Welcome to matics collum Gazza the um beyond the crisis with uh IM omaran and I’m going to be moderating today my name is and I am the founder of thetics Institute and research head at the Yen Institute and professor at the University of Toledo Ohio my two guests
Today are the most distinguished guests on the issue of Palestine and automatic issues uh in different parts of the world um in fact both are Global thinkers and so allow me um as on behalf of the ematics Institute the think tank of the umah to welcome two sons of the
Umah sons of Palestine which is the Beating Heart of the umah both in different ways are the leading G Global voices today not only on Palestine but on all matters of htic concern Palestine has been the thermometer of this um’s well-being since the beginning when the Beloved Prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam was
Rejected by his people he was taken to the heavens but through the route of Palestine where he led the congregation of all the prophets alus then marked the beginning of this um’s universalism its global vision and Mission the Beloved Prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam promised Allah’s Aid to its people its
Man until the end of time fittingly since the dark days of colonialism and abolition of the caliphate it has become the last stronghold of resistance to encroach to resistance to en the encroachment of the new new order it was 1948 that first awakened the Arab Elites
To the fact that there was steep price to be paid for their disunity and that that they had otherwise embraced in return for petty kingdoms it was 1967 that showed the weakness of Arab nationalism and laid it to rest as well today Gazza has single-handedly challenged and we pray ended the Unholy
World order that was signaled by the Diabolical Abraham Accords but I feel that Muslim solutionist discourse remains woful underdeveloped and there is little serious development in how we think of a future that adds up that has any coherence for the children in the rebels of Gazza cry out
Al and call on the Islamic solidarity whereas the international defense of their cause inevitably couches itself in secular Nationalist and internationalist legal terms the same tropes that have proven utterly insignificant in theory and have been so in practice as well Israel’s actions are driven by Zionism
Which is not only a set a kind of settler colonialism but also a Messianic religious fanaticism one that is getting stronger and stronger to deny that is fashionable but I think not wise Islam is the only religion that upholds true monotheism the religion of Abraham Moses Solomon Jesus and
Muhammad Muslims are the only civilization that gave protection to the Jews in conditions in which their religion thrived historically We rescued them when medieval Christianity sought to illiminate them stul belat neighborhood today is a testimony to that era we have truth justice history and most of all
Divine revelation on our side and yet we are beset with Discord self-doubt and betrayal by our own leaders the umah is betrayed by its leaders and by many of its um so-called Scholars because they believe that we cannot win they suffer from learned helplessness Gaza has proven them wrong
In practice and yet who will give voice to the struggle of the men women and children of Gaza it is difficult to speak of nuance in the middle of an ongoing genocide and we must do absolutely anything an ally with any justice loving human being to
Put an end to to it but it would be unfair to the struggle of the people of Palestine if the genocide is now stopped only to continue a few months or years later as the genocidal Maniacs resume quote mowing the lawn unquote with International blessing under the guise
Of a two-state solution or some continued apartheid we must speak of ending The Entity that is committing this genocide and in order to do that like the struggle of nin and Salah a thousand years ago we must put our house in order first and unite how can we forget that same the
Same colonizers that created Israel as a settler Colonial entity Among Us gave us the nation state to keep us Muslims divided I could cite endless quotes and evidence to support this claim the Muslim Street knows and feels this but the rulers and their mercenary clerics and the Brokers of spirituality who tell
Us to suffer silently embrace the Erasure of our lives our children nurse sanctities as must be reminded of this fact it is fitting di mention here a recent article published by The humatics Institute in which my colleague Professor Alex thirston has brought to light a 1917 Memo by two of Mark syes
Associates Mark syes being one of the authors of the the infamous syes P agreement the memo reads it is a characteristic of of Islam to attempt to unite different Nations under the one religious flag as if they were a single nationality a strong sense of unity and
A strong guiding hand at the head of muhammadan Affairs meant that nationalisms would be weak while strong nationalisms would close off space for Muslim Unity the authors then recommended two lines of effort first establishing a weak central government with no more than a spiritual ascendency over muhammadans outside its territories more specifically they
Continued this week central government should take the form of an Arab Kingdom in bluntly racist terms the authors argued that the Arabs were ignorant conservative lazy and inbred and thus that the Arab Kingdom would be a poor and backwards place with little leadership potential Beyond mere custodianship of the Holy
Mosques the second line of effort the authors recommended was to cultivate quote a a strong National feeling in every muhammadan country which would make the population more interested in the political and Commercial Affairs of their own country than in the pan Islamic principle today too many Muslim leaders
And Scholars who defend this order and their secular nationalism as a religious Duty or perhaps as a way to suffer silently or as the Lesser evil we must replace the habits of thinking that teach us to abandon Islam in practice to embrace passive suffering of our CH of
Our people to perpetuate humiliation and to declare this Mayhem and genocide as an acceptable evil we must say no to them and yes to the message we hear in Gazza I want to then invite two of our speakers professor ustas wur and and Dr Omar suan I will read their biographies
Uh one by one and then we’ll start withas W currently is the president of Al Forum an independent Network dedicated to developing long-term strategies for political development social justice and economic prosperity of the people of the Middle East he is also the chairman and co-founder of common action forum and a
Member of Board of Trustees of international crisis group icg he is the former director general of the AL jazer Network he began his career with the network in 1997 covering South Africa Afghanistan and Iraq he was appointed the chief of the Bureau of the Bagdad Bureau and later as the Network’s managing director
In 2006 he became Al jair’s director General during his 8-year tenure at the helm the network transformed from a single channel to a media Network including Al jazer Arabic Al jazer English Al jazer documentary and the AL jazer Center for studies during this period the Arab world witnessed historic
Transformation including the Arab Spring of 2011 khur who resigned from the network in September 2011 has been the name has been named as one of foreign policy’s top 100 Global thinkers of 2011 as well as one of fast company’s most creative people in business of the year he has diverse academic background with
Postgraduate studies and philosophy African studies and international politics Dr Omar suan born to Palestinian parents in New Orleans holds a bachelor’s degree in Accounting in Islamic law and a master’s degree in Islamic finance and political history and a PhD in Islamic thought and civilization at the International Islamic University Malaysia he has
Served as an Imam and Resident scholar at at various mosques adjunct faculty at Southern Baptist University and founded and leads the yakin institute for Islamic Research since 2016 Dr suan has been the leading voice of both social justice and spiritually vibrant religious devotion in American Islam in the wake of his Israel’s ethnic
Cleansing and Collective punishment of Palestinians in Gaza that has intensified over the last two decades and has unabashedly turned into a genocide after October 7 of the last year Dr suan has become the most important voice representing and comforting millions of Muslims explaining to them both the political and spiritual dimensions of
Gaza to the Anglo um English-speaking Muslim world without further Ado then I will invite to um share with us his reflection questions thank you very much thank you dear brother for this introduction and thanks for thetic institute and for the conversation and the topic which in my opinion is
Extremely important at this moment in time we have been going through a lot of historical moments during the last few decades in my opinion the last century in fact from the 197 until today we have gone through one of the most important Transformations that this um has witnessed during uh
The 14th centuries and I call this Century last century the century of a humilation in reference to the century of a humilation that the Chinese experienced in the 19th century when they were invaded divided and humilated by International Powers the point which I would like to raise here and why I
Call it the cent of a humilation because the uh lack of continuity of what we are when we say we are the umah this concept of umah which in my opinion is the genium the DNA of the not only the you know spiritual connection the Brotherhood connection the community
Links amongst Muslims across the world but I always view um beside all of that as a geopolitical concept as a as an institutionalized concept that kept the consensus and created a center of gravity political center of gravity where this um kept its shape and power and protected itself this is what we are
This is what this Islamic world is in fact and when we went through the uh this dismantling of the concept ofila then later on the rise of the so-called nation state which I always argue that we do not truly have nation states in the Islamic World in particular or at
Least most of our States Post colonial era are not indeed nation states in the official West valian definition of nation state as in the European culture when that architecture was EST lished we automatically lost the consensus we lost the continuity with our tradition and history in political and geopolitical
Concept we lost as well the power of protecting each other because if you were living among the Muslim uh in the Islamic World during the uh golden year of Islam even if you are living in a sultanate or an Emirate which is different from others but the concept of
Umah was politically there so you are a citizen of the umah regardless of the land or even the governor that you are living under for example when IB batuta traveled in the 13th century across the Islamic world he traveled from pja but he found himself for example a judge in
In in in a country like Maldives he might find himself an ambassador of India to China he found himself uh you know a governor of certain provinces in various Islamic countries no one no one asked about the identity of that person as far as the land that he belongs to or
The government that controls that land he was a member of the umah technically he became entitled to travel anywhere to live anywhere to be part of any administrative structure without any discrimination that is one of the most powerful Concepts in my opinion does not exist anywhere else in any culture or
