’s it’s a man it’s almost like a manuscript in regards to uh what it is that that that you need in life that’s why it’s called the ba with the acronym is basic instructions before leaving Earth
Because it helps you out in certain things and I I tell anybody man like again it’s not a religious podcast but bro the Bible got so much stuff like it talks about a man pulling out it talks about a man pulling out bro and it’s the crazy part is like there’s so
Much information in regards to manhood in the Bible it’s so many I mean you you talk about David you talk about Solomon you talk about Abraham you talk about a lot of the forefathers of the faith these were masculine men that were still going through male experiences they were
Scared they were fearful you know I mean they were still going through everything that we go through if you look at Jesus everything that he went through but like he went through a situation where he had to go out and he was he was so fearful that he started bleeding
Tears bro it’s you know I mean like it’s it’s I didn’t want to get into tangent but it’s a masculine book bro okay so your mom gives you the man’s Bible yeah yeah so um like I said in that new year that’s kind of when I just like turned
Over New Leaf you know um got into the word more reading my Bible um you know focusing on school um you know praying for my wife wife before I knew she was my wife but you know um I was you know left the girls behind and just said you
Know God when it’s your time when that woman is for me and when I’m in the right position bring her to me you know um so you know fast forward I think about like five or six months later um ended up seeing my wife on like I said mutual
Friend one of my best friends growing up his girlfriend at the time um well his fiance now but uh my wife and her are um not L sisters but they’re uh chapter chapter sister yeah so they cross at the same school um so actually you know saw
On the page like and I just like just speaking existence I’m like oh yeah she she the one like oh you saying from a picture saw from picture yeah from the picture I was like without knowing any of her trait didn’t know her anything I just W I’m saying it’s sound like when
You in tune like yeah so the intuition okay yeah yeah I just saw I was just like wow that’s crazy man I was like I was like yeah I used to joke with u my man’s his uh his fiance and I was like yo where my girl at
Like before you even met her yeah before I met my wife didn’t even believe me I just be like yo like yeah yeah like yo cuz I was like you know back then it’s like yo put me on like that’s why I told her I’m like yo
Throw the live she was like all right whatever like so every time I see her I’m like yo where my like what’s up where my girl like yeah um but yeah so we ended up meeting at a uh at a probate um that year at CNU where she went to
School we went to did we go I think we all went there we all went to that one that’s right that’s right that’s the one we all went to um so that was my first time meeting her and then um you know we chopped it up that’s when group meets
Were big you know everybody was in a group meet um so we did a little flirting through the through the group me and stuff like that real quick so most people talk about manifestation right that is the real version n for real that is the real version yeah and I
Hadn’t even heard the story this is this is great man okay bro so so like so we got a little connection there right so we’ll go to later but when I saw Shae your current wife yeah I said yeah yeah that’s her that’s my wife mhm you said
That I said that bro my first time even seeing her was it like God told you I saw her and I’m like yeah I know that’s my wife it was just like you you didn’t even think about it it was just like second really okay now where did you see
Her she was at work just at work yeah she we were at work I was already established in my job she was coming through a training class mhm first time I ever saw her in life I saw her I’m like I got it was a strong feeling I’m
Like I boom that’s my wife that’s powerful that’s I love it man which makes sense as to why you know I said I said before the the Hosea gomore experience right okay that whole story yeah okay well we’ll get into that we’ll get into all right so Kev Kev listen so you you
See her on social media and you’re like you know what that’s her that’s the one for me you guys meet at the probate and what do you say to her are you like you know what listen I saw you I guess you can’t say I saw you cuz that’s kind
Of can’t say that no like I said this was this was what is I see and I W this was through a mutual friend so it was like a you know you knew that the connection was going to happen one way or another okay so at some point it
Would come to a head okay yeah so um actually the friend introduced us there at the probate and I’m going put my wife on blast right now but um you know I kind of shout out to J shout out to you shout out to shout out to my lady but um
You know I spoke to her um and we had like a conversation bro that conversation probably didn’t last for a minute while it was that quick yeah like we talk she heard of the songs come on and she you know you know in the middle conversation she was
Like all right all right boy you talking I got to go take care but she but she told me she was like um like when we talked she kind of had a feeling like uh and I was like it was like a little fluttery feeling or something like that
Wow so she got it too but yeah yeah she said she like she had that and she like like I said she dipped on so I didn’t I thought she wasn’t interested you know what I’m saying we end up um like kind of hanging out afterwards everybody to
