To actually either B That’s right good evening evening good evening welcome To session of RC as you can tell Seminary extraord uh and Sean’s his passed away a few weeks ago CIA with his family at her funeral so I was with today me a good night we’re talking about divine revelation sacred scripture and tradition the way that God has revealed himself to
Us before we begin that I’m going to invite David up here to talk about the psalm through PSM 27 and just this one’s about just trusting in God and thought was a good one like we’re kind of a point where probably most curiosity really trying to to discern
And figure out what what God is trying to do you guys in this so This Psalm is just all about trusting in God trusting in his his trusting that good yeah wants happy and content at the end of this all and so just placing your
Trust in him alone and we kind of were talking about that as a group leaders last we just like outside of all the intellectual and learning there’s also a hard and just like invite you guys to like dive into that deeper as we go just just really entrusting
This path to God and to his plan up to you and just seek him the Lord is my life and my salvation whom should I fear the lord is theold of my life of whom I be afid when evildoers on me to Dev my my adversaries and enemies fall even
If an army en camps against me my heart will even if War breaks out against me I will not have my trust sh there’s only one thing I ask of the Lord just one thing I seek to dwell in the house of the Lord all the days of my
Life so that I may enjoy the beauty of the Lord G on his Temple for you will hide me in his shelter in times of trouble you will conceal me under the cover of his tent and place me high upon a rock even now my head is raised high
Above my enemies suround in his T I will offer sacrifices with joy shouts I will sing and CH praise to the Lord oh Lord hear my voice when I cry out be merciful to me and answer me my heart says of you seek his face it is your face oh Lord
That I see do not hide your face from me do not turn away your servants in Anger you who have been my help do not reject or forsake me oh God my Savi father and mother the Lord will me up teach me your way Lord lead me along Lev path because
My enemies do not aband me to the will of my adversaries Witnesses have against mea for violence andent will place your hope in the Lord be strong and courageous in your hearts and place your hope in the David and then the next we’re [Applause] have hello everyone um super excited to give
My testimony tonight uh transparently I think this is like the second or third time I’ve ever told my testimony in public um so this might be the largest Crow um and sometimes I honestly struggle to share my testimony uh because when I normally think about testimonies and conversion stories you
Think of super powerful impactful struggles shout out to my boy na crankfield who had tough upbringing convert at 13 and all this good stuff where comparatively um I have been super blessed with my upbringing um but when I think about uh you know any testimony think all of our testimonies are
Important doesn’t matter how you know big how complicated um God still cares about every single testimony conversion in this room and when I you know really prayed upon it um two things really stood out to me and I think if you’re really going to fully love God love
Jesus and also fully love the Catholic faith my two big themes are you have to have a heart conversion in intellectual conversion uh and it doesn’t matter which one comes first everybody’s different um some of you might have an intellectual you know conversion to start I say most people will probably
Have the heart uh conversion but those are my two U big them you got to have heart you got to have the intellect so where my conversion starts I was super Blessed Like I said I am a cradle Catholic um so my parents Mass every Sunday they were super involved in
The church um my parents had like prayers like prayer groups and all this stuff so was always very familiar with Jesus the Catholic faith um so I was very blessed to have that example in my life but when I really started growing up and in high school the heart wasn’t
There most of my thoughts of church and prayer um and God was like kind of very old testament very much rules and law um and there was all these rules to it um but I didn’t really have the heart there um it wasn’t until my junior year of high school um
My one of my close friends actually committed suicide and I will never forget the morning when I walked down my mom told me broke down um and that time I was just I was just so angry I was so angry at god um was really the first
Time that I had my grandmother’s past and stuff but it just um at that age uh it was confusing uh wondering how this would happen uh and truly I always had a Crossroads with God I could have either turned away from God uh and been mad at God or I could have
On this path of trust in God and really opening my heart to him for the first time and luckily I went to a all boys uh Catholic Jesuit school um shout out M Jesuit um and with that um that day I’ll never forget I was sitting in our Chapel
Um crying it was the first time I actually prayed where I wasn’t just Ling I was just listening um I was listening to God and I was saying like God if you’re out there if you’re real if you love me speak to me um and you’ve had
Kind of that heart conversion you kind of know that God likes to whisper um and it was the first time where I kind of like said take my heart gave him that permission and weirdly enough through that prayer I just heard love Brotherhood uh didn’t know what it meant at the
Time and um so fast forward a few months that was kind of the first time I get got my heart started to fall more in love with him uh fast forward a few months when you go to a Catholic school I was going to ask father Sean if this
Happens up M um but you go on a retreat called Kyros chyos depending on your pronunciation um but it’s a very powerful Retreat for three days you’re in with your other classmates um each day has talks Reflections silent time prayer you’re in the woods it’s incredible a bunch of bonding
Time and during the time of prayer and reflection um I again asked God for to enter my heart and I just listened to him and the room kind of like disappeared it was the first time in my life in my heart I felt peace and completeness um and it was a feeling
That’s very hard to describe but I feel like if people in this room have kind of given your heart um to God and you know that God is in you with you it’s answer you have that peace and that completeness it’s very hard to Des
Describe but you never want to let it go um so um during was there’s actually an open mic night and a lot of guys would get up and share about their story some of their conversions a lot of their hardships during their life and um one
Of my classmates got up and he was telling a story and Rewind a little bit when that night that Dom passed away um when I was thinking and praying with God on the kindness and love I had this Ed of like idea I like we can’t be alone be
Brothers right now we have to um you know band together and so I just started inviting all of these my teammates all these guys over uh to our house and I remember this guy was walking away so I’m crying I was yelling out to him I
Was like hey come on over I didn’t really know him at all um but again with that kindness and that Brotherhood I was like you got to come on over you got to come um we have to be together so fast forward back to that M night he went
Through this really intense story and he looked me in the eye and I’ll never forget it and he’s like Michael if it wasn’t for your kindness and your love that night that Don passed away I was actually walking back to my car and I
Was ready to take my own life um and if it wasn’t for your love and for your kindness that day I wouldn’t be here um so it was that it was really the first time that I actually saw God work through me and when you give your heart when you
