Welcome back to another episode of the corporate Cowboys podcast my name is Alex as always your host today’s Proof of Life it’s Thursday April 13 2023. and as always you’ve got me for another 30 minutes free consultation take this General opinion really I guess I could qualify it as a general opinion
Right this is general advice it’s not specialized it’s not personal it’s not tailored to you so again legal disclaimer anything that we convey across in this medium across this podcast in the form of opinions or messaging none of it should be construed by you the listener as legal advice okay
Because you haven’t retained us you haven’t reached out to us personally so anything that we address and discuss in this podcast you shouldn’t rely on to any degree because you are not our client the questions that we answer we pull from various places mostly Reddit and the internet Reddit really
And we treat them as hypothetical clients that being said if you find yourself in need of some professional advice uh an opinion as to how to navigate corporate how to move up how to get promoted how to negotiate your next promotion in terms of title in terms of compensation in terms of
Fringe benefits what have you you need help strategizing it you need to bounce some ideas off of another mind one that’s been trained in inter organizational relations and relationships reach out to us that’s what we as corporate Cowboys do every day where we’re constantly aspiring to attain that state of professional consummate professionalism
Right so without further ado today’s question is coming from our slash career guidance and the question is pretty straightforward I’m reading it now it’s asking the cons I mean it doesn’t give say the or what it just straight up says cons of giving more than two week notice I mean it’s
I feel hastily written should have could have been done on somebody’s phone right that a lot of folks use the internet and to access Reddit on their phones I think people who use it on their computers are investing a little too much time in Reddit right I
Mean unless you’re in the middle of a meeting and can and can divide your attention but even then I question that now this question is flared for advice so they’re asking for some input on our part My Hope Is that the body of the question gives us
Information and plenty of it enough to contextualize and inform our opinion right now you The Listener are in a unique position to peer into the mind of a corporate Cowboy a career consultant one that specializes in professional development for themselves and their clients now this hypothetical client is giving us
Only a snippet a snapshot into their life if we had them in front of us we would do our due diligence and interview them in depth with plenty of time for questions answers follow-ups discussion conversation time to unpack their particular case their circumstances and be able to help them walk them through
Strategizing their next move right so they write our hypothetical client writes I recently accepted a job offer and selected a start date of May 8th which is a little more than three weeks away yeah and that is a little more than three weeks away I’m an assistant to the executive
Assist I’m an assistant to the executive so they’re an executive assistant nice I’m an assistance to the executive in a small organization okay okay I’ve been in the rule two and a half years and prior to that role prior to that the rule okay sorry I misread that I skipped the word there
I’ve been in the role 2.5 years and prior to that because there’s no [ __ ] comma here prior to that the rule was vacant for a period of time and in parentheses they include several months potentially just under a year due to hiring freeze during covid so the department isn’t in Dire Straits
Without me not that it’s ideal either but anyway I truly adore my boss they say okay okay well again we don’t know how emotionally invested our hypothetical clients is in their work right if they’re doing it for the Love of the Game or because they feel a personal
Connection with their boss and their colleagues they’re in the organ is they’re in the organization what we do know is that the organization could in theory survive without them if they survived some time that is during covid an extended period of time months bordering on a on a year without someone
In that position right so they could make do without our hypothetical client not the most optimal position to be in but but at the same time it lets us know at least they should give a should clue a work hypothetical client into the fact that two weeks three weeks more than two
Weeks notice I mean wouldn’t necessarily impact them they could turn around and cut you the day that you give them notice right it’s not unheard of standard practice I feel like most most all professionals would give two-week notice I mean in today’s day and age [ __ ] you can give
One hour notice you could just not show up no call no show and just never show up again if they call you tell them to tell them where to send your last check right most all jobs in today’s day and age in western civilization right in Western Society are
Fire at will or at will employment it used to be called the fire at world but I feel like that term has some uh what’s the term what’s the uh what’s the term I’m looking for has some conceptual violence to it fire at will and it just got politically corrected
You know it’s it’s gotten censored over time and now it’s just at will at will employment employed at will that means essentially that you could leave at any point in time with or without a reason just like your manager could fire you let you go terminate your employment