Together um because they had like a after party at they wherever they were staying on campus and stuff like that uh but you know I was still trying to talk to her still trying to you know but she really won’t give me the time of day um
So we had another run in at a party at William and Mary one of the uh the Bros um at the C house out there they had a party she came through um and I was with one of my uh close friends from childhood and she knew like I said they
Kind of all ran in the same Circle so she knew who he was and I was like standing on the couch she gave him a hug and was like about to like just go and I was like yo like you you don’t you don’t even see me right here she like oh I
Didn’t really know so I be messing with her all the time like lit you cannot know him if you met him before he’s taller than everybody say it’s like he just not fit in with the with the crowd he was standing on the couch on the
Couch so she he about 10t at right exactly so she tries to give this story like like I said group me was big back then so so she knew that I um she knew that I crossed at Virginia state CU we were all in the chat together but she
Saw me at William and Mary so she was like I thought you were two different people and I’m like you knew I was the same person but whatever but yeah yeah so anyways like we chopped it up a little bit you know I ended up asking
For a number um and yeah um I we talked for like a month and I asked her like this was back when I don’t even know if people still do or now asked people be their girlfriends but but uh I don’t know if they still do
That or not now know I guess if somebody out I guess y just yes you right it’s like back in my day we used to slip the note hey look a note girlfriend two boxes right yes or maybe it’s three yes no I’m considering it right I’m considering maybe maybe maybe but yeah
So like I said this was like um the time where um like I got close you know grew in my spirituality I actually got a job offer up in Maryland um to work so I actually cut um grad school off short um I I remember telling them that I wasn’t
Coming back the next year they’re like are you sure you want to go you you know like you said a lot of people think for themselves and what they want to get so exactly um I think my offer was like 48 Grand or something like that but I’m
Like all right this is a job you know um this is kind of like the realm that I want to go into cuz it was with the government um and they were sitting there like you know usually people that graduate um hit um you know their offers
Are 70k uhhuh and I’m like yeah but that’s not fitting you know I prayed on it and so on and so forth but yeah I asked Jazz out right before I moved up like the day that I was moving that’s when I asked you kind of like you want
To be official type so okay and so you guys are about a month in right now you guys are texting communicating you got on dates and stuff like that yeah yeah we went on a few dates um she actually was refereeing at the time uhhuh um so
When she was refereeing I actually went up to one of her games to see her ref okay at VCU uhhuh um but yeah so that was actually our first date was me going up see see her referee again yeah yeah yeah and then you know what I’m saying
Hey look man we apologize for the technical oh it’s okay listen man we we caught up in the moment we are an independent uh Studio here yeah that’s facts like this just like a Indie like an indie artist right all right so so you so you guys you guys date what you
Guys are talking for about a month you say listen hey make it official let’s make it official and I move away you move away yeah that’s when I went to Maryland to Maryland okay so honestly she was still in school going to her senior year um so I was up in Maryland
She was doing her last year of school um so honest L we had a longdistance relationship you know even starting off our relationship um so you know it was navigating through that um you know the ups and downs the ABS and flows of a not even just a relationship but you know a
Longdistance relationship y I’m 23 she 21 you know what I’m saying like so you can only imagine the immaturity and the relationship right there that’s right yeah but yeah so we ended up um dating you know what I’m saying we dated for for I think like 2 years we started dating in
20 I want to say 2015 I I think that was 2015 I don’t know it’s been so long now but yeah but we end up getting like thato yeah yeah we end up getting engaged um in 2018 um got married in 2019 yep I remember that yep right before Co actually actually I
Was wearing this jacket at at his wedding I was wearing the same jacket at his wedding you walked in late too came in late I we was about to walk down the aisle I can’t believe here come this man running through the door hey look like bro I
Made it bro I’m here man I looked at I remember I looked at the uh the wedding coordinator I was like yo keep him outside like what are you what are you doing right now because it was literally I think right before it was right before serious like they started playing the
Music and the first person you see is this Negro and I’m like this is not his wedding day I know I know people turned around I was wearing this jacket man and I apologize he was flies out the I had to drive from North Carolina man to get
There cuz I was in school at that point but still but still I should have been on time ring bear or something The Flower Boy all right so so you guys get married 2019 and so after that you guys bring a child into this world yes oh nice man
Yeah blessings uh my baby girl Kinsley she was born in 2021 um so she was considered a I guess Co baby at the time I you know that was both of our first child um and you know even going through that was you know kind of tough because that was the time