Give your soul to God God will do you know the strangest things and make an PR you impact not only on your life but on so many other people’s life so that was really my heart conversion um and at the same time there’s definitely um I’m very like a reason
Rational person I love science I love Ma my wife knows I’m terrible at English reading I like numbers so I’ve always liked like the probability of you know it’s like one in 400 trillion that the Universe happened by chance you know like I like the intellectual side too
And my dad’s the same way um and we are very blessed growing up he was very transparent about The Logical side on why we believe there’s God very much like our early classes the philosophy behind you know behind it and it was we were lucky because my parents were definitely great examples
But they also said hey when you go away in college when you go away you have to choose you have to choose for yourself um so they kind of gave us that freedom to think about our faith other faiths my cousin is actually studying to be a presbyterian Pastor my mom’s whole side
Is pres um Protestant um and with there I was like you know my heart was on fire I went to Young Life um and it was it was great I mean the music was awesome the community was awesome um and I truly think the Protestants have really great
On the heart side Jesus loves you and um so I definitely uh had a lot of discussions with my dad uh on that side of intellectual side and I I’ll never forget uh one time I wanted to go to R Church uh instead of mass um I don’t
Know if anybody knows Red Rocks but they again have an awesome Community uh the music’s fantastic and I was my dad was sat me down he’s like why why do you want to go there I was telling you know it makes me feels good I love the music
You know I I can feel it not the same as I do when I go to mass because I always had that thought I didn’t have the intellect side of the Mask it’s like we stand up we sit down we say my heart wasn’t in the Eucharist yet uh
Either um so he he’s like that’s awesome I’m glad to hear it he says I think you’re missing the point of what church is I think you’re missing the point of the mass you know the mass is you’re not there for the music you’re not there for
Yourself you’re there for God to worship God you’re meant to be there to be with God through the Eucharist and it was that was one of the first times in my life I was like ukus thing really is pretty legit um what is this um so I
Really kind of started going down you know the history side of the Eucharist um and I was high school and then I went to college went to the University of Missouri go Tigers um and it’s funny throughout your life the you know the es and flows of your relationship with God because
Transparently I went back to the secular world world I got into a fraternity went to the party culture uh binge drinking sex with multiple women got addicted to weed I was a classic Sunday Catholic I still went to mass but Monday through Saturday I you would wouldn’t bet I was
A Catholic at all um so uh but it’s funny how God called you back CU I was not in a good place and then thankfully in college I met my wife Edy um who saved me from a bunch of sin so thank you shout out Edie um and so to continue
On the the intellectual side she was Lutheran she grew up Protestant um we went to I visit her family in St Louis we’d go to her family’s um church and we’d always had like great open discussions on like what did you think what do you disagree with why do you
Believe this um and there was there many differences but there’s also a lot of similarities um with it as well and we had the honest conversations of why we think one is different or better or right um and honestly I didn’t know my Fai super deeply or super well
She was like why the hell do you believe in the pope who’s why married and I was like I don’t know who doesn’t believe in the pope he’s the best uh I was like what do you mean you don’t follow the pope what do you mean you don’t like
Pray to Mary um so it was awesome because it’s one of the first times also where I was getting that push back and like I had to think deeper I had to think deeper I’m like is this truly what I believe is this truly uh the right
Answer um and it wasn’t until four years ago that Ed and I actually went through rcia um Ed went througha but IA I went througha as well because I learned so much in this class um and this class makes you think um but the heart does matter um this class made me realize
That the Catholic church has such a deep history has such a deep connection to the Old Testament in the New Testament um and made me realize you know I truly felt more deeply in my in my deal more deeply in love with my faith here than I
Ever had in my life um and truly had a better conversion in the true presence of the Eucharist um at the end and even even like a few months ago with the Eucharist you know Revival in continuing my education on the Eucharist uh I’ve completely fell more and more in love
With the Eucharist over the last um few months um and uh with that now I look forward to going to church every sing week when I sit down in Mass after I have the Eucharist and know that God is in me and with me and I’m one with God I
Have that peace again that peace that I had that time that the world melted away that peace and completeness that’s so hard um know to get anywhere else you can only get it with god um so to finish uh wherever you’re at in your faith Journey uh it takes time like I said
I’ve known the Catholic church I’ve been in the Catholic Church um for many years I’m still learning more I’m still falling in love with the faith deeper and deeper and more and more um so I’m still learning uh about the beauties of the church when we talk about these
Saints transparently I don’t know half of them I I’ve heard the most of them I’ll be honest um andbe this cath you don’t know this sa like no I have no idea um but all that doesn’t matter unless and I hope and I pray that you guys have a
Conversion of heart and have a conversion of the intellect because I think you have to have both uh to truly love Jesus Christ and his church so thank you for sting to [Applause] that so like I said tonight we’re going to be talking about divine revelation uh how
God has revealed himself to us uh last week I wasn’t here uh so last week you guys talk about covenants is that right all right so we talked about how salvation history has unfolded over time um before I jump to that I want to go back to the song that we heard
Earlier is so again Psalm 27 verse 7 and8 for those uh following along in their own Bibles or at home and this line struck these L struck me hear oh Lord when I cry aloud be gracious to me and answer me you have said seek my face my heart says to you
Your lord do I seek and as I as I was reflecting on those words um I was just really struck by the fact that the psalmist writes how God says first seek my face he reveals himself in a particular way to the psalmist to seek my face and the Heart
Of the psalmist responds God I I desire to seek your face um and I think we can a lot of times think um take this put it next mouth uh I think a lot of times we can think that um religion is man-made that uh man desires to know God because of some
Defect of our psychology but I mean I I mean our we have this hole in our our brain that doesn’t work right and we think oh there must be a God but I think the psalmist is pointing out that in the depths of every human heart there is this innate desire for
Something greater there’s this innate desire to worship a God and the god that we profess as Catholics is a loving God um and how horrible would God be if you put this desire in our hearts but gave us no way to actually access him that’d be a cruel God would we all
Agree with that thank you yeah good I going to do to Father Sean this means yes this means no but uh yeah okay so I think this is a great place to start our front God has revealed himself to us um and and we talked in those very first weeks about
How we know there is a God through philosophy through our natural reason we know that God exists and father Shan went through the five proofs um one of them is causality one of them is um governance of the world but we can only know so much about God in those ways