Civilization and the second most important element which we lost during the last century is the continuity of knowledge this um was the reservoir of of the truth this um was the generator of values and knowledge whereby if this knowledge and uh uh value initiated anywhere in this world in this
Islamic World automatically it becomes the ownership of everyone so who cares at that time for example if Abu was a Persian or an Arab today we are discussing this because of this n nationalism concept but at that time it doesn’t matter today the Turks are hanis for example but today the Turks
Will never follow a Persian Alim in particular during that period it was not important whether IUN was born for example in Tunisia or or in and or whatever and then he lived after that in in in Egypt his knowledge is the ownership of the umah regardless of his
Roots or origin or ethnicity this is very powerful element in what we call as the accumulative knowledge the accumulative spirit of this umah this umah it’s a spirit it’s mindset its framework of understanding the world was built by the concept of umah and when we lost this concept of umah a lot of
Things have changed and we were fragmented not only politically but also intellectually strategically and definitely we lost our ability to also become part of this International order where we were to a large extent not only part of it but for eight centuries at least we were the dominant factor in the
International System and we were able to define the international law the law of the Seas the law of communication the law of diplomacy and a lot of laws of economy we lost all of that because we replace This Magnificent beautiful structure with something else that prefers fragmentation partition competition and conflict
Over unity and over continuity this is extremely important concept why I’m saying this is it surprising to us the current position of the Islamic world or the you know States Muslim states I mean the political leadership of the Muslim World regarding Gaza for me it is not because this is this architecture this
Architecture actually has been designed in order to Le to reach to this moment whereby we as Muslim World loses the essence of our political influence it’s amazing to what extent the Islamic World politically at this moment in time is insignificant in the world order insignificant in the calculation of
Balance of power insignificant in the way that the Americans or the Israelis or whoever is taking them into consideration the leaders of the Muslim World met in Saudi Arabia during the at the beginning of this of of of Gaza war and they decided that the siege in Gaza
Should be broken and they decided that they are going to take severe actions in order to stop the the ongoing genocide in Gaza what happened since then nothing even the committee that was established the seven countries that supposed to follow up on these kind of regulation of
Of recommendations not they did not have they did not meet technically they did not meet so what are we losing at this moment in time we are losing not only our possibility as an um to to be part or to shape or to enforce the interest
Of the Muslim mold in a in in in the in a chaotic International order and you know the international order itself is based on power balance of power not based on morality or ethics this is the Western Centric philosophy of governing the world it is not based at all on
Anything called values beside the values that serve power this is why when we were to a large extent uh some of us were deceived by the liberal values always we arguing the liberal values are magnificent when you are implementing them for your own interest and this is
What the W of doing but when it comes to us the liberal Val of are not implemented even the international law no one talks about international law at this moment in time including the Americans who are trying to get rid of that so we are living in another order
Where it’s rules based order and these rules are defined by the powerful regardless of the ethics or values or liberalism or regardless of the international law which I think the Americans are the best to ignore and to to marginalize th this is number one so we are suffering but the whole world is
Suffering it is not only us I think we are the late the latest CS to the scene why I’m what am I talking about I’m talking about Africa which suffered much more than us through slavery and colonialism I’m taking talking about the Congo that lost 10 million people because of Belgium
Colonialism I’m talking about North Africa I’m talking about the massacr in Namibia and in Tanzania I’m talking about many other incidents that Africa has suffered from I’m talking about Latin America as well South America that has suffered the exploitation the eradication the the genocide of the indigenous people in North Africa as
Well in Australia in New Zealand we came late into the scene but for the last 300 years the Western Centric world order has been committing all kind of issues kind of crimes against actually humanity and genocides everywhere and this is when the Israelis do what they are doing in Gaza
I think that is technically in line of the Heritage and culture that the wi Centric approach to B you know this is important and to the world governance is actually so the Israelis cannot say but you know what we have done it and you are you you did it before us okay you
Might apologize here and there we will apologize one day as well but technically speaking We are following your your your this is number one second this is why I’m saying here our umah and by saying our um here I don’t mean the political ruling Elite I am talking
About people I’m talking about those who still have the um in their hearts and the values of the um in their hearts and the interest of the um in their hearts I mean those who are influencers influencing the um the young generation of the future people who have any say
I think they should take this matter seriously we should come together in an alliance with everyone in the world who have suffered from this W Western Centric approach to power and I mean the global South in particular and when I say the global South I don’t mean
Physically the south of the globe but I mean as well those who are living in the margin those who representing new values those who are not happy with exploitation and war mongering that the western civilization has been advocating including Europeans Americans and everywhere anyone else living anywhere
In the world this is important idea for me at this moment in time post Gaza this um should wake up to the fact that this is a continuous struggle it is not only a struggle for Gaza it’s not a struggle to end the genocide it is a struggle to
Shift the world order into another order whereby all of us are Partners in it and then therefore we have allies we have allies in South Africa we have allies in Brazil we have allies everywhere in the world and we have allies in America we have allies amongst the Jews as well who
Have started to to see the danger that the current genocide of an aparted State could do to the future of the of the Jews in the world and we should welcome them into this Camp because it is very important for all of us to establish this a Global Alliance around certain
Values and these values are not values of exploitation and mon of power these are the values of sharing proper and just and equal system for all of us this is number one second the Schism between the ruling Elite and the people of this um the members the Ordinary People the masses
The population of this um is increasing and Gaza has pushed it even further what does this mean we have witnessed during the last few decades that whenever there is a massive you know departure from the interest of the umah towards the West I mean the elite moving towards the West
Ignoring the interest of the umah something happens C some form of rejection anger frustration creates also forms of rebellion and sometimes it is negative in a form of extreme ideologies that create for all of us unwelcomed uh you know distraction from real issues because it is a matter of of
You know anger that that goes beyond control and leads into into unnecessary you know or a lot of complications or it could lead into awareness why into a proper introspection in the way that we think about the world in the way that we perceive the balance of power and I
Again my my task this moment in time and sure many others have other dimensions but I am concerned about the concept of strategy and geopolitics and I do believe that we have massive uh lack of understanding of the concept of balance of power and the concept of strategy and
Geopolitics and we need to be aware of what’s happening in the world and to have our own theories that are based on our own values that our Prophet peace be upon Him U you know taught us the concept of Mercy For Humanity that the fact that the prophet
Wasallam is not but a messenger for everyone in the world the global concept of this Mission these are important these are at the at the core concept of what Islam is these were revealed to the prophet in Mecca in the first days of the Revelation so this is we need to
Take into consideration but here I’m concerned about this Gap this Gap is growing between the political Elite and the people and this will generate difficulties complications revolutions uh turbulence and might be chaos it could be very negative but it could be converted through the effort of intellectuals through the effort of
People who have influence converted into a new Revolution of why Consciousness a new Revolution of understanding reality and responding to it without losing without losing patience and without also going Beyond certain boundaries and responding to this because it might fire back and then a lot of people who are in war with the
Muslims at this point time will use that as an ammunition against Muslims in various parts of the world so we need to be very careful how to manage the current situation now the third point which is very important for Us beside the alliance with the South beside the
Fact that we need to manage the current reality and the aftermath in a very you know cautious way but also in a very clear way the third one there is a need now to introduce a value system to the world based on something different from the conventional or the new liberal
Values that have been been been utilized as as tools of hegemony and power and seducation during the last a few decades the worldall is second of that and I mean the World it means we all everywhere are suffering from it but the the alternative is not ready the the the
Geopolitical center of the West the Centric nature of the western way of looking at the world and has created in us all of us we are all of us are product of the western education system Wern universities Western Academia Western structural way of knowledge we need to liberate ourselves we need to
Detox our minds from that and go not back I don’t want to say but go forward into something which we could call Islamic but Islamic not necessarily in a historical traditional sense but Islamic in a futuristic sense as well because I do believe that Islam resides in the future not
Necessarily in the past so we need to go forward into something that we could migrate to and we could we should be critical critical of modernity that has led us and led the world into the current moment Le the world in the current climate change Le the world to
The current poverty the current you know manipulation of power and and centralization of wealth so we need to be aware of the fact that we while we are developing the alternative are in fact infected you know sometimes in a subtle way with the modern values and and when
I say here modern I mean modernity through objectivism and Western uh wisdom methodology that is devoid from purpose higher purpose devoid from Al that we as Muslim believe that we have in every action we do there is an part of it there is a a purpose for it which