Period where you know the spouse or the significant other wasn’t allowed in the room of like the seriously yeah when delivery but could you go into the uh room when she was delivering they had like just lifted it at that time like right as far as like the doctor’s appointments theic and all
You could be there the only thing that I was able to go to were the a sonograms okay okay yeah so I think you know that’s probably like three appointments or so like that so but everything else the checkups and all that she went there
Bro I ain’t going to hold you bro that’s an exciting time to find out what it is that you actually having bro like I literally I did it five times looking forward I literally had to listen to the heartbeat my wife had to record it while
She was in there and like but I drove her to all the appointments but I was just sitting out in the car waiting um but yeah so she had to record it and then rough it was still a blessing nevertheless you know um just bringing a child especially a healthy child into
The world most definitely yeah is a blessing on the S so yeah so we had our baby girl Kinsley um we thought it was going to be a boy but I we found out now that the uh Mr oh not the MRI the um sonog technician I guess
She was she was fooling with us cuz she slipped up and said he twice so we was like oh she said he like so wait wait wait wait wait she was playing yeah I remember so you remember you remember the um the uh what we had a gender
Reveal at the crib that’s right yeah I was there for that yeah I was there for that jumps um we did it but we thought it was a boy like I was like yeah I was there there going in strong like confident like oh yeah got a boy like
Got like cuz you remember we actually like bought some like some ones they were like blue and white but like baby coming like oh yeah they had the Jordans bro bro that’s rough yeah so we like 90% sure like oh it’s a boy cuz the day before I mean um jaz’s best friend
You know she was in charge of doing the lights and stuff like that but um the day before like when we went there the the technician was like he and she said he twice and then she was like she was like and then she was like um y’all want
To know gend was like No And then she was like well like can cuz if you see it she like you can see it she was like y’all really don’t know what it is she was like you can’t see and so we like Yo I’m missing something like I thought I
Thought it was you know um his private area or whatever like that I’m like okay well I know she said said he twice she talking about we can’t see cuz it’s supposed to be right there I’m like all right bet yeah yeah you just saw he had a little
Man man we did the did the little smoke jump that’s right I’m like yeah blue that’s why my face that was like my perfect Rea yeah yeah we did the jump that jum pink I was like oh right my wife threw the jump like nah she was mad
Yeah she cried the whole day yeah she cried oh man it’s not good it’s not good for her but it’s good for you yeah yeah yeah she she cried the whole day she was upset and I was like dang but yeah she got over that quick the next
Day she was in Old Navy shopping for clothes that’s right that’s right that’s right that’s right that’s right hey look man they say Daddy’s Girls momy for reason yeah so that’s my that’s my pride and joy but yeah she’s twoo now um so you know kind of like you said um coming
From from my upbringing you know um going through that bringing her up you know it’s it’s as a father you just kind of have to figure out what works for you and works for your family yeah um so you know that’s kind of the things that you
Navigate as a father um you know what’s best for her um you know what’s best for you and your wife um just kind of giving her that ability to roam and learn um and things of that nature you know and just being pres you know we have a a
Misconception that you know fathers especially black dads aren’t there for their children um and you know just being able to you know be uh a statistic outside of that realm and show you know and be able to shine light that fathers are here you know fathers are holding it
Down you know like we doing hair we doing you know we we picking out clothes we doing this that and the third um you know she can go off to work and she can stay at the crib with me it’s not like uh you know the roles are you know
Intertwined nowadays um so just kind of being like a Living Testament of that and just kind of seeing how our daughter grows each and every day and how she picks up off the stuff that we do you know and um and just kind of just like
Watching us it’s a blessing man I can’t that is that is a blessing so I mean god listen we have I mean three three great fathers here yeah two on camera one’s behind the camera he’s over here in the corner he’s in the corner shout out Pastor uh Pastor Garrison still in the
Building in the building a dope interview too do interview man so all right K we’ve talked about you being a man of Faith a man of family a husband a father I want to talk about Kevin the entrepreneur right and you have the debt
Free Club M and you know take us take us through what that actually is and tell us what gave you the confidence to actually put yourself out here and become an entrepreneur Yeah man so uh the debt free Club is a financial service that um I started with the help
Of my wife um actually my father-in-law is a financial advisor for over 30 years black financial advisor and Richmond um aw Smith Financial Group so he owns his own firm um it’s not like you know he’s U not Northwestern or something like that he actually owns his own firm aw