We can know that God exists we can know that God is a Creator but that’s not what we profess if we just profess God is Creator I think most people can go on board with that every person you know there’s the old adage there’s no atheist in the
Foxhole and the reason is is because we get to a point in our lives and we know um that we cannot control every aspect of the world so there must be someone out there but if all he us is a clock maker he put the world in motion and forgot about us
Again that’s not someone I want to follow that’s someone that I we should just ignore and go live a life however we want to because in the end life is worthless okay let’s get into it so I’m going to start off with a quote from the catechism uh this is catechism um paragraph
51 it pleased God in his goodness in wisdom to reveal himself and make and to make known the mystery of his will his will was that men should have access to the father through Christ the word made flesh and the Holy Spirit and thus become sharers in the divine
Nature so the catechism in paragraph 51 is teaching us God wants to reveal himself to you God has planned from all eternity to reveal himself to you so uh how has has God revealed himself to us that is a question through each other okay scripture creation good one tradition talk about that one
Um yeah yeah I mean philosophers will will tell you a thousand way ways you know um I’m trying to think who it is one of them said I think it’s I don’t remember but it’s like mozar is God’s revelation that he exists okay yeah there’s something beautiful there there’s something deeper there
Okay so one of the ways we would say is God has revealed himself to us through divine revelation does anyone know what divine revelation is okay divine revelation uh is defined as a means of certain truth of our faith comes not as a result of human reason or
Study but have been revealed to us supernaturally by God so we go back to those early weeks we know God through the cruise of the world through philosophy through our own mind but there’s truth of God that we profess as Christians as Catholics that cannot be known about God uh merely through
Philosophy merely through human reasoning um the quintessential kind of uh one is we profess that God is a trinity three persons one substance one God I I I also like math and three and one uh is not something I can come to uh by reason so there must be something
Revealed and we talked about how has God spoken to us sacred scripture sacred tradition uh Hebrews 1:1 says in many in various ways God spoke to all to our fathers by the prophets but in these last days he has spoken to us by his son whom he appointed the heir of all things
Through whom also he created the world so uh as you guys were looking at last week the covenants we see that God has revealed himself progressively first to a couple then to a family then to a tribe then to a nation um and in Jesus Christ he reveals himself to the whole world
Um and and one thing that we profess is why does God reveal these things and we profess this because God desires all men to be saved uh we talked about back in the day about original sin uh shout out to my last time up here uh and like the
Fall of Man and that man needs a savior because of our first parents because sin enter the world through Satan uh man needs a savior and we believe that the one Med between God and Humanity as Jesus Christ um and that he uh bridges that and that we must be
In relationship with him to be in relationship with the father everyone tracking we good so far okay St Thomas aquinus uh in his su theolog su theologica uh say the reason why divine revelation is necessary even for the things that we can know about God uh By Nature is because uh without divine
Revelation it would be known by few I think I put this here uh it’ be known by few uh after a long time and with a mixture of erors um we can look at nature we can look at the world and we can know about
God but we can’t know God as he truly is is why we might ask um God is infinite man’s mind is finite uh God is beyond uh human reason because he is the creative reason therefore what is uh infinite and great cannot be confined to the finite
Um yeah so I mean that’s that’s kind of the quick quick answer of why we cannot know by reason that God uh things about God any questions about divine revelation as a general relance statement so far okay all right so we talked about the two ways uh sacred scripture and
Tradition so let’s start with sacred scripture it’s the Common Ground um so how would someone Define sacred scripture writing that was influenced by the Holy Spirit okay the word of God the word of God if we look on our um handout there’s his list on that front page sacred
Scripture so sacred scripture is uh the written down Testament of God uh inspired by the Holy Spirit um so God is the primary author of sacred scripture but he uses human beings to write it down it’s not like we believe that down from heaven came this
Book and you received it and okay we got to take scripture No god used human intellect human Minds human passions to write out his story for mankind uh we as Catholics profess that the book of the Bible are accepted as sacred and canonical whole and entire
With all their hearts um so we believe that the books that are in the scripture are in sacred scripture are um revealed by God to be through his through his church to be the authentic work that he desired to be scripture no more no less
Uh God is the author God is the one guiding that uh God had them consigned to writing only what he wanted them in no more I that one uh the inspired books teach the truth uh since therefore all the inspired authors of sacred uh writers affirmed should be regarded as
Affirmed by the Holy Spirit we must acknowled that the books of sacred scripture firmly faithfully and without error teach the truth which God for the sake of our Salvation wish to see convited to Sacred scripture and that’s from Dave baraboom paragraph 11 and then the one thing that we also
Profess is uh scripture can only be rightly understand when read in the living tradition of the church and when illuminated by the Holy Spirit um yeah so one thing we profess is as Catholics is that scripture has more than just the literal sense in which we can read it so
We would say there’s four different senses of sacred scripture the literal the allegorical the moral and the uh anagogical um which you can see on the front and it continues onto the back uh so the form so the literal could be the literal meaning of the text uh all the
All their SES flow from this one the allegorical the sign value of the text as it is prefigured or symbolized The Mystery of the faith moral the events of scripture provided us an example of how or how not to live and the anagogical the events interpreted in terms of Eternal Eternal
Significance and St John cian from the 360s kind of talked about this for Jerusalem specifically uh he said Jerusalem can be taken in the four senses historically or the literal as the city of the Jews allegorically as the Church of Christ right so we see like Zion or Jerusalem
We can read that as in the allegorical sense that the psalmist is talking about God I’m sorry about the church anagogical as the Heavenly city of God which is the mother of us all and the typological which is the anagogical I’m sorry nope sorry yeah it’s allegorical um yeah and somewhere else I
Was talking about like David uh David was a man who David go so this was a historical event um moral you know God’s going to help us persevere against evil um God will in the end help us overcome evil so that we can spend eternity with him and allegorical yeah Christ will be
Victorious over our enemies any questions about sorry any questions about scripture I am going fast we got one back here yes um can you explain a little bit more about anagogical yeah um could you repeat sure the question was can can we explain more anagogical