Which to go higher and higher and to to be rewarded by Allah subhana T the current methodology ology is not working and we need to develop a new methodology a new Theory a new way of thinking new value centered approach to reality politics International politics economics and it should be International
In nature but also we need to be aware that it should not be again colonized mentally uh by the the uh the the modern Western values that we have been unfortunately infected by to a large extent and I speaking here about our universities our Academia our books our
Way of thinking so for example when we speak about the new theory of politics and and we start by Max vber then we move into we speak about hopes and whatever as if the past did not exist this world the Muslims were there for for 1,000 years and they govern and they
Had International presence and they did not have a theory how did they manage so the western civilization during the last 300 years introduced us all all the theories of international relations and of politics but what happened before that did the world manage itself without any concept I think we need to be very
Careful in when we study even in the current Academia and in the current methodologies to be aware of the fact that the Western way of thinking has monopolized truth and has detached detached the history of Nations outside the center from the from the current mainstream uh Academia and current
Mainstream way of thinking we need to be aware of that and then I conclude by saying and the this is the last one you know hope so things are difficult in Gazza at this moment in time we have ongoing genocide in front of us acknowledged unfortunately by the American Administration and supported by
Many other European countries including Germany and Britain and so on and so forth and that kind of’ seen is so bloody so dramatic so depressing to an extent that some of us a lot of us have gone through you know maybe depression or or vir age of depression
Remember that it is a a a war between Justice purely and Injustice it is a war between power and will and our Prophet peace be upon him went through all the faces today the people in North Gaza are dying out of hunger our prophet wasallam in he was besieged and he got hungry
Himself and his companions and if anyone in the world should have not gone through that it would be the prophet wasam who is the most beloved by Allah subhana T but he went through it and he walked he worked through through reality until he built until he buil a new reality in the
World and when he migrated to Medina in no time I mean in 10 years he was able to establish the biggest geopolitical shift the humanity has ever seen it was in 19 in it was in 634 to 36 that the two massive empires of that time the Persians and the Romans
Who controlled the world for centuries were actually replaced at least in the in the in the in the uh in Iraq and in Syria and Egypt and many other parts of the world with a new emerging civilization not only state a new emerging um and this is what the prophet
Called us he did not call what happened in Medina a state he did not called what happened an Empire he called us um in the document of Medina and Allah subhah wa tala in the Quran he called us that um surprised the world with something that the world has
Never seen before and in no time that civilization was able to convert the entire world order into a new world order based on the new values and it introduced some concept which never existed in any Empire before that which is the equality the true equality and justice amongst people Muslims Jews
Christians non-muslims non Jews not anyone you know because every Empower every Empire until that moment in time was built on two principles the Monopoly of wealth and the centralization of power our civilization when it came to replace the that order it was built on sharing wealth equally with people and also on
Sharing power and that model survived for 1,000 years this is why we have a lot of Rich history to refer to a lot of values to bring into our current Modern Life and to build on it something that not only Muslims but the entire Globe could benefit from so
Gazza is a reminder that we have a huge task and those who are hry now because of Gaza I don’t want them tomorrow to feel okay is resolved people are getting some food and everything is going to be fine this is a start of a real serious transformation that has been delayed for
One century at least and if you don’t pick up now and move on another second Gaza and third Gaza and this time it might not be inaz itself it could be anywhere in the world is going to happen and the humanity will continue to suffer
So let us start this process and let us develop our alliances and let us move beyond our small bitty differences to see the big picture and to De develop a new approach to the world and to our in future um excellent Rising insightful remarks the centrality of the umah and the continuity of
Knowledge um and the gap between the rulers and the ruled and the opportunity that Gazza represents today not only for Palestine but for and not only for the Muslim world for the World At Large to point us to a New Direction a new possible order um brilliant message um and very
Well timed thank you very much um my beloved brother um your 25 minutes uh firstly I want to just express my gratitude to omad may Allah put blessing in this wonderful new effort may Allah subhana T allow it to be a source of bringing the umah together and bringing
The umah closer to each other and closer to Allah subhana wa tala and make it more beneficial for Humanity I also want to express my gratitude to my beloved brother Dr bless you and may Allah forgive you for that introduction I would spend 25 minutes uh refuting the introduction
That you gave uh about me but I know that it comes from a place of love and I appreciate that and I ask Allah to unite us always upon that love of him and to gather us under his throne on the day of judgment and to my beloved
Brother the words were not just uh very coherent and well connected but I think um reframing for for many of us uh in the moment where the only frame that we can see is through the frame of tragedy Allah I bless you for bringing the expertise that you have in multiple
Spaces uh together so that we could think about these issues not in isolation of one another uh I wanted to sort of focus on the way that the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam spoke about these Concepts and what they represent to us today and then how we
Look at how the prophet s Ali wasam compared the word worst manifestations of human conditions to the best manifestations of human conditions when they are connected to Allah subhana tala and it’s important as the scholars mentioned that the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam never saw a social system or an
Individual condition except that he offered a better replacement of itat and so there was nothing that existed in mechan or Med Society except that the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam either refined it with his message or he replaced it if it was not salvageable in its manifestation and so
When you talk about particularly you know what precedes the notion of umah and then what comes back in our umah that takes the place of umah uh it’s very clear and it’s very clarifying the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam saw some benefit to the notion of human fraternity and saw some benefit to the
Notion of tribal fraternity but also saw the excess of those things uh to be very dangerous and so the prophet s alai wasallam just like he did with everything else that had a mix of good and bad filtered out the good from the bad and it’s very beautiful when you
Talk about how the prophet sallai wasallam spoke to individuals about their qualities and he refined the best of their qualities and then he gave us the tools as individuals to then root out the negative traits the negative qualities uh that perhaps we acquired over time due to some of the diseases in our
Hearts and due to our egos and envy and arrogance that overtook us and so you’ll find the messenger of Allah s Ali wasallam say for example very beautifully where he starts to talk about tribes and he uh uses the names of those tribes to make Dua for them so he says may Allah
Forgive Aslam may Allah Grant Aslam peace or Salam uh you know from Allah subhana waala so he mentions their names in a way where he finds a good quality to make Dua for them or where he sees that their name denotes a good quality the prophet Sall
Alaihi wasallam will call them on the basis of that good quality to live up to that good quality but he never shames those tribes for some of the stigmas that have been attached to them because he sees Islam as ultimately redeeming and so they are not bound to
Those things so when it comes to of course had a reputation before Islam um of things that were entirely opposed to Islam but because they had come to Islam the prophet Sall alaihi wasallam does not Doom them to those things that they were famous for on the other hand the prophet
Said he says wasam about the tribe of he uses their name to signify their Disobedience they disobeyed Allah and the messenger sallallahu alaihi wasallam and so when they manifested the quality ities of Disobedience then the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam attributed that as well to uh their name and to
Their identity and that that was an extension of that while still calling people to care for their to care for their people whatever their people meant at the time to them until the umah became the greatest sense of collective for them he took their slogans famous One support your brother
Help your brother whether he is an oppressed one or an oppressor we know the famous story that they asked the prophet sallam what does that mean how can we support the one who is oppressing because in the days of ignorance that had a very specific connotation that
Meant whether he is upon and pay very close attention here a cause of Truth or a cause of falsehood or whether he is right or wrong in an individual dispute you support him because he’s your tribal brother and the prophet saam said no you support your brother when he is
Oppressing by stopping him from oppressing so the prophet took their names he took their slogans he took their Notions of fraternity and he offered an Islamic alternative to those things and many ways beautified those very things that otherwise seemed inherently ugly but then the prophet s was brought about that omatic solid ity
That replaces and becomes the greatest factor by which we see in one another a brother or a sister a sibling in a cause that is greater than all of us in fact the cause that becomes the very basis for our existence our purpose in life and so there are three things that are
Connected you see the loss of omatic solidarity and I just want us to go over some of thesei from the prophet the loss of omatic Sol solidarity is always connected to the loss of prophetic Clarity is always connected to the lack of leadership solidarity Clarity leadership and in this day and age you
Know when we talk about nationalism um sort of serving as the new tribalism right uh it’s very obvious that can take that place of tribalism and the idea of loving a person on the basis of nationality solely to the uh exclusion of everyone else can take the
Place of tribalism as it existed back then and that’s very dangerous but it would be wrong for us to Simply focus on a new manifestation of a problem that existed even in the time of the Prophet Sall alaihi wasallam instead the prophet sallai wasallam would diagnose what led