Financial aw Smith Financial groupi final yeah based in Richmond Virginia so you know just being around him since me and Jaz started dating you know I always had a knack for finances I actually had a I got a minor in finance when I was in school okay um and I thought you know
Coming out of school I actually thought I wanted to be a financial advisor yeah um until they told you told me that you had to do this was back when you had is it is a selling business but it was like you had to go around knocking on doors
I’m like yeah I’m like a different level of sales level I’m like I’m not knocking on nobody door but yeah so just being around him you know um seeing kind of the ins and outs and you know soaking up that knowledge and you know um him looking
Over my finances before we got married and then when we got married he’s our financial coach so you know pointing Us in the right direction um I’ve always enjoyed like I said finances I always enjoyed helping people um and so just to be able to create the debt free Club to
Not only help people but also um highlight you know financial literacy within the black community yeah um you know debt is a stigma that is you know hurting us day in and day out it’s what’s causing us to have such a great generational wealth Gap once we’re gone
Um so you know that’s my main focus in closing that generational wealth Gap so that’s why I created the debt free Club um over the past four years me and my wife have been you know blessed and fortunate enough to eliminate $40,000 him more in debt um by you know
Various um strategies and um debt plans and so on and so forth so you know just getting that feeling of doing that um and then creating the debt free Club you know with the knowledge that I’ve and experience that I obtained but also having my father-in-law as a mentor
Being able to you know help others and eliminating their debt that’s just you know that was kind of like a passion and when I started it you know it it just clicked um that was like something I was like yeah this is this is it like I I
Want our people to do better I mean personally it it burns me up when I see um you know black people or even anyone pass away and then the first thing we do is turn to gofund me you know so my main thing was the first
Thing I did before I started the debt free Club was to get my life insurance license um so of course you know um there’s money that goes into it but my main thing was we need to start creating this uh generational wealth for those that come after us we shouldn’t be going
Out here asking people for money to help us buried our loved ones we’re grieving enough you know so real quick can you explain the difference between uh term life and whole life because whole life is something that uh a lot of our people really don’t know about is
Something that you can kind of pull money out of right yeah yeah and term life is something that where it’s can you pull money out of term life or is it just something totally at the end of the day there’s uh two types of insurance there’s uh term and then there’s
Permanent and it sounds exactly like what it is term is going to cover you for a term term you know 20 year 10 year 30e term once that insurance is up it it’s going to the price of it is going to go up term is usually cheaper and
More affordable um and then you have permanent Insurance um there’s different you know entities of permanent insurance but like a whole life insurance um that’s where you can build cash value and that lasts you until you know you pass away so with the so there was a book called The Infinite system right
That I learned about right and uh something that our Caucasian counterparts are able to pass down from generation to generation which is which is something that they actually buil wealth with right because you can build up a whole life policy and then pull money from that if you need to do like major
Purchases uh vehicles uh um uh if you want to pay off Deb yeah Investments things of that nature so I know um the biggest thing for us is trying to trying to differentiate the the difference between bad debt and good debt right so what it in in regards to
Bad debt what is that considered yeah so I I actually want to go back to what you said about the whole life insurance the um the Rockefellers that’s how they kept their wealth 100% The Rockefellers created a whole everybody has a whole life policy but it
Goes into a Family Trust so once one of the um individuals of that family passes away the money goes into that trust and over time and over the generations if you needed money for Investments and so on so forth you were able to pull out of
That trust or that life policy you know um and use that I like to say you’re using yourself as the bank versus going to a bank and getting a loan out you can tap into your life insurance policy so that’s a uh a great way to create
Generational wealth is you know to have these Whole Life policies that’s EST establishing cash value and of course you know we’re all going to be gone one day if that money is going into a pot that you know our Generations are able to pull out of or you know that is
Creating this wealth over time you know that’s going to create that generational wealth for us but um to answer your question about you know good debt and bad debt um you know I kind of toy with that back in forth and I I have these conversations with different people um
In the uh Financial space because I was always taught you know we were taught that there’s good debt and bad debt but then some people say there’s no such thing as good debt and bad debt and then I recently saw um a clip that someone was basically saying that bad
Debt um is is debt that you can’t leverage correct yes um so good debt is debt that you can leverage um so you know uh an investment um let’s say an investment home could be seen as good debt because you can leverage that debt EST exactly bad debt will be seen as of