Um so this would be like in reference to end times so like how is this going to affect like how is this for eternity um if our goal in life is to spend eternity with God uh and God’s trying to get us there he’s going to point towards that
Um so so if we if we read like um some of the um what are those called look at them holy SC Parables uh we read The Parables uh thatc coming Sunday Parable is of the 10 virgins five of them are wise and five of them are
Foolish uh the five foolish ones uh when the variety room is announced to be coming they to leave to go buy more oil uh the five that were wise had enough oil to light the way for the bridegroom they go into the banquet the five unwise
Ones are left outside we could read that and say oh Jesus is telling us you know be prudent but we can also read it as uh there is a final judgment and if you’re ready to enter into the to the big with Beast of Heaven you will enter if you’re
Not you won’t Mak sense perfect anyone else so the moral sense would be like um yeah but what does that mean so and I would also say not every piece of scripture can uh easily identified with all four and yeah that’s where I like that the moral
Um so that one I would say maybe uh so let’s say the oil is Charity love of God love of our neighbor and so the moral sense would be you have to love your neighbor like so you could read that as like oh to gain oil I must love my
Neighbor does that make sense so it’s it’s commanding a moral action it’s right exactly books of the Bible how um yes great question so the question was ultimately the question is why is the Catholic church Bible bigger sorry my brain uh sometimes likes to do side
Things uh there’s this one meme of Pope Francis from when he first was like made Po and someone’s like bringing the book of uh it’s a Bible it’s a the book of the gospels but it’s it’s a big giant book he has this like Inquisitor face and the
Cap is like does this Bible feel lighter than it should you know kind of like okay so why does the cathic church have more books um sorry let me process that answer so so there’s always been books uh from the beginning of the church that have been debated we have to acknowledge
It um and and the reasons are is because they were widespread they didn’t have internet uh so they couldn’t just send emails back and forth and there was lots of books floog grounds um the church has always professed that these books are the books that we hold in our scripture are
Divinely inspired and sacred Martin Luther uh during the Reformation um rejected these books uh and he said that the reasoning why and I’m not the Bible scholar uh but my understanding the reason why the B rejected these books was because the Hebrew the Old Testament books that he
Rejected were not originally written in Hebrew and he said first century Jesus Christ would have known Hebrew and he would have only used Hebrew text we only have them in Greek therefore Jesus would not have used them um fast forward 2 1900 and some OD years
Dead Dead Sea Scrolls are being found uh from the people that are close to Jerusalem the um I forgot their names they were this sect of of Judaism yes the scenes yes my my scripture uh teacher is rolling in his bed right now very angry at me um
The ases uh and we find these books in Hebrew so Martin Luther who didn’t have that information said well we didn’t have an Hebrew Jesus would have used them um we can get a little jappy and say those books didn’t necessarily fit with Martin Luther’s ideology and so he
Rejected them um but the church is always profess of and I mean as early as the 300s 200s when we’re combining all these scriptures U and to say what is canonical what’s not canonical we were already saying that those books were canonical in the year 300 because uh
They would have been used in the churches in the liturgies from the beginning of the days U since the first century um Martin Luth I believe uses uh Jamia as his main kind of push back against some of the books which uh was like ritical School uh after the fall of
Jerusalem they were coming together like okay what it be and they were they were debating about certain books uh and he uses that as his proof I think it’s a weak argument I don’t know it super well but what I do know of it sounds like
They had an argument he’s like well they were arguing so therefore we can reject it but it’s a pretty weak argument if you ask so some of the books that aren’t included in protestantes have like unknown office and sure so just to respond firstly to the unknown authors um like Roman Romans
Is debated on who the author of Romans is um so yeah and there’s lots of Bible there’s lots of books especially from that time period where the author is ofure the writings of Solomon and the Psalms are tributed David but some of them are not tributed David
Okay um yeah so I’m saying that there has to be a truth that uh this is the question that we’re ultimately going to ask is did Jesus Christ established a church and did he give it authority to um teach without error uh I’m going to propose yes uh
Because I’m studying to be a Catholic priest um and that’s one of the things I have to promise to do but it’s not just like oh I’m Catholic therefore I TR I mean if we look in scripture we’re going to find um that Jesus established a church you are Peter
Upon This Rock I will build my church um he gives authority to the apostles the father has sent me and so I will send you uh Jesus comes to Proclaim Truth uh and he’s going to send his Apostles to send truth as well uh so I would say
That the Catholic church has the authority to definitively say which books are in the Bible and they had specific um criteria for what was going to end up in scripture um and they are Guided by the Holy Spirit the holy spirit is the author the holy spirit is
The one who is guiding the church and preventing her from error would be my quick answer because we can look at from the other end and say um well humanly speaking like we can come up with things but God is the is the source of revelation God is the source of uh like
The truth and he’s the one pushing from behind to push this into our world yes I also asks so like the gospel ofy magdal the Gospel of Thomas there’s like a bunch that like balize thank you was very something remember is like from like the Protestant and Catholic perspective like
Your new testament is the same the deated books are in the Old Testament and you trust the New Testament books and then I think a good question to follow up on if you are struggling with that thought is okay why do I trust that the New Testament books are the inspired
Word of God and who kind of collected those writings and those letters and canonize them and I know that for me was something when I found out that the new test you know kind of collected and really established as Sacred by the Catholic Church originally that to me
Was really um was really powerful when I wasney and that is going to be a perfect place for a break Bri is yelling at me in handw back there so I think we’re saying 10 15 minutes uh and I have two questions okay good uh so I don’t you
All let your table people know but bathroom first break uh questions first but my two questions are favorite book in the Bible or passage if you’ve never read the Bible and don’t have a favorite passage I want to hear your favorite piece of Shakespeare and uh this one I think is a
Fun one what is your favorite family tradition and how did it start no me play a Character There’s a day Look I don’t in it used to be spider got don’t try To three minute warning three minute warning know what I’m talk e Any Everyone else like sing Good Everyone all right we’re going to get going again we got lot to cover we have good table talk really quick yes please do so we’re going to arst okay we’re going to move on from scripture because we have to keep moving and we’re going to start start talking about
Tradition we’re going to talk about tradition so we we we started out the Night by saying God has revealed himself to us um through nature but then there’s divine revelation there’s Revelation where God has revealed himself in a particular way to reveal a truth about him that cannot be known