People to where they were seeking Solutions and he would offer a better solution and so the idea of tribalism at the root of it is that human existence is given all of its meaning at least in the collective sense through fraternity and people need a sense of fraternity people flock to things that
Give them a sense of fraternity and they find their protection their meaning in that fraternity now the consequence of that to everyone else is that no one else has any human value outside of my fraternity and no purpose is Meaningful unless it’s dictated by the leaders of
My fraternity but at the end of the day people seek fraternity and then if they find Comfort if they find safety in that fraternity politically socially emotionally mentally then they will start to dictate all meaning and all purpose through that so it’s really interesting when the prophet says for
Example the prophet wasallam said that the hour will not come until some of the the tribes of my um the tribes of my um and so the notion of still very much so exists uh as the prophet Sall alaihi wasallam is pointing out here but those
From my um those tribes from my umah will follow alongside the disbelievers to the point that they would worship idols once again and so how did they get to the point of where they’re worshiping Idols once again and of course if are worshiping Idols than anything that is
Less than that is also included and idol worship is of course the greatest heresy that the prophet Sall alaihi wasallam is pointing to so through their sense of tribalism once again they find themselves following the disbelievers to the point that they would arrive at the very thing that Islam primarily came to
Do away with right right so there sense of would have trampled their sense of um and it would lead them to the worst of places with the disbelievers to worship the idols once again but it’s really interesting because the Hadith goes on to sayah alaihi wasallam he said that and
There will be 30 Liars in my umah who will claim to be prophets of Allah and I am the Seal of prophets there is no Prophet after me now again pay attention these people have lost their sense of umah and gone back to another form of fraternity they’ve lost their
Sense of clarity and so they’ve gathered under the worst of causes they’ve lost their sense of leadership then and so they have taken the worst of people as Leaders to the point that those leaders and of course leaders in B in falsehood will push the limits of their falsehood
To the extent that they can do so without losing their fraternity and and they often overplay their hand to the point that these leaders would go on to claim divine revelation and divine sanction to say that they are prophets of Allah we’ve seen this happen many times in history now their people would
Know that they’re Liars right and this of course took place with the most brutal false prophet in the history of Islam was his people bif knew he was a liar but they said the ofif is better than the ofr the liar of benu hanif is better than the truthful one of qur and
So again the loss of um the loss of uh cause the loss of leadership andh you compare that Hadith to where the Prophet mentioned that Allah would send upon this um every 100 years those that would revive their Dean for them those that would revive their Dean for them in the
Small sentence the prophet sallai wasallam is talking about the the cure for this a sense of umah a sense of clarity and a sense of leadership two long in and we’ll look at some of the comparisons of them in I’ll share a few thoughts then we can move on
To the panel the prophet s wasam says in thei of and it’s always most I think telling when the prophet s wasam merges uh multiple Concepts into one uh so he said sallallah wasallam in this authentic Hadith he said Sall alaihi wasallam that whoever parts from obedience and then
Splits away from the group and then dies then that person has died a death of J that person has died a death of ignorance and so this is a person person that has left the system that Allah subhah wa ta’ala has divinely sanctioned for us and in the process of that this
Person found themselves dying in a death of ignorance and then he said Sall wasallam and whoever turns against this um and starts to strike and kill the good and the bad alike and does not seek to avoid the necks of the Believers nor pays attention to those that are protected by
Covenant then this person has nothing to do with me this is a person that has left me Al together meaning even if this person carries a banner that says muham the banner is empty the slogan is empty the prophet Salli wasam did not come to replace the slogan with a slogan
Because the the effect of that is that this person is turning against who the um is causing harm to the um and causing harm to the innocent and is not abiding by the prophetic or within the prophetic Community nor by the prophetic ethical framework and then he said
Sallam he said sallu alaihi wasallam then whoever fights for a cause and you know the prophet wasallam says so this is a cause that doesn’t have Clarity to it so it’s a cause that is not clear a cause that does not have any real meaning to it so in in the previous
Example the prophet Sall is mentioning people that fight under a slogan but it’s merely a slogan and in effect they’re doing everything in opposition to that slogan here even the slogan doesn’t make sense even the cause is unclear and they call to at the end of the day what are they advocating they’re
Advocating a form of tribalism and the prophet s was said or that person is enraged only for the sake of tribalism and then he has killed then this per this this person is killed in J this person is killed in a state of ignorance compare this to the famous
Hadith uh that we have quoted and we have seen manifest in front of us multiple times in the people of thei of once again and note by the way thatan is the narrator of the Hadith which mentions uh the 30 false prophets and and mentions uh the of this um once
Again being led to a place of even idol worship says he said Sall wasallam that I fear for my um misguiding leaders and as is narrating he said and the prophet s wasallam Said that there will always remain a group from my um that are manifest upon truth and are given Victory through being manifest upon that truth and they will not be harmed by those who betray them until the affair or until the command of Allah subhana t comes and there are multiple narrations that
Describe this group the first way to describe this group and and the fact thatan he’s clearly quoting two different narrations from the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam but the fact that he saw the connection right between that loss of leadership and the state of the umah but particularly a group that
Exists within the the um despite that failed leadership and this is very important because it leaves no excuse right for the Revival of all that is sacred even when the leadership does not represent that sacred reality the fact that he quotes both of these together and he’s a companion of the Prophet
Salli wasallam is significant there will remain a group from my um always so he’s the one that said of that narrates from the prophet s Ali wasam that some tribes of my um will be led towards idol worship here is quoting the prophet saying a group from my will
Remain and by the way this this Hadith has so many different narrations uh and from different companions meaning the prophet s would say it in different settings sometimes the prophet said that they are steadfast upon the command of Allah so the first description of this group from my um is
That what I identifies them what gives them a sense of fraternity what gives them a sense of existence what allows for them to be led by something greater even when they don’t have leadership right that guides them in the righteous sense within the capacity of this umah
Framework is that they are manifest upon the truth that they are steadfast upon the command of Allah subhana tala this is what grounds them and this is what leads them in the absence of structures that are meant to groud them and meant to lead them and lead the umah by
Extension and because by extension when the prophet mentions here that leaders that that lead astray they are not harmed by those who betray them and so you know when the prophet s would talk about the loss of am the loss of trust in the last days
The loss of am is first and foremost manifested in the loss of leadership the of leadership the Betrayal that comes to us from the political Elite right the Betrayal that comes to us from the political Elite and he continues LED nor those who oppose them until the command of Allah
Comes and they are as such the companions ask the prophet Sall alaihi wasallam who are they where will they be they are looking for the identification markers of these people and we know that the prophet Salli wasallam mentioned that these are the people in the holy land and surrounding
The Holy Land uh the Hadith where the Prophet mentions the best of those who hold it down who defend the borders of the umah are the people ofan the people inaz that would be implied by that I want to end on this note insh for us and
Hopefully it will be a little bit of food for thought because I really love that talked about the depression and the Despair and the loss of morale and that can you know really overtake our ability not to be able to just see things clearly but to see things in a way that are
Clarifying when we read the past and when we hope in the future when the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam gives us this group of people to look at we have spoken about how multiple times how the people of Gaza have led to a renewed interest in Islam around the world where
You have people that are looking into Islam and reading the Quran for the very first time that are finding Clarity in something that is greater and that are allowing and you have to think about you know especially uh the American mindset how many layers of tribalism do you have
To overcome to even be able to look into that religion in fact how can you even see the beauty of these people when you talk about Khan particular the guy represents everything that American nationalism has painted as the enemy as the opposition how can I as an American non-muslim look through that
See through that man through the exterior of that man that has been interpreted to me by my tribal framework and explore the beauty of what he has as a possibility for me to find greater cause in my individual life and in my Collective life well us as an um as well
What we are seeing is an example of steadfastness and what we are seeing is how cause can transcend all structures cause can transcend all uh barriers and it can help you overcome all obstacles and so the fact that the companions were asking the prophet s about who these
People are the people of Gaza are showing those who are not Muslim the beauty of Islam and they are showing those who are Muslim the beauty of Islam once again and resilience and steadfastness but also the need to have a focal point the need to be United by
Cause and the fact that we have no excuse just like we don’t have an excuse on an individual level to allow ourselves to succumb to our to to lower calls um you know in in the capacity of suffering we also don’t have an excuse as an umah to succumb to failed
Structure but instead inshallah T to let that be the reigniting of a sense of you know what things can actually look like if we build based upon that which Allah subhana has put that special quality that Allah has put into the hearts of those Believers may Allah subh put that
Quality in our hearts as well and may Allah subh unite us around that quality and Grant ustic solidarity prophetic Clarity and prophetic leadership and allow us to be a part of that Allah thank you very much for these inspiring uh words and REM reminders of our beloved Prophet Muhammad sallallah alaihi