The moment you walk in for no reason at all right unless unless they’re breaking some type of federal statute or discriminating against you for I don’t know any number of protected grounds if you belong to a protected class and uh and uh yeah I mean if they don’t
If they don’t have grounds that violate federal statute if they don’t have grounds that violate federal statute they can let you they cannot did I just use the double negative I use the double negative I double negative myself if they terminate you with grounds that violated federal
Statute there you go Alex there you go and it’s against the law you have a potential suit against them right but you have a case possible case but our hypothetical clients isn’t giving us any of that that was just a tangent so I do apologize but they claim
I truly adore my boss so they’ve got some emotional investment into it when they continue writing I wouldn’t have entertained a new job if it weren’t for the exact role I was hoping for and this is whether or not to give more than two weeks notice leaving a position
That could potentially survive without you for a role in a a role that is exactly what you are looking for I mean sure it’s nice it’s uh courteous it’s it’s respectable that you want to give them more than three weeks more than two weeks notice I mean
I suppose it would give them time to find and train a replacement for you in your absence and and I feel like you could leave with a more stronger bridge I mean if you’re not Burning Bridges right if you’re not just ducking out last at the 25th hour letting them
Know oh I’m not showing up to work that’s burning a bridge of sorts right and you’re definitely not Burning Bridges by leaving with two weeks notice leaving with more than two weeks notice I mean you could you could potentially go down as somebody they would call back
In the future if they somehow change the position you’re in now if they augment it with different responsibilities and I don’t know better pay better compensation if you haven’t explored that with your current employer to make it the position you’re looking for instead of leaving the organization
Then that’s on you right maybe maybe you’re not that assertive maybe you’re not gonna uh pick up the spear and become the spearhead take this [ __ ] by initiative by proposing changes of your own right you’re just an executive assistant right maybe you don’t want to step on anybody’s toes
I get it it’s understandable does it mean that you can’t take your feelings for your [ __ ] manager and turn them into something lucrative into something I mean lucrative like you’re going to be profiting off of them but you could turn it into something productive which in turn could become could be profitable
Not just for the organization but for you right um the hypothetical client here doesn’t tell us they have an amicable or a friendly or a strong uh relationship with their manager so again this this feeling the sentiment could be only one way and the manager doesn’t think about them ever
Which is a [ __ ] position to be in and doesn’t lend any strength or credibility to the idea that our executive assistant our hypothetical executive assistant client could make these changes the way they would like instead of just jumping ship and leaving right which I’m not too
I mean do what you want right but the goal is to create strong ties within your Professional Network and if you have a potentially strong tie in the organization you’re in now who’s to say you can’t go out of your way a little bit investigate to explore research some interview some more
With I mean within the organization you’re in now right and explore options and opportunities to pull the the right strings and turn this position into into what you see it being the most profitable into how you want to see it work for you professionally that’s how you elevate yourself as an individual
To the corporations level and that way when you could work across with them instead of just working for them right you you would necessarily Elevate yourself from an executive assistant to one of the executives if not a consultant to the executives or to the organization but that’s more higher
Level thinking higher level strategy and if you’ve been paying attention this long I pull out those gems every other episode and that’s what clients come to us for granted there is some risk this is always risk when you’re making moves when you’re running and gunning learning to shoot from the hip
There’s always risk our rates are more than fair and we help you identify and maximize these opportunities to develop yourself and if whether or not you want to continue with the same organization our goal is to help you develop professionally or help the client sorry helping the client develop professionally
Have to watch how I how I word things I don’t want you to think you’re the client just yet if you know us that you owe us all right all right continuing they’re right should I let them know ASAP my intentions to resign to allow the additional time to begin recruiting and
Tying up Loose Ends okay that’s let’s consider it that’s really considerate right we said that that’s respectable that is respectable especially if you’ve kept solid connections a solid working relationship with your colleagues with your manager with the organization on the whole right it’s not necessary but respectable
They write the chances of them letting me go is never none but very unlikely plus I wouldn’t be in a financial crisis if they did anyway dog I think I think this hypothetical client is just talking themselves into giving them that notice now right you you could give them two weeks notice now