Uh through natural reason but must be revealed to us by God directly and this is what we mean by divine revelation and in the church we say that there’s two modes of divine revelation with a singular Source sacred scripture and sacred tradition so what do we when I say
Sacred tradition what do I mean uh I will answer that myself um and if you want to follow along on your papers on the back sacred tradition consist in the unwritten or oral tradition handed on by the apostles tra tradition has its source into the teachings and words of
Jesus as well as what they themselves received the apostles by the Holy Spirit if we go back in our history of the church we can go back to St basil the great 375 in his work on the Holy Spirit and this is uh 2766 for those of you uh the desire to
Look this up once you get home St Basel the great uh so St Basel the great this is 376 uh this is right after the Council of NAA and the First Council of n uh and they are fighting the Aran heresy uh which um yeah denies Jesus Christ truly
Is the Son of God uh they say that he is not the Son of God um and St basil in this is talking about the Holy Spirit this is a different work not necessarily refuting this uh on sorry not refuting Daran heresy but is refuting another heresy about the Holy
Spirit and this is what he says of the dogmas and messages preser preserved in the church some we possess from written teachings and others we receive from the tradition of the Apostles handed on to us in Mystery in respect to piety both of the same for both are of the same
Force no one will contradict any of these no one at any rate who is even moderately versed in the matters of Eccles matters ecclesiastical matters of the church uh indeed were we to try to reject Unwritten Customs as having no greater Authority we would unwittingly injure
The gospel in its vitals or rather we reduce Christian message to Mere terms um I was I was reading uh one of I went back to one of my textbooks uh as you do when you’re uh super excited not scared at all to teach about scripture and
Tradition um and the book is called faith comes from what is heard by lawren spold he’s a theology professor at uh Kenrick in St Louis um and he’s quoting Benedict the 16 from one of his Wednesday audiences and Ben uh Benedict is talking about Jesus talking uh in Matthew 10 uh sorry
Yeah Matthew 105 and what he’s talking about is is Jesus says I was sent only to the L sheep of the House of Israel and then similarly in a similar way he seems to restrict the the mission of the 12 and when he’s sending up the 12 to go preach
The gospel uh he says go only to the to the house of Israel and as I read that today I was kind of struck I don’t know why uh it’s like hit me but uh Jesus Christ himself you know he says to the Canaanite woman I’ve only come to
The house of Israel and it’s not right to uh feed the dogs when you know you’re trying to feed the children my version of the New Testament is 220 pages long so Jesus Christ comes into the world he is the Son of God he is God incarnate uh he lives for 33
Years professes gospel in 3 years uh and is offering salvation to all mankind but he says I’m only here for the Israelites and me in the year 2023 get 220 pages and I’m supposed to live a moral life I’m supposed to know everything about I’m supposed to know about God
Um but I wasn’t there and to me that that seemed a little unfair like really this is all I get is 220 Pages uh in seminary you know one of the things we’re doing is is working on human formation you know trying to be the best
Man possible so we go out to the parishes and uh not hurt people by being broken ourselves um and self-help books normally have more than 220 Pages um and if human authors are willing to write that about a single subject why would God be limited by 220
Pages in The RSV St Ignatius Catholic edition there must be something more um I was talking to my friend John and preing for this and uh he was he brought to mind um this other book the meaning of tradition by y kongar he’s a Dominican Cardinal from the last century and
He just talked about he he was reminiscing about this line that he remembered reading when we were reading that book um of how the apostles did everything with Jesus for three years they they walked with him uh in a real way and Jesus say uh so much
More than what’s written down in the Gospel of John uh the end of John John 20 Jesus says that’s right John says 20 verse 30 now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of his disciples which were not written in this book but these are written that you may believe that Jesus
Is the Christ the son of God and that believing you may have life in his name so John towards the end of his gospel he’s literally saying I didn’t write everything down this is good there’s lots of good things in here it’s uh inspired by the holy spirit it’s infallible uh it’s without
Error but there’s a lot more to this man that can be written down in my 220 pages so why is sacred tradition this teaching of the church that is handed down not written but orally why is it so important to our understanding of divine revelation um firstly tradition is Chon
Chronologically prior to Sacred scripture before we ever wrote down even the I mean um we say we teach that and we believe that Moses is the author of the first first five books of Genesis um but I don’t we know that Moses wasn’t there in the garden with Adam and Eve it
Wasn’t Adam Eve and Moses and we just cross out his name uh he was not there uh he is the descendant of Adam and Eve but somehow he knew the story uh he knew the story this is passed down to him um and so in the story of Noah wasn’t written down by
Noah it was written down by Moses again this was orally transmitted so it seems like God from the beginning of time has transmitted things orally in the New Testament same thing before uh the gospels were written down before the Epistles were written down um everything would have been handed on orally people
Would have told stories about Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit was guiding them to tell that story well okay that’s one uh scripture without tradition is a dead letter uh uh into this I’m going to if you look on your back page uh right underneath the title sacred
Tradition I didn’t say you stole the money what does that mean what does that mean I did not say you stole the money right so so yeah so so this is the the mind game so I didn’t say you stole the money but breed it right I didn’t do it
Uh I didn’t say you stole the money but I’m going to um everyone get the the mind game right I can go there’s six of them but I think we get it right that there’s different ways that we can interpret this simple sentence I didn’t say you
Stole the money in six different ways six words 220 Pages um which one is more likely to be interpreted incorrectly this one okay good good logic test that one worked um yeah and so so what is tradition it’s the living embodiment of Jesus Christ as he walked seen by the
Apostles uh and then Contin down so that we can actually so the scripture becomes uh a solid rule that we can say Okay um if I was to come and say like oh the tradition has always been that we use Oreo cookies to celebrate the
Eucharist we would go back and say no uh took bread it doesn’t say Oreo cookies scripture becomes the solid piece that we can go off of um so that would be a false false tradition right that’s that’s not tradition in case everyone’s wondering in case any my professors are watching
Tradition does not say that Oro cookies were used um yeah so this this idea that um without tradition uhor without tradition scripture is a dead letter because it can be interpreted in so many different ways but there has to be a truth there does that make
Sense yeah and and I just going back to even St basil we can go back into the early centuries of the church the Gnostic Gospels we were talking about this as well people at some point realized that this this Christianity thing was taken off and uh Fallen human
Nature says how do I get on board and how do I get uh Fame popularity and money um and so a lot of Heretics uh use scripture to defend their their their falsehoods their lies um they you know there’s the line of uh me and the F the