Wasallam a Matic solidarity Clarity and Leadership uh beautiful message and couched so beautifully in the Eternal words of our Prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam let me now turn to open up a conversation and in the process uh I will welcome and she Omar if they have any more comments to each other specific
Points but I will open the discussion with a question uh starting with one for uh you mentioned that the international order is anarchic and chaotic which sounds uh compelling and goes along with the realist Theory theory of international relations but you also mentioned that the that there is need
For a new set of values you mentioned the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam example which suggests that the nature of power is similar now to it was in his own time so there seems to be almost these three ideas um how can do you see them first
Of all in tension and uh in other words is it possible to end the game of power conflict in whatever New World Order we get by proposing uh or preaching values and if you do see that tension um a question perhaps that could be attached to it a second question is
There a more univers something larger than other than Islam that uh something like that you think would be a step or in addition to the specific teachings of Islam that you’re proposing father thank you very much and shukran toar for the Magnificent actually reference to the SE of the prophet wasam and to
The I would like to say and this is extremely important for me because I have been trying to understand it for a while now I would like to say that the prophet wasam in the way that he conducted the public affairs which I mean here politics alliances uh strategies uh you know
Fighting and uh negotiations he has a very clear methodology and that methodology was based on certain values which of course Springs from the fact that he is first a prophet to the humanity and he’s a prophet of Mercy and he is the one who is coming to bring a
Message to the humanity until the day of judgment which is supposed to be valid the premise is that methodology which is based on these values is actually valid to be implemented in every age so if his mission is going to be continuous until the day of judgment it means the model
That he presented the implementation of in in reality is also in a way or another very important to be studied in order to find the central Concepts that could form a methodology of international relations or of politics or of stratagies in our daily life in our life and the
Generations to come so when you study what theam did in fact all over so some of us might have studied it for example through you know Classics of s and you find it like it is just an incident here an incident there Here There and Alliance here and there but you must
Know that theam did understand the reality the balance of power and he understood how to navigate through all of that and to build the alternative that could inherit inherit inherit the real and convert it into closer to Allah subhana in the process and that is important for us and the dimension of
The studying the Strategic and political actions of the Prophet sallam are necessary for our time because it is missing a lot from our lexicon and from our methodology you are right when I say that the world of today the current world order which was based on the
Concept of power in in in a way in a in a way or another in a western philosophical way is actually anarchic it is realism what unfortunately this is what is it not because we like it to be like this because we know it contradicts the central values that we stand for in
Politics and in in in other in other spheres of life but unfortunately this is how it is now how to move and this is a big question for all of us actually how to move from this re realism which is based on these values of power and competition and
Conflict and so on and so forth which goes deep down into ontological values in fact in the western mind it’s it’s not something superficial it is a complete Paradigm of thinking that Springs from ontology up to to to methodology how can we move from there into another model I argue that we
Should build that model in Alliance with everyone else it means that civilizations before the current 300 years of of Western Centric approach to to world order did have richness that was ignored marginalized and interrupted and therefore the current reality is not in fact a natural evolution of the international thought
On politics and geopolitics and on a strategy and therefore we need to understand how Nations behaved how Empires even acted and then how we Muslims did introduce what contribution did we have to that Evolution and then we can say after that what we could do in the future this is why I’m arguing
That we need a critique of modernity when it comes to to politics and international politics implementation and we need as well beside the critique a continuous effort to build a new conceptual framework that lead us to resume what has been interrupted from the growth and evolution of a human
Thinking about politics this is important the last 300 years are Interruption not the rule and therefore when I say realism I refer to the current wi realism not to what is supposed to be taken into consideration taking reality because also we are realistic in any way or another we have
Been realistic but our realism if if you would like to say between two brackets was in in these kind of values now you refer to values and I will conclude by this my brother we and I have this argument always when I say you know Islam has come up with Justice and
Equality and the freedom everyone says you know but these are the liberal values what are we talking about so what is the problem between us and yeah the problem is the following the ontological basis of it when we speak about equality and justice and the freedom we are
Speaking about it that is entrenched in a in a in a theology in a onthology which refers to that as a way forward to Allah subhah wa tala as a way of worshiping or as a way of we practice this sincerely because we know that Allah knows what is in our hearts and
This is why doing it for his sake but in the current liberal utility utilization of these values it is done in increase power or to monopolize wealth so it is a utility without purpose but our values are actuality are are in fact the way to Allah subhah wa tala and therefore the
Genuine feeling about them the sincerity attached to it and the the the proper implementation of it the Excellence thean of being just thean of of Defending Freedom are actually necessary in order to take into consideration in building this model thank you you very much um Dr amaran would you like to
Add I think that’s very beautiful so I think the the values of every of these every one of these structures and these agreements um can always be extracted to erect more timely structures and agreements in the spirit of those values and they’re not ambiguous or broad enough to where they can be manipulated
Like the Abraham courts which you mentioned um no one who has an elementary understanding of the religion would be able to base uh anything that the prophet did in something like the Abraham cours right but to be able to look at agreements and to be able to
Look at how the prophet was interacting with Society something I was I was thinking about as was talking again I think that um you know when when you interpret the prophet s’s actions in his world uh based upon the way that the companions understood them and the way
That they then manifested in uh eternal truths then uh you have a better grasp inshallah tal of making sure that you act within that framework uh it was not just that the prophet s rejected that will worship your gods for one day uh and you worship Allah subh for every
Other day because that could have compromised the clarity if you made if you made just a power calculation if we worship Allah every single day of the year the likelihood of Iman setting into the hearts of the people you know uh for the rest of of the Year and that one day
Uh idol worship just naturally being cast aside the likelihood is very high if you’re making only a political calculation but you’re not just making a political calculation right you have to keep in mind that this has to be Eternal this has to be timeless so we see that
In we see that even with the balance of power there were tribes that told the prophet look we’ll support you on the basis of what once you die we assume leadership the prophet refused that even in his weakest moment because that would in that would uh you know indicate to
The um after him that it’s okay to place power in the hands of those that don’t deserve it when you are powerless and to set up a model right a model and I think that’s the key word here a model uh that represents something that is uh in
Opposition to our core values as Muslims you look at the rest of the um’s history though you find particularly in the notion of one of the most interesting agreements that that I see um was at the death ofd Malik when he appointed as his khif but he understood
That moving things to the children of ABD aiz versus the children of ABD Malik was going to lead to an internal revolt and of course it did lead to the poisoning ofd um and while there wasn’t a particular as salant that was ever identified it was kind of understood
Where it was coming from but the arrangement that was worked out was that after it goes back toik but Subhan Allah there was this is not the prophet s wasallam this is understanding the um needed to be injected with a notion of justice that it had lost with prophetic qualities
That it had lost and if you gave a person like OMD even a couple of years he could do what he did and indeed he did uh what what he did so the key word here is is a model that the prophet s could not sanctify a model that brought
In an Unholy value and allowed us to build upon that Unholy uh value U but he did show us pragmatism sallallahu alaihi wasallam without sacrificing Clarity or ethics um you know in in every single stage of his s and I would like to add to she Omar
You know I’m fascinated by one thing in s which I always feel it is amazing you know sometimes I would argue when you are defending when you are resisting when you are trying to uh go against oppression it is of course uh you know you should have the
Resolution and the determination and the patience when you are powerful and this is what the Western world has taught us and I’m sorry to refer to the Wern because unfortunately power today is Wiston in a sense that when you are powerful you are free to do whatever you can do you
Enforce and you commit whatever you could because you are capable of doing it the pro the the moment the the the the golden strategy that he implemented and the best and the most peaceful was after he became powerful not when he was weak when he was weak he was defending and he
Stood for qur but after he you know realized in the trench Al that in that from today they cannot do more than his strategy rever first in approaching them and it was Alia I regard Al hudia is most amazing initiative strategic initiative that the prophet his encounter with qur why
Because Alia was the moment that the prophet wasam had an army 1,400 people they could have conquered Mecca by the way because Mecca was weaken at that moment in time but he wanted gently to approach quray and to approach Mecca in an initiative while he is traveling to
Mecca he is telling his companions if they ask me for for a plan of Truth or in order to create some kind of be I’m going to accept he did not want to humiliate quray although kicked him out and qur conf confiscated people’s wealth and people’s money and they humilated Muslims and so