And just if it’s three weeks if it’s a three week window you have give them notice now take your two weeks up front and enjoy a week vacation a week break you’re not suffering for money you won’t go hungry or so you right here right you won’t you won’t uh lack necessities
You’ve either got some form of savings or some form of help or assistance to tide you over that you could uh dig into so I I don’t know what the hold up is I think you could take advantage of the fact that you could uh cash in this so any any Social Capital
You might have accrued while you were there right and either help train or help recruit and train you know your replacement or uh tie up the Loose Ends and what if they do cut you off the next day but you left on a positive note I mean
That’s always the goal is to leave on a positive note you never know when you might run into them again in the field unless it’s outright Bad Blood push comes to shove blow comes to blow and I don’t know you’re you’re using office supplies office equipment against one another
That’s some corporate Cowboy [ __ ] yeah it won’t come to that necessarily but it’s respectable if you give it to them earlier it’s more respectable that I mean it’s more respectable if you give it to them earlier two weeks that’s a standard practice right that’s an industry that’s an industry
Standard in almost all Industries more than two weeks I mean we’re talking because you’re taking a special consideration they give them more notice and they should recognize that in theory but we need to have the hypothetical client in front of us to ask them to uh to probe what the culture
Of the organization looks like what the hierarchy looks like and the the relationships that they’ve kept and what exactly informs this adoration they have for their boss so they say the chances of them letting me go is never none but very unlikely plus I wouldn’t be in financial crisis if they did anyway
They do not have a history of doing this to others okay so they don’t have a history of letting people go uh prematurely upon them giving notice I mean that’s not a guarantee that they won’t do it to you but I mean given their track record
And the fact it’s uh we’re not in any type of social mandate or lockdown at the moment I mean your position isn’t in Jeopardy because of some uh what’s the term called because of some respiratory disease protocol so they finish off here other than the potential of getting let
Go early that doesn’t seem plausible are there any other cons of giving a three-week notice instead of two weeks now there is one glaring area that I haven’t even tapped into and I don’t necessarily like to unless the facts the facts or the client lends themselves into exploring the more
Nefarious side of corporate as of now we don’t see any ill will or ill intent on either or from either party so I don’t necessarily want to explore the possibilities of skullduggery backstabbery and sabotage right it is possible right I did somewhat allude to it if this adoration this our hypothetical
Client has for their boss is only one way it’s not reciprocated at all the boss could pull the rug from up under your feet right could find I mean if if they played into your hand and actually asked you where you’re interviewing I mean if they wanted to keep you there
With them they could seek out your prospective employer and let them know I don’t know you’re a piece of [ __ ] or unhireable or blackball you and trap you in a sense now I don’t like like I said I don’t like speaking on that especially when the questions are posed in a positive manner
But that is one other one other alternative to consider okay you The Listener can take notes if you want to learn more reach out to us we’re happy to explore it with your circumstances we’re not going to hypothesize or or speculate with the hypothetical clients facts here because
We don’t want to sew any of those seeds or spin up any of that Karma right but I feel like I’ve answered the question pretty thoroughly I think we can move on down to the comments here and critique some of them maybe the redditors have similar stance on
Two week or three week or however many number of week notices two weeks like I said is standard practice anything more is respectable right it’s as if the employee is giving the organization an elevated degree of deference it’s like they they hold them at and higher esteem higher regard
And not give them less than two weeks right if you give them like a week notice hey I’m leaving in five days that’s going that may put your hiring manager or your direct supervisor into a scramble to find somebody to fill your spot in such a short period of time
For two weeks I mean if the organization is competent enough and appropriately structured two weeks is sufficient time to hire somebody and bring them on to cover for you three weeks again I mean it’s pushing it somewhat but again we don’t know if this is the hypothetical client’s first
Job it’s the first job they fell in love with or it’s the it’s the first good or manager they had hence the Adoration maybe they’re one in a million manager and I don’t wanna I don’t wanna feel guilty if we’re leaving my manager out to dry all right I did my manager dirty
Somehow so you want to give them more advanced notice than just the two weeks I get it I get it it’s understandable the first comment here writes I’d give the two weeks now so you can get a gap between jobs would be a nice little breather yeah hey I I did pose