Course credit cards credit card Deb something you can’t pay off something you can’t pay off you know you going to buy food that you eating up in 30 minutes and then you know like um I think I posted something a few weeks ago in regards to Christmas you know they
Said about 60% of people are paying off Christmas gifts from 20202 2022 and 2023 wow you know um these are like holiday loans that people get U you know credit cards credit cards it could be holiday loans but um you know at the end of the day that could be
Seen that would be seen as bad debt because okay there’s nothing to leverage off of that’s right okay okay all right so you you guys start this the uh debt free Club you pay off 40K and student loans now you guys are hosting webinars you have taking on clients and
Whatnot tell me about one of your case studies do you have somebody that you feel like okay you know what this is someone that I’m I’m proud of helping because they were in a particular position and I gave him some good advice yeah I mean um so I’ve had
You know multiple people that have reached out and as for insight on how to eliminate their debth um so with me just starting we haven’t got anybody uh you know fully financially free yet um but they’re definitely on the path of doing so yeah so you know just creating those
Elimination plans for them and sitting them down and saying okay if you go on the route that you’re going now it’s going to take you 30 plus years to be out of debt whereas if you implement this plan we’ll get you out of debt in 12 years to include your home you know
So so we’re knocking out you mean you mean mortgage paid offage yeah yeah mortgage paid off oh yeah listen listen years this the man right here I’m tell I’m telling you and that’s and that’s using the cash flow that you already have that’s not us saying go out and get
A second job that’s using the cash flow that you already have is that like a Helo strategy or uh no it’s I mean it’s you can leverage uh life insurance you know uh bro that’s freaking amazing yeah so again it it’s all about knowledge right Kev you know it’s multifaceted
There’s a a lot of different ways you can leverage these things most definitely yeah and of course I mean you know a lot of people will say you know we have all of these social media gurus and of course I’m not you know they say if you’re the smartest person in that
Room then you need to find another room right exactly so you know of course once you go through social media or you’re looking at articles and so on and so forth you have to have a discernment to understand what’s right and what’s so I I think that’s the biggest thing that I
Have an issue with right because like there’s too much information out there right now it’s oversaturated it’s hard to figure out who’s actually telling you the right information so I’ve heard about the HELOC strategy but nobody can tell you how to start a HELOC you know
What I mean like I’ve heard about other things like the whole life insurance policy the infinite baking system but it’s like all right well how can I start where I am because there’s nobody here to guide me and that’s where you come in right exactly so that’s where um you
Know if you’re feeling stuck or you’re feeling like you know you’ve been paying on this debt and it’s not going anywhere or you know I even look at I have a close friend that you know they have um a baby on the way so it’s like okay
We’re trying to free up this cash flow to go else because you don’t want to be bogged down with debt when you have you know life going on yeah um so that’s why like I said from what I’ve seen from me and my wife in our experience and paying
Down our debts and you know freeing up cash flow that’s what was like man this is just you know I have to help others you know Reach This Financial Freedom um or you know at least be able to uh free up this cash flow to help them out um
And in order to live a better life and I mean the biggest thing is and I understand the biggest thing is starting um even before you know I got started with my father-in-law we have this reservation of you know people looking into your finances and it’s you know it’s just for
Anybody it’s almost taboo on yeah for anybody it’s a it’s a a sensitive topic you know um because you feel like you’re going to be judged um but that’s not the case at all um people that are in this field especially you know like myself and my father-in-law we want to help you
Like we’re not here to judge you we want to help you get into the best situation that you can possible so of course you have to you know look through the financial documents but we’re not sitting here saying you know this is the worst case that I’ve ever you know it’s
Not that but but but even if it is the worst case right there are still ways where you can get across that right but bro cuz I’m telling you three years ago I was the worst case and I I was able to get into to this program with NAA
Because I wanted to buy a house y y and um I will say this man it was a it was a daunting task cuz I I spent a year and a half they come through every single thing that I did bro but it it it allowed me to figure out how much money
I was spending and how much money I was wasting right right and when I found out how much money I was wasting I’m like oh dang I really do have money to buy house yeah I really do exactly yeah and that’s one of the things that that I do you
Know um that’s the main thing in regards of finding those inefficient dollars to take that and reallocate them some inefficient bro that’s that’s powerful bro so are you familiar with like Dave Ramsey and okay okay yep yep yep um so you know the Deb snowball strategyn snowball versus Avalanche