On but his Dua was always and he approached them in and he signed the Treaty of to an extent that some of the of the companions like others realized that it might not be appropriate for us to concede so much to qur but Allah subh said he described the moment of as the
Greatest victory that Allah subh the that Allah has given to the prophet wasallam Al was describing not a battle in the field it was the strategy of the strong which is the prophet wasam approaching the weak in order to find a way where he brings them close to Allah subhana wa tala and
To the religion not through humilating them subjugating them not through hemony but through dialogue and through treaty and why he’s doing so because his attempt of creating a new reality was to Allah subhana tala it was not a matter of centralizing power and wealth or dominance or hegemony that was never the
Case in any Imperial initiative before him it was not the case of Alexander the Great when he invaded Russia it was not the case of Darius who invaded half of the world at that time it was not the great the the case of the Persian Empire
Or the bantian or the Romans before them or the Athenians before them never been that the powerful when he gains power he actually start to take the side of the op of of of the weak in order to convert them into something gentle gently where
They could join him the blessing in in a new in new environment of worshiping uh Allah to a new purpose to a high purpose to share the fruits of Faith rather than to subjugate them to enslave them to to confiscate that land to conquer that land to colonize them to to do whatever
Unfortunately the last 300 years have been doing to a lot of weak Nations across the world brilliant so let me um ask one more question one more prompt rather for discussion uh before we open up um questions or audience questions um and that is looking now into the future and
Thinking about um question of strategy and priorities one common way to think about um this question of unity is that we must first uh we must start gradually and part of this gradualism is the notion that we have been given the nation states and I I love that analogy that
Shomar Drew with the tribes and the way to do this right is first strengthen the nation state each nation state 50 of the nation states get them right establish perhaps democracy establish Norms there that um uh that will lead to human development intellectual development and so on and
Then think about some kind of institutional uh Arrangement like the United na European uh Union or or something of the sort um but at the same time this gradualist approach seems to have over the last several decades entrenched us further and further in the politics of the nation state which we all spoke
About um what do you both think of um gradualism as a rhetorical way to justify first of all the nation state and what is the alternative can I would like I do think that the current reality which was created by the international World Order especially in our part of
The world in the in the Islam World in particular uh is not sustainable because I argue that the architecture itself is wrong therefore any result is not going to be progress is not going to be uh prosperity it’s not going to be stability we are going to suffer from
This one 100 years is enough to test the theory 100 years we have gone through basically the current reality especially in the Arab testify to the fact that the modern State postcolonial era is in fact a disaster and it has reached almost its end almost we don’t have we have Anarchy
Everywhere in most of the countries that we have at this moment in time so to move into the model which I perceive always which is the umah based model you need to go through this transition and the transition here is not actually based only on on uh interest because the
Western the European model which I by the way I am admire the European Union concept because you should remember that Europe is the most divided continent in the world Europe is the most bloody continent in the world it has gone through immense amount of fighting for
The last 2,000 years but they managed to reach a moment of integration eon integration with all the problems that the European Union has but is of course much better than the previous nation state with with with extreme sovereignity and this is why it is important it’s anecdote Europeans
Invented the nation state concept and we did not have it we have the um concept they gave us the the nation state concept and then they moved themselves into less sovereignity for nation state and more for for the collective which is the European Union while we in the
Islamic World which we have the previous model of unity which is the um have look at the current so-called nation state which I argue it is not nation state anyway they look we look at it as sacred we defend it with our lives it is not us
It is not ours it’s not our brand it’s not what we belong to it’s not our DNA you know what I mean and it is a failure I mean what are we defending basically just a flag and borders and kings and presidents anyway this is another thing
So that yes we need to have gradual but this gradual also should use the movement of the world order why because leaders are a result of reality unfortunately in our countries Unfortunately they are result of what have been you know asked to do because as I said the center of gravity is not
In the Islamic world the center of gravity is in Washington and and European countries and there therefore we are not doing what our interests should provide us we are doing what the Wern interests actually dictate upon us or limits us to do now if the world
Order right now is Shifting which in my opinion is from the east from the West to the east if the coming confrontation between the United States of America and its allies with China and its allies is coming which I think it is it means there are cracks in the world order when
Cracks in the world order happen then the weak the marginalized the briery could start thinking of something that they have never ever thought about possible and therefore yes we need to prepare at least mentally ourselves we need to put our own plans we need to think of the economic integration in
Regions which this is the model which I have been suggesting for a while now let us have the economic integration of the sh region economic internation of theab uh uh economic in of Central Asia economic integration now when you have this economic integration it will trigger a new
Psychology of movement of people that will create movement of people new psychology of governance new psychology of defining the national interest and the interaction with the rest of the world technically you build the concept of umah through these kind of phases because the other alternative is to have a dominant massive power invading
Everyone like previous Empires and then United everyone again and say okay this is how it’s going to happen of course we are going through a lot of battles and wars and confrontation which we don’t need so unfortunately this is what we need to do using the coming five years
Of the world you know transformation the transformation the world order and the major conflict which I see it coming you know and I think a lot of people seeing it coming unfortunately as a result again of the same philosophy that created the Western Centric approach to international relations is going to
Fight against China so let us prepare mentally and this is the role of an Institute like tics and a role of a forum for example a role of many institutes academ academic discussion but also intellectual and political discussion among all of us prepare these models to start graduality gradually
Becoming a mainstream understanding of the post so-called nation state or partian state as we know it today it’s phenomenal I agree with everything that you said and I would I would build upon it um merely by saying you know as simplistic as it sounds when we say everyone has a role to
Play When the is to there is no way that you can have people come closer to Allah subhana wa except that that diminishes their desires and diminishes the importance of all other individual and colle Collective structures that don’t emanate out of and so the da always has
A role to play if people are elevated in their Islamic Consciousness they’re naturally integrated into more omatic thinking and so dawa always has to lead the way and bringing people closer to Allah subhana and diminishing the importance of all else all forms of integration amongst those societies it’s
You know I definitely think economic integration is the strongest form of integration because if we know that economics drives politics economics and egos Drive politics then economics uh you know are the first place for us to go to uh to to properly integrate various Muslim countries uh with one
Another so I love that concept and I think that we should explore other forms of integration as well uh while economic one uh economic integration is the strongest form of integration cultural integration social integration to get our um take advantage of uh the digital means as well as the ease of travel to
Start to bring together um you know uh both um consequential interests and consequential structures as well as Playmakers in various fields from different Muslim countries to where that integration is becoming more sustainable more natural across all of the layers uh I I I do share the fear um about
Reinforcing the nation state model while trying to make Muslim nations stronger especially those Muslim nations that give room uh for institutional development but I think so long as the clarity uh of of our thinking and our values and and what we seek in terms of more integrated societies is in place
While also condemning the elements of nation state thinking that are so clearly antithetical to Islam and to everything else what while actively targeting those things inshallah T will reduce that risk and uh we can start to see uh not just more omatic thinking but more atic structures
In if there is just a chance for one minute minute extra please please yes so one thing we we can do now by the way while we are preparing this concept of integration waiting for the world order to shift in order to allow us to build economic integration in Regional area
Whatever we start building our um on another level the level of us I mean today as I’m talking to you from from where I’m sitting you are sitting in different countries the concept of technology has empowered us to establish virtually our um because there is aspect to
The which is intellectual I spoke about there is a major major aspect to the um which Omar spoke about da and there are many other aspects it’s not just econ it’s not only hard power it’s not economics and and geopolitics you know we need a lot now we need to develop
These networks vertically connect Circles of influence in the umah we would love to see the economists of the Islamic World sitting in networks across the Islamic World talking the politicians talking the Dua talking cross professional you know grounds talking in this case we continue to build the umah as well in our sphere
Because I am not a politician you are not a politician we don’t have the power to to create whatever I’m talking about but we could do whatever we could do now which in fact connecting our our eles with each other across the world and enriching this experience and keeping
The momentum because the worst thing we should do the worst thing that could happen to us that through encountering this heavy resistance uh by the current Elite the political Elite that has vested interest in in maintaining partition maintaining marginalization of the Muslim World while we are trying to introduce the new