Father is greater than I and uh Aras loveed no he like proof God Jesus didn’t say he was God um but tradition tells us no scripture also tells us no there’s other places but with with just scripture uh it’s a lot easier to fall into uh
Heresy father Sean uh Drew this a couple weeks ago and I will draw it again um not very well I was an airine pilot not an artist um supposed to be a stool with three legs not a jellyfish for our SpongeBob friends at home um yeah so we would say that the three
Legs sacred scripture sacred tradition and the miserum magium is from the the Latin word for mag mag it’s same one that comes to magistrate teacher um so we have we have sacred scripture most uh Christians all Christians uh will profess that sacred script scripture is uh divine revelation
It’s God trying to speak to his people but we have this thing called sacred tradition um because we truly believe that Jesus Christ taught his Apostles um and that everything he said was not written down and that it’s super important to know these things because it actually influences how we read
Things how we interpret scripture um yeah and I would say even going back to this whole scripture without tradition is dead Jesus himself had to interpreted the parables in the Old Testaments uh for the apostles for the disciples um we go to uh the gospel and Jesus is
Walking with the disciples back to on the road of toas and uh Jesus asked them what are you like what are you so sad about and uh they said are you only one that does not know the things that have gone to Jerusalem and Jesus says tell me about
Him like Jesus who we thought was the Messiah has been crucified he’s been dead his body’s missing some of them said they’ve been raised but uh yeah like they don’t believe it right that’s why they’re walking to a and Jesus then goes and tells them everything about the Old Testament
Showing like here’s the prophecies that has led us to this point um so these disciples who had been following Jesus were his friends um but were not uh not detaching Authority at the time uh needed this to be interpreted for them and here we are 2,000 years later
Uh and we have the Bible uh but yet we need something to interpret it with and this is what one of things we call sacred tradition uh sacred tradition is also more abundant than sacred scripture uh because again it’s not limited to the number of pages but what was actually
Taught by Jesus to his Apostles uh in totality and I think a lot of times people have this this misconception that um it’s the telephone game misconception okay everyone remembers the game Telephone from grade school um so I started off with Father Shan uh is six feet tall and it ends
With Father Shawn has six feet or whatever and that’s that’s a anyways you get the idea great but that’s not what we profess we profess that this just as the Holy Spirit uh and God is the author and uses human persons to write out sacred scripture and does it all so that
What is contained there uh is only what he wanted no more no less we profess this too with sacred tradition God the holy spirit is the author of sacred tradition and he is the one that preserves it so instead of thinking of it as uh telephone the
Better image is the relay race I used to be a runner ever um and the Baton is sacred tradition and it’s being passed on through the centuries so it was first given to the to the apostles uh they walked with Jesus they saw how he lived he revealed
Things to them in secret he gave them the Holy Spirit uh and we believe that when they passed on that Authority that uh Jesus Christ gave them as Apostles through the laying on hands uh he Al the the tradition was passed on to them St Paul’s talking to St Timothy
Uh telling him uh in case I am delayed um yes stay fast to the Traditions to the teachings that I’ve taught you that you receive to be laying on at my hands um and I I think too so sorry so excited um staus uh he was the year
170ish that’s a very direct year 170ish um and stus was a disciple of St hly carp who was a disciple of St John the Apostle and the Evangelist and um oh I think I do WR oh anyways it’s a beautiful story because St nus in the year 169 170 is an old
Man um living in the middle of a persecution and he’s recollecting to his his disciples the people that he’s uh discipling as a bishop he’s recollecting sitting at the feet of polycarp in in being told everything that polycarp knew which polycarp had received from uh St John and he said ultimately what
He what he says in this in this this passage is I can’t really remember anything else that’s going on around me like it’s like the the old I don’t remember what I had for breakfast but I remember everything about what poly carp told me I can I
Like I can see it I remember where he was sitting I remember how he talked to me I remember his voice because the holy spirit is the one pushing for sacred tradition to be continued on um yeah okay so I’m going to do one more exercise I think uh of why I think
Sacred tradition is super powerful uh I’m going to read to you the obituary of my grandfather Bob was born in a small town of in Locust Gap Pennsylvania his father John passed away when he was 5 years old leaving behind his mother and seven children his mother Regina Jean met and
Mary Paul Winwood who lovingly embraced Bob and his siblings as his own they then had one son Paul together completing their family of eight children Bob grew up in Youngstown Ohio he went to East High School where he played football and was nickn named Wendy at 17 he joined the US Navy he
Served proudly on the USS Hornet during the Korean War he always said that uh that was the best thing that ever that he ever did his ship anchored in San Diego California which led to a visit to his bus buddy from home uh that was living in Glendale
California where he met the love of his life the former Linda velman they married May 8th 1958 Bob worked for stormberg Carlton a small phone company they worked and moved from town to Town the first two years installing phone switches they lived in different locations in California Glendale Garden Grove and for
A year and a half back home in Ohio before finally setting with her now five children in a little town called Corona California they had many great memories uh Bob was it volunteered as an empire for little league was active at St Edward’s Parish school as a parent and a
Parent Club president he also was the back up dishwasher at on hand for Linda’s job at the live o he was kind and humble a man who was slow to anger after being do diagnosed with macular degeneration and losing his vision 22 years ago he never complained
Or felt sorry for himself he made do and recognized Us by his voice no longer able to drive he became a daycare provider for his grandchildren whom he adored and would always encourage to get an education and have a 5year plan he was a wonderful father and even though
Money was TI growing up he made it fun uh as long as he had his family a cup of coffee a cigarette and a good sea story he was happy who knows my grandfather you know facts about my grandfather you know truths about my grandfather uh he worked at a small
Phone company he smoked a lot um cup of C but do you know this is like the inside story that my Grandpa would visit his sister and my grandpa did not care that he smoked so he’d be running around her house with a cigarette with an ash half the cigarette
Long and my great an would be chasing him around with a uh ashtray trying to catch that Ash as my grandpa was talking yeah Jean blah no because that wasn’t in this obituary of my grandfather but the tradition of my f like I know these things because I walk
With them and they’re real to me and the only thing that’s keeping that memory alive is my human intellect which is pretty bad uh again to my professors at home they know um my my intellect is not the strongest but the church professes and we believe believe that the holy spirit