Avalanche yeah yeah so you know that’s our that’s our thing at the de free Club is you know finding out what’s the best route for you because um you know it’s not to say you can Leverage The Life ins Insurance to get out of debt um but you
Can also just be on a regular debt snowball plan you know what I’m saying so it’s looking at your situation and what you’re doing um and and making the best possible situation in regards of eliminating your debt and the you know smallest amount of time possible all
Right let me ask you this man cuz this something that uh I know a lot of us deal with you know I mean as far as us I’m I’m talking about Black Folk if our bill is $200 a month and we only got $130 we say well I ain’t got the $200 to
Pay it so I’m going to spend $130 I’m going to the alley I’m going to the club I’m abouty the Barrow 13 cuz I ain’t got I ain’t got no money to pay anyway what is your recommendation in regards to that that’s a great question and uh to
Start off I would say that you do have that $200 you got it you had it that’s right that’s right like I said before you have any ficient dollars going elsewhere I have never heard I’ve never heard it bro you got to trademark that Kev inefficient dollars I have never
Heard that before that is beautiful never heard that yeah so you got you know you have that money that’s not you know doing anything for you um so is that the Starbucks money that’s the M the Starbucks money that’s the money that’s the like you said going to the
Grocery store you just budget it a lot of people do it I budget $150 to go to the grocery store you go to the grocery store spend that1 50 but you’re stopping at Chick-fil-A on the way Home you know that’s extra money that you could be putting elsewhere you know what I’m saying so um so like to answer your question you do have the money you got the you just have to yeah you have to reallocate those funds and you have to take care of your priorities and your
Bills first um I’m I’m not saying you know by any means that people aren’t struggling you know some people actually don’t have the money but when you can actually sit down and say okay well where is my money going you have a a a picture of where your money
Is going how you’re spending your money I mean a lot of times and this is the biggest thing with debt our money is getting wrapped up into the interest so we’re paying down we’re paying down we’re paying ex money without a you know you’re paying a $500 payment payment a
Month on a credit card but you have 350 of those dollars going towards interest so one of the things that we do with the debt free Club when we sit down and we show you um your debt elimination strategy we show you what your what your
Debt is and then we show you what your true debt is and your true debt is including that interest because a lot of times we just see a number and we’re saying oh well I’m $20,000 in Debt M no you’re actually $45,000 in debt because
Of your interest rate so our goal is to pay down that interest as fast as possible so that you can free up that cash flow and that we can eliminate your debt yeah you know in in that given amount of time let me ask you this Kev
So I I had a scenario prior to I had a friend that had some credit card deck going on and because you know I’m a real proponent of credit scores personal finance uh he had I think three or four credit cards and each one had several
Thousand so I told him okay let’s pick the one that has uh the highest interest rate and let’s start there right now that one didn’t didn’t have the highest balance just had the highest interest rate I said let’s start there and pay the minimum balance on every other credit
Card but pay the extra amount towards this particular credit card let’s knock this one out and then let’s move to the next one right do you suggest any kind of variation here of this strategy do you say okay let’s pick the lowest balance snowball it keep going pick the
Highest interest rate hit there or a variation what do you suggest no it just all depends on on that situation that scenario and you know um looking at his situation that might have been the best thing for him to do is to knock out that that credit card that had the highest
Interest because like you said even though he’s paying $100 a month if 50 of those dollars are going to its interest we want to knock that out so that you can have that full 100 to put some else um even though like you said the higher
Balance might be over here but you might have a 8% interest on it you know what I’m saying so that’s like that’s basically like you said that’s it just depends um because you could I know even in some of the elimination plans I’ve put together it will have someone paying
Off their mortgage before it has them paying off a student loan which the mortgage could be 3% 4% 5% but because of how the the uh structure is put together it’s saying if we pay off this mortgage faster it’s going to open up this amount
Of money so that you can pay off that student loan way faster because if we focus on the student loan that may have this interest rate that’s hurting you you’re going to I mean you can see people nowadays where I know we saw a case recently um it was a woman I think
She started off maybe with like 50 to $75,000 in student loan debt uhhuh and now it’s at1 but she’s been paying on it m that interest is just accumulating yeah it’s killing you it’s killing you so you know that might be a scenario we like we just
Got to pay this down you know what I’m saying so we can get you out of debt as fast as possible but yeah that’s I mean it just depends on the scenario it depends it’s always Case by case okay yeah what they say it’s always you know