Model we might lose momentum because they are much more powerful they have the energy the media sometimes they have even a lot of of of resources they have jails they have they have as well security apparatus so we need to be aware of that how to to to immunize
Ourselves by networking amongst each other and that we could do now we don’t need we could do it as institutions as intellectuals and as Dua and inshah that would be a major step to maintain this um at least in in in Virtual and intellectually until a moment of transformation comes
Inshah thank you very much uh what you calling if you could if I could give it a name is discursive integration which is possible precisely because of Decades of globalization and the movement of peoples and Technologies and now um every technology has um um sometimes unintended consequences and I believe
That as like Steamboat engine in fact um you know once created the possibility for the umah to be reintegrated in an earlier age um leading to more people committing performing Hajj and that actually led to a new Consciousness almost in every era uh in the early 20th
Late 19th century and in the same way uh you’re absolutely right this deep discursive integration is something that uh we at thetics Institute also take as The Point of Departure um as well as the point about uh economic integration that is something uh we take as uh one of our
Major projects however I I was just listening to Professor we John mimer the realist at the University of Chicago who makes this point frequently and I think makes uh makes it compellingly that when politics gets involved meaning when politics in the shidian sense of of a struggle for
Survival gets involved that is when everything including economics is set aside and I think that Gazza shows us precisely that I think that you could say in many ways the Abraham Accords were the consequence are kind of of political sorry an economic uh security political security for a tiny Elite but
They were based in a kind of economic integration at the region it just was integration with those in power in other words it was Regional economic integration but it has a purpose and ideology that required rooting Islam out uh Muslim anomatic solidarity out for the purpose of the economic benefit and
Sometimes it’s political action that changes the script for the whole world including those who are in power and um that’s why I always uh remind myself and my colleagues at thetics that you can never predict where the change is going to come from and you must always be
Nimble because the umah has a lot of Baraka there are a lot of people a lot of actors that we do not know about uh that may initiate a change that puts us a lot years ahead of where we think we are um but um uh speaking also of the
Question of the nation state that reminded me of IB kalon’s observation that the vanquished always imitates uh the Conqueror and what’s really interesting is the the phrase or the the Clause he has that precisely because the Vanquish does not know why he lost so you try to imitate in every the winner in
Everything and hoping that if you imitate the winner and everything that could could be maybe his the way he dresses the way uh you know the way they sing the way they eat perhaps that’s the way they won and I do believe that our Elite uh are deeply deeply victims of
Inferiority complex which is why they want they think that when they get a chance they need to have this season of of of you know MTV brought to Saudi and Riyad and the hijaz uh and have these performances because many people genuinely and fortunately believe that that is the way to progress and
Strength um one final comment I want to make um as I was reading some of the works by uh very interesting thinkers including Dr AI bishara I have great respect for him but the point that he makes um who is you know Palestinian Christian intellectual um and who the point he
Makes is the importance of Arab nationalism as the central Paradigm um and anything else as a distraction but I also hear often when we think of the umah often the word is uh you know coopted into this is for example or oras what is the um that often this
Word it’s self allows in the mo in modern Arabic to this uh you know is prone to this um ambiguity and so um how can what you think are the prospects of the umah being an umah as defined by the prophet Sall alhi wasallam rather than umah as defined by
Language and ethnicity which is a much more attractive and tempting option and I don’t think that it’s merely ideology just the convenience of reading each other’s literature reading each other’s jokes reading each other’s stories is a very powerful integrative uh integrative Factor we saw that in the Arab Spring the 22 Arab
Countries felt for each other in the way that other Muslim countries did not immediately at least in their masses did not immediately feel so what are your Reflections on first of all making the umah Islamic rather than Arabic or or or national or Territorial and second how
Do we address these the challenge of uh this linguistic sphere that is naturally limited not by uh a commitment to Islam or the prophet Alam but by uh the ability to understand each other of course I am not in favor of Arab nationalism personally because I do believe that
Arab nationalism to a large extent is a deviation F of the mission that the Arabs have and Allah subh has chosen the uh Arabia and the Arabic language uh for the for the message and I think this puts on our shoulders as Arabs and people who speak
Arabic uh puts on our shoulder a massive burden or responsibility in in order to open up and and in my opinion that concept that the Arabs are the carriers of this message to the world what made the possible what made the um possible because when we went out into we went
Out to up to China and many other parts of the of the world no one felt that we are trying to build an Arab Empire but we built a Muslim W and that world conclud includes in it everyone so if there are nationalisms in the world in
The Islamic world I would argue that Arab nationalism in the Arab world did not serve the purpose and for since the collapse of the Ottoman Empire until today the so-called Arab nationalism did not succeed actually in creating that kind of bond it did create a lot of Divisions even amongst the countries who
Raised the same slogan like the B party in Iraq and the B party in Syria so or between Syria and Egypt when Jamal ABD to unify them so I’m not in favor of that and I warn against being centered AR nationalism in the Arab in particular
By the way you know I would argue the Turks for example have have to develop their Turkish based on certain kind of nationalism in order to create the modern State Post you know kilaa period and they had to do it Iranians did something like that but in the Arab
World it fi and I am not in favor of it and I’m in favor now if you speak about the Arabic language as a bond you know it’s fine because the prophet defined that when he said that the language itself whoever speaks Arabic basically is an Arab so in
The Arab world we have none Arab ethnically who speak Arabic so I would regard them Arab so I’m not sure if we go into ism Arab nationalism they will be excluded directly like the the barbar the amaz the Cs and many other or the Africans in in in Sudan and many other
Muslim Arab countries we need to be careful of that I would argue that if the Arabs realize the responsibility attached to the mission and the fact that which I mean very interesting description of Quran to us the fact that we are not only the moderate the um that introduce modernity
Modern dis moderate discour but also geographically we are in the SYM and that’s important Al Al is the middle geographically it means that there is a mission to carry when when we carry that mission we become strong enough capable enough recognized enough Central enough that we don’t need nationalism to
Improve ourselves or to develop that kind of BL Bond and and and strength that we desire to achieve yeah if I may add I was just you know in the introduction I read one of the words that was used by the British for the Arabs was inbred but when you
Look at the Arab phenotype it is the most diverse phenotype in the world in other words there is no Arab Gene because it is at the center of the world so everybody has come and settled and passed through uh that meeting place of the continents yeah I would I would add to
That um you know I think that again going back to the way of the Prophet Salli wasallam used the shared to call to the higher without making the shared the higher so use any shared culture any shared language any shared lineage anything that you can possibly draw upon
To establish the bond of humanity and then build on that to call to something higher but if you allow those things to become the higher calling then uh you lose your power even if you’re temporarily uh in a place of political uh Power very interesting Subhan Allah
With with the prophet wasallam when it came to the tribes that were Allied to Banu hasham because I think of this also as a Palestinian it’s very interesting I wonder um if there is somewhat of a distinction between invoking that shared in the capacity of resistance versus invoking it in the capacity of
Construction um what I mean by that is that when you’re fighting a common threat and obviously this transcends even you know tribal Alliance and nationalistic Alliance but when you’re fighting a common threat you can see how the prophet Ali wasam strategically invoked benu hashim’s alliances with non-muslim tribes for the sake of
Resistance right as well right there there are Allied tribes that are not Muslim to Ben Hashim that supported uh the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam on the basis of that so I often do Wonder as as a Palestinian you know this becomes an opportunity it’s very interesting you know in in in these days
Right uh some of those things that naturally tend to show themselves as as Rifts within uh the Palestinian uh you know Collective Consciousness and the collective uh Liberation uh they do become diminished in the moment of of of urgency and emergency and Rel relationships are kind of built in in
Those moments but what we have to do is not become complacent with that maybe and and let that become the defining model right where we lose where we lose sight of of who we are right both as individuals um as well as collectives but I’d love to actually entertain that
Thought with with with both of you you know is there a difference between invoking it in resistance uh versus in construction in my opin the propham thank you very much for This Magnificent question the prophet wasam in his attempt to create the new reality he used and
Utilized the what was available for him and for example the fact that K before Islam had an alliance with his grandfather with ABD MB the prophet wasam maintained that Alliance and he used that Alliance to an extent that became basically the eyes and ears of Muslims in Mecca and around Mecca the
Fact that the prophet wasallam did uh have an alliance with as you said Aslam and and and J which are the to a large extent extremely important strategically these are the tribes that were dominating the trade lines between quray and Sham and Syria at that time
And he signed with them during the first few months of his arrival in Medina signed alliances with them they were not Muslims of course but his purpose was to interrupt the trade roots and to put quray under a reality where they need to negotiate something and he did that so
In his maneuvering about reality he would have done a lot in order to gain that we should do that as well because this is the logic of of power in a sense but the purpose of that was to build the um this is why when he defined the