That too they give us the facts for that so we could we could make that perfectly reasonable inference I mean we’re not making any assumptions like well why don’t you just give two weeks and Coast for the week that you don’t have a job no you there wouldn’t even be coasting
They won’t be hurting right if they have a savings uh if if they won’t be going hungry they could probably take a little road trip take a little mini vacation or a stay Kate not a staycation right staycation is uh I guess there’s two ways to view a
Staycation there’s where you leave for a foreign country and you stay there for an extended period of time or staycation is where you stay domestically and you explore domestically I mean there’s also that right either or it’s apparent that the hypothetical client doesn’t doesn’t even have a need
For a job for the three weeks right so giving them the two weeks they are they are already rolling the dice on the fact that the organization could cut them loose tomorrow and still they won’t be in any type squeeze between a rock and a hard place in terms of money and
Finances right they’re set they’re pretty much good until they start their next position and that’s a great place to be in that’s a good spot to be in so I would give that comment uh what is it called a plus one or a boat I would I
Would vote that comment up the second comment here writes I vote for the two-week notice suggestion to allow a much-deserved break between the old and new job you’ve earned the downtime and it might be a while until you have the chance to take a break like that as a new employee congrats
Again with the two-week suggestion it’s just that two weeks is a standard practice and I think while I appreciate I appreciate these comments because they’re really harping on the standard practice of two weeks and then taking a break between the old job and the new job I I approached I approached the clients
Like I do with every client it’s like a new case and with every Case Case by case it isn’t always open and shut it isn’t always black and white and that’s why clients come to us as corporate Cowboys to inform an opinion with with various angles can’t say all angles
It’s very difficult to cover it’s very difficult to cover all angles and that entails extended engagement and higher rates because there’s just more due diligence involved exceedingly more due diligence but it is possible it is possible to get surgical with this [ __ ] it’s as much an art as it is a science
And vice versa that being said um analyzing and I think digging down into the reason even the reason why the hypothetical client posed this question on Reddit right exposed themselves made made opened up themselves making themselves vulnerable in a sense right the fact they even posed this question out in The Ether
Whether or not to give more than two weeks I get the feeling right I get the feeling which these two comments we just read aren’t really touching on but I get the feeling the hypothetical client knows that two weeks is normal it’s a standard practice right but they’re asking what are the
Cons to giving more and the first two comments they didn’t address any of the cons oh what the cons is that you left you’ll have to work the three weeks you’re there and you won’t have that extra week between the old job and the nude like these [ __ ]
Just don’t want to work right but you look at the flip side you’ve got three weeks to tie up any Loose Ends and strengthen any ties you already have there like I said it’s more respectable in in some circles it’s viewed as more respectable so you’re definitely not
Burning Bridges and you could be fortifying those bridges that already exist are there cons I mean I gave you one or two of the cons right if we’re talking it’s gold buggery and [ __ ] it’s possible but they’re not readily apparent given the facts that our hypothetical client
Left for us here if we had them in front of us like I said we could give a better informed opinion but that would require some face-to-face time some face-to-face time and we wouldn’t even show faces on Zoom I I would much rather not see your face either right so
We would have cameras off but we could at least uh schedule a call and go back and forth a little question on answering some follow-ups and really drill down on your circumstances in your situation and find whether or not any one of the cons any cons might
Outweigh all the pros and the pros really uh are highlighted by the fact that standard practice being two weeks three weeks is just more advanced notice for both of you guys you’re letting them know you’re on your way out and [ __ ] you might give them the opportunity to come back and ask you
Can you stay will you stay for more money for uh elevated position more title more higher rank right but if uh if the hypothetical client hasn’t explored that with their current organization who’s to say that they’re gonna start by negotiating a a better position at the new place and their compensation
Right like I don’t want to throw too much dirt on the hypothetical client but it also seems to me that that they haven’t completely explored their options in their current position before making this transition I just I get the feeling it’s it’s intuition at this point and
I’ve been right in the worst ways possible damn there’s a phrase I haven’t used in a short while I guess I mean I’ve said it in my mind but verbally being right in the worst way possible it’s a gift and a curse but again it’s some corporate Cowboy [ __ ]
When you can peer around the corner when you can see around the corner and you know how to Apex properly that’s besides the point no pun intended have a good one
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