Multiple ways to skin a cat there you go that’s right that’s right just it’s just what what is best for you but to also because cuz our thing is we want you to still have that lifestyle a lot of times with Dave Ramsey I know they’re saying
Like you know you have to cut off everything sacri you know with with Dave Ramsey I think a lot of his um he has a lot of good methods but some of his methods are unrealistic right cuz he doesn’t believe in debt whatsoever and in order for you to accumulate wealth
You have to have debt to leverage of some sort yeah he just doesn’t you know he doesn’t believe in that bro the the real estate market has produced the most millionaires out of anybody M right right and in order to do that you have to leverage debt and that’s just
Something he does not agree with which you know when I was going through and I was buying my house his strategy worked for me but now that I’m already in my house I want to leverage more debt to create greater assets for myself I can’t rely on what he’s saying so going to
Yeah yeah yeah yeah but but you still got to be realistic right so there there’s still some unrealistic things that we as a culture rely on because we are the fastest one to spend a dollar y right so is it really important for your kid to get those
Jordans not if you have a bill do yeah yeah maybe not maybe not yeah so it’s like we have to be able to figure out how to shift the dynamic from being the flashy or wanting our family to be the flashiest to actually having the wealth
Where I bro if you look at the the transition from Jay-Z to where he where he started to where he is now when he started Ed out he had James like crazy had Rings everywhere to now he don’t even wear anything except for a presidential rolling and crazy hair yeah
Crazy he got the bosot going on right right but it’s a picture of wealth that we had in the black community right and you you know there was somebody who uh I think we were kind of hitting on this last podcast where the only thing they
Have is to showcase the fact that they do have Jordan well the these chains are still chained right metaphorically right and that’s a different conversation I mean that’s what I was going to say I was going to say that a lot of times you know um us being the
Flashiest it it dates way way back way before us you know that dates back to you know slavery that’s right it goes all the back that that that is has been embedded in us you know for over 400 years that we have to show we have it
Yeah but that was a trick that they put in our minds to make us think that you have to show you have it where they con sing it correct and they actually got it like you said you can like I remember it was a meme or something or um there’s
Actually a a Netflix um special what they were talking about like black people in fashion and they were basically talking about you know where did the Gucci print or you know why did we have to be so flashy and they went back to saying you know how this was
Just to make it seem as if you had more or if you were doing better you had these garments on um but remember like I said I was saying it was a meme that I saw that was basically saying you know uh a white person can have millions and
Have on you know the basic clothes and sneakers yeah Levis turtleneck a black person can have negative net worth but you going to see them in the Gucci and the FY and Louis Vuitton and so on so forth yeah it’s an ongoing battle it is you know that I think that we’re facing
Still and uh it’s Society too today it’s peacock it it is it is peacocking that’s a perfect metaphor for it it’s certainly peacocking you know it’s an ongoing thing but luckily I think we’re waking up to the reality of what it is and it’s more important like you said Kevin
To focus in on what actually matters right right and what matters is okay do you have something to pass on to your family exct once you’re gone exactly so the crazy part is I’m starting to see a shift happen where we’re moving away from a lot of materialistic things and
We’re going back to naturalistic things right so back to it go back things of that nature right so like you know all the stuff that we thought I think the co I think Co really had a a huge impact on that because no matter how much Gucci
You had no matter how much Louis you had no much Versace you had if you didn’t have toet paper like that was the most valuable commodity right it was most had toilet paper or paper towels like got all this stuff and you sitting at the house can
Nobody see you nobody can see you like you know the the the fact that we had the the issues with the grocery stores and people losing you know um ability to eat and stuff like that so it’s like now the shift is moving so I saw it through
Social media I was following all those things all those Trends right and now all the only thing that’s popping up on my page is solar panels or Hydroponics aquaponics farming things like you like normal things that we were with you know normal things we were with maybe 100 to
20 years ago yeah that’s you he but like to go back to what you said you know everything is so oversaturated now you know as my mentor tells me you know even in in the business that you know I’m doing you have to find a way to to stick
Out you know you all doing podcast you have to find we all know the podcast envir oversaturated you have to do something that sticks out um but at the same time you have to stay true to who you are absolutely and and stay grounded because a lot of people out here they’re
Beginning these things or they’re doing these things to get money to get overnight success to go viral yeah you know so um when you have a bigger passion and bigger purpose behind what you’re doing it for you know that’s when you start to see the reward that comes