Is the one keeping all these things together passing this on um again going back to these Heretics they were professing things that could have given people plenty of popularity but the Bishops were like no this is not what we’ve received we know what we received and and it it’s not
Because I mean it’s not only because of what we read in secred scripture but because we know we’ve been taught by the apostles this has been handed down to us by the apostles um yeah um back to the question of like even which books are in the
Bible we we hold most Protestants will say that the Bible the books in the Bible are the books in the Bible and no more should be added they’re not most Protestants are not going to say that the book of Mary Magdalene ought to be in the Bible
Or yeah any the apocryphal books I’m sorry not apocryphal they will also say that but what I’m trying to say is the Gnostic books they’re not trying to say the Gnostic books will be in there because they believe that these books are the books that belong in the
Bible in no more but why those books we have to ask the question why those books because the Bible doesn’t tell us it’s those books u i mean my Bible does because it’s the table of contents but um like nowhere in actual scripture does it say
In the books of the Bible are Genesis uh Numbers Deuteronomy you know all the way through the books of the Bible somebody at some point had to declare and it wasn’t Jesus Christ we know that because the Bible was not composed in Jesus’s lifetime uh the Bible was not composed in its
Totality in in the form of these are the books of the Bible um in the apostles lifetime at some point in the church history um the church declared these books belong in the Bible but they could only know that because of the Traditions that they received from the church uh from
The apostles to begin with the apostles knew what they were pushing they knew that these were the the reading uh the writings of the Apostles uh and therefore we know these are true um does anyone have a question two uh here right behind each other so we’ll do front and then back
Together out yeah so great question um the answer is yes the answer is also Bri has her hand up can you repeat the question thank you I’m sorry the question was is there a name what is the name of the council that gave us the the U books of the Bible great question
Um if we go back there’s councils and I can’t think of the name of them right now um uh uh Carthage there would have been an a there was a couple African um local councils that defin them and then they were approved by the pope uh but the Canon of scripture was not
Definitively defined so this is how when we talk about uh something father Shan will talk about when he gets back uh the magisterium which is the teaching arm of the church um which is this third uh the church does not define things until they’re challenged so until the
Year 1500 is uh when the Protestants when Martin Luther took out books from the Bible the church had to Define definitively dogmatically that these are the books of the Bible but before that it was taught but not dogmatically defined that doesn’t happen until a TR 1500s before that they were talked about
These are the canons of scripture these are the canons of scripture we find it over and over again uh in earlier councils that these are the canons of scripture but it’s never defined is 100% where if you don’t believe this uh mortal um does that answer your question
Yes okay sorry in the back also as the Shan put write it down on the piece of paper uh and father Johan will answer that next week or next time answers back me wrong but Christians are new new and reformed Jews why is our scripture like different like is Old
Testament vers like the Torah different and also our Traditions like why do Christians not Cate those same ASW okay let me see if I get the question right uh Christians are the Fulfillment of Judaism first part of the question right reformed okay reformed uh and then why
Are our Traditions different and why is our scriptures different yeah so Jesus so we would say that the Old Testament uh the Torah and the the Old Testament writings were in preparation for the coming of Jesus Christ so God from very beginning we go back to Genesis 1 or Genesis 4 the
Fall um go back to Genesis and we see the fall and God makes the promise I’m going to redeem you then we guys last week you guys talked about the Covenant it’s all moving towards this one event in history when God descends from heaven and becomes a man um but God knew that
Because of the fickleness of the human heart that it could not just like he could have showed up day three you know ad fall wait a couple days come down die and save man then but uh he knew uh the I mean this is a little bit speculative theology
Take this with the great assault uh that man uh needed to be prepared to receive this Revelation that God was coming into the world so he actually allows all of Salvation history to happen so that when he prepares to come into the world at a particular moment uh man is ready to
Receive it but the Old Law the law of sacrifice of animals is completed in the sacrifice of Jesus Christ we could slaughter a billion goats 10 billion goats a trillion goats and it doesn’t do uh anything for us because we offended God who is infinite and perfect so the smallest
Um offense against an infinite and perfect being is infinitely in perfectly horing so God who is infinite and perfect had to come into the world and die on a cross because infinitely because he is infinite and perfect can atone that uh so they were all in preparation Jesus Christ definitively
Changes the world in his uh incarnation in death and therefore everything after that is in uh response to the Revelation that Jesus Christ came in the flesh ises that track yeah yeah so we would say that the mass is the Fulfillment of Passover Jesus’s death on the cross is the Fulfillment of
Passover so uh yeah I can’t think of like you know like a good analogy but like yeah in in the natural life like oh I mean some people still do it but uh you get engaged you celebrate it but then you get married it’s kind of weird
To go back and like keep celebrating the engagement you guys like did what you were supposed to do so the same thing with the Passover right like you were we had this this old and now we have this new this better so we don’t need to go back and keep doing
The old because it’s fulfilled totally in Jesus Christ cool perfect um any other questions one yes me yes I’m sorry um Sophia right yeah yes um so when it says in the Bible or somewhere don’t where um that he will make it like to Heaven is it I’ve heard someone said that
Like it’s talking about Catholics and then I’m also curious is could it be um refer also like like few people will go straight toen be Purgatory or so the question was scripture talks about people going to heaven uh is it talking just about Catholics or can it also be talking about purgatory
Um the quick answer is um God has destined all men to be saved uh Every Man Has the destiny of salv Salvation in heaven qualif not every man has to choose to end up in their proper destination my Thanksgiving plans are going to go to
California uh if I decide to get on a train going east towards New York I will end up in New York not in California no matter how much I want to um so I would say that um yeah and and so yeah we we profess Purgatory uh but we also profess that
People that make it to Purgatory will make it to Heaven uh that is also another day uh not today uh because that is uh a lot to impact in our time remaining so great question uh maybe we can write it down and put it in the um
Box for father Sean because he’s not here so you can’t say no uh thank you so much toia for that question div reation does come yeah uh why doesn’t so the question was why doesn’t God just come down again uh why does he make why doesn’t he obvious I would say So there’s no freedom in heaven maybe a scandalous uh thing to hear if you’ve ever heard that before there’s no freedom in heaven why is there no freedom in heaven the perfect good is placed before you in uh man who will always choose the good when a