Concept of um and this is extremely important I argue that even non-muslims in the alliance were part of the um because when the prophet arrived and he said about the Medina Covenant of Medina uh he said that the umah are the tribes the Muslims plus all the people
Who are living within the security Zone that he established which means from Medina until the coast of the Red Sea which was part of the um so the definition of um here did not include Muslims only by the way it includ included all those who form the
Order and that is very flexible and very pragmatic as you said and to a large extent this is what we need to Aspire for to make alliances around common interest but also based on proper respect and values that could bring all of us together so when I speak about the
Um in a geopolitical or a political sense I never argue to religiousity in particular religion but but if we have Christians in the Islamic world we have in Egypts who were part of the we had a lot of Christians living all kind of sects in Iraq we had Jews living in the
Muslim World they were part of the um no one looked at them as outside the um so the concept of um is not per se a religious concept it is much bigger than that um I have some work on the Covenant or the so-called constitution of Medina where I have a slightly different
Interpretation but um I want to um go back to the issue of the Arabic language um you know said that it is one of the it is an obligation for Muslims to learn the Arabic and I do believe that today we live in a a time where at least uh many
Muslims who have this ability many more Muslims have that ability than than um in the time of IM shaf or any time after to acquire a new language in fact now almost as a part of the curriculum and part of the new educational model uh where learning a
Different language is seen as uh necessary for brain development uh it is only uh natural that we we all take uh the learning of uh Arabic as a model although that’s I think a long way ahead given our educational condition but that nonetheless um I take to be an important
Uh step uh one of the things that also has been uh asked in the um in the in the questions here and I must uh wrap up now I think we have gone over our um over 12:00 but we started about 15 minutes late so if if if that’s
Okay with you we’ll go until for uh until 12:15 is that okay with both of you okay uh so let me ask a couple of questions also that have come from uh our audiences um so one question that that keeps recurring is the question of liberal values what do
You learn from uh is there a way to islamicize Liberal values because on the one hand we hear that liberalism is at the the heart of the current world order liberalism and capitalism uh occur together on the other hand liberalism is seen as and often appears as on the
Other opposite end of nationalism so liberalism as focused on the individual in human rights whereas nationalism is ethnocentric return to some kind of uh more you know tribal uh more narrow-minded more uh a kind of a communalist understanding of the West in which Muslims are not included and so on
Um how do you think that we look at liberal values is there something salvageable there to me I would argue the following uh this um of ours has a very interesting uh Habit Conquering the Conqueror Conquering the Conqueror in a sense when the Western world came in
Touch with us through the The Crusade and later on of course through continuously through through Andalusia we were conquered basically attacked by the Western Crusaders but when they came back they brought with them home new values I arue that the original liberal values that emerged early Enlightenment were in fact
Inspired by the Islamic thought because at that time you should remember that the world order was centered around the Muslim world the Muslim world was there and it’s not like something oh my God no the Muslims are there and the Islamic power you should remember that Europe
For eight centuries in a way or another was besieged by Islam all over the the Mediterranean was a Muslim Lake basically and every route of the trade goes to Europe before they discovered in the 15th and 16th century the Portuguese and the Spanish went out through the the
The their Explorations every route used to go through the Islamic world so the communication with the Western world was continuous that introduced the Western World of new values and the values of equality and justice were alien to the mideval philosophy you know it is the concept of sh which is democracy later
On was alien to the concept of the Divine divine right of ruling in in the western mind we introduced these Concepts so so the golden thread that started in the Islamic world was transferred across Europe but what happened with this time the centrality of power over value utilized values and
Converted them into util utility rather than maintaining their integrity because the reference point for these values was not the um was not the common consensus it was the power the state and the state always has a habit of converting anything into a tool for power so the later liberal values where where I
Describe them as the utility of power were actually diverted from the original ones so I would argue that when I I speak about Justice everyone loves justice but what kind of justice is it the early liberal Justice the early concept of justice that the great philosophers of the w
Introduced or the later version which has become a utility for the powerful against the marginalized this is the most important element so yes we can salvage the liberal original liberal values by by empowering our own values because the source of it came from us but we need to internationalize it
Unfortunately during 300 years we while the West developed itself into a center of of power and the center of value for the world we also became inward-looking and we start giving up our role as a center for internationalizing our values we started to be threatened by modernity
We looked inward we gave up our mission and then when you look onward your values your ideologies your methodologies your philosophy start to crumble start to Bel Litt and start to be marginalized and this is why from now on if you want something new you want their real
Liberal values to succeed and to be resurrected let us go and sit together and see how can we from the roots of the liberal values which is in my opinion Muslim Islamic ones how can we now bring it back to life and and connect it with the purpose which the Western World
Western values disconnected the liberal values from the purpose the the sacred purpose that originally started in the original land of birth which is the Muslim World excellent check H yeah I would you know I think that it’s very important for us to separate what the values claim to be
Upholding versus what the values have actually been uh throughout history right and so I think the The Genius of Islam is taking what the the I guess if you will the intended uh goals of those values are and uh you know grounding them in what is actually Islamic the beauty of what
We have is that we are able to always go to our own origin uh in fact if we were to sort of tie this question back to the previous question we um Muhammad s alaihi wasallam being the um of Muhammad sallallahu alaihi wasallam you know it’s often how they speak of the Sunnah
Governing the interpretation of the Quran the person of the prophet am protects from the uh usurping of the intended words of the Prophet sallallahu alaihi by people that claim to be of him by using his words and so it gives the definition uh so that interpretations do
Not become too loose and that’s true for our Theology and that’s true for everything that is less consequential than our theology being the um of Muhammad sallallahu alaihi wasallam so building upon what is actually Islamic value while taking into account the trial and error of History to go back
And to see where those deviations took place from Islamic values original Islamic values and then trying to go back to where it succeeded and then why it succeeded and how we can make it succeed today uh I think is what’s what’s deeply important to us um there’s
There’s you know in in our own academic Pursuits right you try your best to remove uh your bias you try your best to remove motivated cognition so when you’re reading and developing upon true Islamic values you have to as much as possible uh ignore the desire to make
Them align with what other people uh have have decided are ultimate in higher truths and higher values and I think that that’s probably uh the benefit and I’ll end with this you know one of the benefits as well of razza making us feel like Outsiders again I think that
Sometimes we need that um I was talking to a brother who was mentioning that the da and you know for for many years became um about aligning uh our truths to the things that everyone else already knows to be good and hoping you know that that would make Islam more
Acceptable to the mindset of others but I think that by us becoming so clearly unacceptable uh to everyone else and maybe even embracing the identity it allows us to hopefully filter out some of that bias when we’re reading and developing our own intellectual thought perhaps uh that intellectual development
Will be purer inshallah and closer to the origin as a result um we must wrap up now I am um in infinitely edified by both of you here and honored by your presence I will repeat uh despite your protests that I am talking to two of the leading
Luminaries of the umah and I have um great hope in the umah because of people like you and uh uh I want to Simply repeat what I said uh in the beginning the Uma matics Institute uh the think tank of of the umah for the umah um and
We are engaged in many such activities that we know many of the leading Scholars and networks and NOS within the umah elsewhere uh like a Shar form are engaged in uh uh we believe that it is precisely this kind of discursive integration that is necessary regardless
Of what other um path we take and what other opportunities present themselves we must be prepared to take advantage of those opportunities um and um as um uh emphasized we need economic reintegration in order order for there to be uh the social connections and intellectual connections within the umah
Before we move to that must not be the destination but that is an important station on the way uh and as Sheik Omar San reminded us to connect back to the example of the Prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam it is not the past it is also the future to Think Through uh the
Example of the Prophet Sall alaih wasallam his mercy and in particular a point that was raised a number of times that he was at his most merciful and generous when he acquired power and so we do not seek power as an umah for the sake of power but we are
Also and all we’re always driven by our message to all people it is not an ethnic message uh it is not a message of regional Superior prority it’s a global message um and um more specifically I want to invite everyone to um follow matics Institute and various social media platforms um our
Next matics colloquium is going to be held inshallah next month toward the end of March with Professor Adil Malik of Oxford University precisely on the topic of a mat of economic reintegration uh and our uh annual conference inshallah is going to be held in Malaysia in July of this year um and um
Along with that conference we have a an academic workshop on the topic of managing deep differences among Muslims um there are many other things that we are doing uh publishing we uh urge you all to get on the list if you have any particular uh areas that you want to
Work on uh please get in touch with us um with that um thank you very much everyone for joining and especially my beloved guests Sheik Omar suan and sheer thank you very much Salam alaykum but
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