With it yeah I’m I’m not willing to compromise our content for Clips that’s a fact I’m I’m just I’m not gonna do it I’m just I’m just not gonna do it right and so I think our goal is to again when we speak about making men more effective
Exceptional and extraordinary like I I truly mean that and I think it’s so it’s so important to put the onus on men going forward because if we are better then Society is better so I I am not going to compromise the content Lamont I know you’re not going to either most
Defitely just for the sake of clicks so so I think I think the reason why the the content has been compromised over the last 30 40 50 years is because men who have not had the opportunity to get access to women will conform to what the
Women want in order to get access to the women right and it’s like that that’s created a society of weak men and we have to be in a position to where we take that power back we got to fight back man you know we we have to fight
Back the men that which means you have to be willing to lose that’s right in order to to to get the greater good right and that’s you know yeah it is all right Kev man listen I I want to keep you here I can’t keep you here we’ve
Been talking for a while it’s been a good conversation it has bro you got to get home to to your wife and to your child uh can you tell people where they can find you on social media yeah yeah so um you can we can be found at k. wigs Wiig G
GS um that and on Facebook same way um we also have um wearing mad society that me we can tap into that another day but that’s Mom and Dad’s um Society oh wow um so you know we have Merchant dice for you know dads are dope moms are dope you
Know um biging up you know the Parenthood aspect of that um and that can be found at mssociety decom and then we have merch for Millennial millionaires um on that same website um but yeah um if you need anything in regards to debt elimination uh feel free
To reach out to me shoot me a DM um yeah we can we can get you set up listen guys Finance is one of the six pillars here that we speak about and it may be one of the may be the most important pillar without Finance you cannot actually
Become a man that can take care of your family and that is so so important I think to moving forward so I encourage everyone out there if you have a problem not just a problem if you want just some advice on Personal Finance please reach
Out to my brother right here to my right on the camera maybe to your left Kevin Wiggins the CEO of the debt free Club he is the man to talk to about whether it’s like life insurance uh student loan debt whatever your whatever your question is reach out
To him because it’s very very important and don’t be embarrassed about it right like do not be embarrassed about personal finance listen most of us were not taught in school how to go about becoming someone that is on top of your finances right so reach out to him talk
To him ask him questions he is available he always responds and he has an answer to your questions if not he’ll ask somebody else and they’ll give you an answer yes fact look man not trying to reinvent the will right no we’re not no no no we’re not just just bringing value
Just bringing value but the best thing is to hit your wagon to somebody who is already done it before that’s right and he has paid down over $40,000 in debt he and his wife who better to talk to about that right but also the the the generations before us
Right so we talking about generational wealth this is what they did to build generational wealth that’s right right and it’s something that you know we we were not pry to this is the information that we were not pery to this is something that I just learned maybe a
Couple years ago my mother she learned a couple years ago but this is something that they’ve known for years for years and this is how they were able to build companies that we we recognize Coca-Cola Pepsi what this is how they did it absolutely this how we close that wealth
Gap how we close close the gap right and and also the debt free Club they offer webinars they offer uh private coaching calls one onone if you need to reach out to Kevin talk to him guys tap in with him he is a wealth of knowledge he’s a
Well of knowledge right yeah all right y’all so that wraps up another episode of the born M podcast we talk before we go though I just want to give you all your flowers man y’all got a great platform going on right here um so you know keep going keep doing what you’re
Doing stay true to who you are I appreciate y’all having me today thank you for driving an hour and 40 minutes to beate this is a drive that I would take multiple times fellas thank you br apprciate I cannot wait to have you back again yeah most definitely yeah
Definitely we going to have to do this again for sure we got to we got I think at least two more maybe more than that hey we got more matter of fact matter of fact let’s get youall on a webinar man let’s let do let’s do it you got one
Coming up too right we got two we get him involved with University yes he can be the financial teacher right yeah I’m telling you man like yeah absolutely let get it bro thank you for being here man you know I love you I I can’t say I love
You like a brother because you already are my brother for the last 10 years so I love you like I already love you before all right guys listen if this was any value please share it with somebody like subscribe follow and most importantly follow follow Kevin Wiggins on Instagram
On social media reach out to him and guys we will see you all next time on the boras podcast take it easy all signing out guys take it easy
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