Perfect good is placed before it will always choose that good so if God was to come down again uh in un unveiled way not as a human person I’m sorry not as a human being um man would choose him okay also God has given us the grace of faith
God has given us something that we can know for certainty that what he’s revealed is true this is Fai um which is a gift from God um and um yeah also I mean this is this is going to be uh the answer that I always hate to hear
But sometimes it’s the only answer you can give it’s a mystery right I I don’t know why God does anything God says uh can you make the sun rise you know can you do anything were you there at the foundation of the world like God who is
Infinite in knowledge knows why he does things and we will in a sense never know everything because God is perfect and has a plan beyond our our understanding and say I don’t know why any of this is happening but I’m GNA just accept that if I didn’t I whatever I want yeah
Um yeah I’d have to go back to like the shy of Faith like um so in the super natural life through baptism through the sacraments we receive the gift of faith which is Supernatural which means uh and in the gift of hope uh so supernaturally I know
Things uh by my baptism uh with certainty even if I don’t understand them fully and then through baptism through the grace uh of the sacraments I have the virtue of hope uh which says that I hope for the things yet like not yet revealed so even though I don’t know
What’s over there uh because of the grace I’ve received in baptism uh in the sacraments I believe uh beyond my ability to actually know things like that aren’t even fully revealed to me so it’s a mystery uh sorry again brain weird things I just recently heard this beautiful definition of the word mystery
And it’s uh un compreh like un um so much truth that like my mind cannot give around it like it’s not just it’s not like oh because sometimes we want to think mystery is like fake or mythical but Myster is really there’s so much truth there my mind can’t comprehend it uh but
Yeah I go back to Faith and Hope being The Virtue that I’ve received through the sacraments through baptism to believe beond my abilities to actually know you talk and Reas ask imag also like that’s kind of and so and I was like sure great question um so frean have it
Uh man has God so can my pen choose not to fall no it has a to fall to the Center of the Earth this is anything that has weight will naturally fall man’s nature because of the way God created him will always desire the good um in heaven we will have unmediated
Knowledge of God and we’ll see God face to face which means God who is perfect goodness is the Fulfillment of every one of our desires uh my intellectual desires like it talks about like how I will be fed by him like everything that I have uh for desires will be fulfilled
Because he is the Perfection of goodness everything that is good in the world comes from his goodness um so yeah so once my mind knows the goodness of God it can want nothing Beyond it because it’s the Perfection does that make sense okay the Angels um so when we talk about
Heaven we’re talking about a state of being um unmediated knowledge of God the Angels uh before the choice the fall of the bad Angels did not have unmediated access to God’s Essence so they were mediated in knowing God’s goodness so they did not have the fullness of God uh in in knowledge of
God which still gave them the ability to choose um once they passed the test of choosing God without full knowledge some of them entered into the beautific vision seeing God unmated face to face and others uh no longer were with God and they were what we call
Demons uh I do not know I know of the scripture verse you’re speaking of but I do not know I am not a scripture scholar and I cannot tell you why because you’re right Angels do not have gender so it’s really weird to think that Angels wanted to have intercourse with women
Um yeah I mean because they don’t have bodies therefore there’s no reason and they also don’t procreate yeah yeah thanks be to God for Renaissance art right sure uh so that I asked the question is does God have a choice to love himself or not because he doesn’t but yet he’s free so
When we become like God we share that freedom and God freely love himself but without choice so you have freedom but not choice I know don’t ask me Thomas so father Sean talked about him a couple weeks ago he would literally have like seven scribes because you know not this
This and he would be like talking blah blah blah blah blah blah and then he like You’ go like tell a paragraph to this guy and tell a paragraph for this guy tell a paragraph for this guy and then come back and keep going with this
Guy cuz that’s how smart this man was uh I get lost reading my own notes so um I think we’re I’m G I’m GNA allow if there’s one more question if not uh we’re gonna yeah so it would seem uh we see in the Old Testament particularly God reveals
Himself uh in tangible ways to Moses and elishah or Elisha it’s a similar sounding name um but he always guards them and he also reveals himself in a obscured way God being the right God’s God’s literally in this room filling up every space uh he’s in lots of our souls if we’ve been
Baptized uh so we have access to God uh God’s Not Again God’s not out there in the sense that he sits billions and trillions and whatever miles away but there’s also this truth that uh what is in the presence of unmediated presence of God must be perfect uh which
Is the good news the bad news well the good news is Jesus Christ comes uh to give us the ability to access that and this is this is the whole thing of like uh why the church professes that you need baptism for salvation because it’s through that that Christ enters your
Soul and allows you to be divinized um so yeah I I in a sense God could like come in the form of like I don’t know a cloud with like fire uh if you read uh the first five points of the Bible but is really uh man totally my bra what Exodus thank
You it’s been a long way here but let me tell you um Exodus uh he like you know this is how he actually appears um but yeah it would seem God Al like you cannot see God face to face because because of our fall we’re no longer able to be in his presence
Unmediated so yes okay thank you so much for enduring me uh it was a great joy um and I’m going to ask father to give a blessing as the final and then Bri has some announcements afterwards so father your blessing please yeah all right all
Right good to see you I’m father V for those of you who don’t know me I’m like a vice CEO here father Sean is kind of my employee now we are equal we but as you know father father Brian is gone starting in January so it’s me and
Father sh will be running actually it’s kind of scary so pray for us but today actually I will pray for you and give you that blessing in the name of the father of the son and of the holy spirit amen amen God we ask you to bless us this evening
To bless our journey towards you towards our home which is heaven and let us experience your love your goodness and help us to see how you really work through Christian communities and how you really work and Lead all of us to Salvation so I ask you to bless all of
Us and give this special blessing to all who are present here and may almighty God bless the father and the son and the holy spirit amen any announcements um okay just three announcements there are three Bibles on the back you guys are open uh to take if you do not have Bible
At home take it it’s free we want you to have it they’ve been lingering so take one um raise your hand if you still need a table sign you’re embarrassed or whatever don’t don’t feel comfortable raising your hand come talk to me if you’re like
Yes I still need the table sign I don’t really know my table leader that’s fine just let me know otherwise they will not be here next week if you do not need them and last but certainly not least Brewery night next week so I expect all
47 of you to be at plat Flat Park brewery if you can’t come that’s fine but Brewery next week um that’s it so thanks everyone thanks [Applause] Jeff you
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