With you this is my first podcast in a while so I might be rusty with uh just questions that that sort of stuff so you just let it roll man and it’s easy go take it easy on me take it easy on me well yeah man like just thanks so much
For being here I really appreciate it uh I’m I’m here with Zach small and you’re someone that I got connected through a friend of ours I guess on Twitter uh connecting me to you and and your page is just super awesome um your your Twitter page kind of the stuff that
You’re doing so so thanks so much for being here I’m really excited for this no absolutely Pat and you know have me on to talk fatherhood talk family talk what it is we’re doing I think these discussions are needed to be had because like you said a friend of yours
Introduced you to me and now we’re talking about this you know the next guy might hear it and all of a sudden he’s got these new ideas to bring himself to the next level absolutely man absolutely so now let’s get into a bit of background I know you’re you’re married
You’re father to two a coach uh a veteran photographer um yeah kind of tell me what am I missing here what am what am I what am I not giving the audience that that they might not know about you and then also myself no you nailed it man that’s it
I’m just a dad and coach we’re doing our thing just a no so I I joined the military and during a very successful career I realized I wanted to be an involved father you know and so going through that I left the military and I’ve kind of dedicated myself towards
Sharing the art the process I’m using through fatherhood you know I’m an ambitious guy there are a lot of things that I want to do and so while doing that and leaving the military well I lost my brotherhood and so I created the online community so I’m also running the
Fraternity of Excellence you know that’s a private men’s group where men are come together for their various reasons one of them’s fatherhood but men are there for finances Fitness you know the works as a men or as a man and then recently I’ve taken up photography so I’m out
Here taking pictures you know I run the daily draft newsletter which is my substack so I’m writing there it’s pretty much like the renaissance man you know it’s like I’m just doing all the things that I can do and it’s it’s not one of those things like I’m a a jack of
All trades with a master of none I’m trying to master all of these you know to include being a husband to include being a father right and so I’ve I’ve dedicated my life to that so what you see on Twitter what you see through the
Pictures that I take or the words that I write you know that’s me finding my way through life sharing the story and making sure that others are taking the time to appreciate it as well because I don’t think we have enough people out here being light you know and sharing
Positive messages and how to be better in your family there’s a lot of go with the flow there’s a lot of focusing on chaos and that’s not what’s going to get you to where you want to go and so I have found a way just through the
Various events of my life to just become a guy that wants to do that you know and so I am right that’s amazing the one of the reasons that I was motivated to get this podcast going I was in a discussion with a family member of mine and we were
Just talking about just role models in this age in this time and and it it the discussion focused on you know like is there one good role model to have like is there one person out there especially for men is there a masculine figure out there that really represents
Just all the values and without any you know without any like negatives or anything I mean it’s it’s such a tough task and that’s such a large thing to be but but something that we were just wrestling with is like this this man is great but he has you know maybe these
Flaws or this person is great in these flaws and and I realize that you know maybe there’s not just one person but by more people striving to be that role model to be that that one person by by having these conversations that you know you can you can kind of slowly just
Create a culture especially for men for dads like you said where you know you’re being built up where you’re seeing good examples whether it’s it’s in Media news that sort of stuff podcast online line where there are good examples of just what it means to be a husband a dad a
Man in this life and I mean dude you’re like exactly what you were saying just you’re all in and that’s that’s what you’re going for I mean that’s why I was so excited for this call I was like this Zach is exactly what I was talking about
In that discussion of someone who’s just saying like I just striving and trying to have that so that’s really cool I appreciate it man I mean that’s the thing we’re talking we love things to be simple it’d be really easy to be yeah obviously that one dude there is the guy
For all of us that’s not how that works like that’s not how real life works and that’s the problem though people see social media we’ve had technology help simplify Our Lives to where we just want to press a button and have a nice home brw experience espresso but you don’t
Want to grind the beans so that they’re super fresh you don’t want to make sure the water’s at the right temperature so you’re not boiling it too high or too low like the process is what’s going to get you that perfect espresso that you want but what you actually want is the
Comfort that comes with pressing a button and then boom kingg and that’s not how it works so there’s not going to be one dude you can be like that’s the guy be like him and you’re going to win no what you have to do is find the
Process and the process is much uglier it’s much more time consuming you know and it also forces you to accept the fact that nobody’s perfect I’m a man with flaws you’re a man with flaws yet here we are trying to be better does that not make us the men that we’re
Speaking about because the role model is the man who’s out there trying to be his best with flaws included because he’s a human being and so it’s it’s your features your flaws it’s your ability to recognize your flaws not hide them or Overlook them and then just make them a
Part of your story and all of a sudden all the problems in my past like I’m sober you know for a really quick example like there’s a reason I’m sober and it’s not because I’m like hey I’m awesome with alcohol it’s because alcohol wasn’t good for me that’s a flaw
Other people can drink just fine I couldn’t am I a bad man though no I recognized I had an issue and I addressed it that’s what made me a good man I saw a problem in my life I addressed it and now here I am going going forward helping others do the same
And so to me if you’re perfect dude there’s a reason that they gave Superman Kryptonite because if he was perfect well that’s not real we I can’t relate to that I’m not going to root for that guy like it’s not even hard for him he’s perfect but that guy had to overcome
Something there’s something that can destroy that dude and he’s got to fight against it he’s got to control himself that’s somebody I can relate to because as a man I have to find ways to overcome issues I’ve got to come back you know when I get knocked down I’ve got to
Succeed and have Victory well I’ve got to win well you know so all these things that’s what makes the role model that you were talking about or looking for it’s necessary that they have dark spots to them and scars and flaws because that’s the only way that we can even
Relate as something we could become right yeah wow I love it speaking I had mine this morning so I’m ready to go man there you go you’re you’re just fired up that that’s huge I wish you would been there for the discussion I mean that would have been
Fantastic I was definitely losing the B losing the discussion so dude next time uh next time it’s Happ I’m just going to play them this clip and be like this this is what I’m talking hold on yeah this is what I was trying to say it’s really cool just the way you mentioned
Superman and Kryptonite because he’s one that I I don’t relate to him as much just because like you said like he’s almost he’s too high it’s not enough challenges and then there’s always a way I’m always in my head I’m like he’s Superman it’s he’s going to beat
Everyone there’s no there’s no debate about it’s not Captain America who’s constantly getting knocked down and getting back up right but then whenever they pull out the Superman movie he’s always you know there’s always that losing and that struggle so I I just love how you related that to the flaws
Of of real role models and how everyone you know they have those flaws but it’s it’s not it’s not the flaws that doesn’t make them a role model it’s it’s because of that and the striving to be better overcome them knowing that no one’s ever going to be perfect that’s so awesome
Yeah I mean and it one of the things too when you’re looking at you know Batman Superman Captain America all these guys we never say Captain Planet but he was a good one too but you look at all these guys and they’re out there doing this thing you know everybody loves to point
Out their origin story as to like what made them everybody loves to point out all the things they went through and how they overcame it everybody loves to look at them and point to them as if they’re doing something you couldn’t do you know and so when you’re telling that story
I’m like dude I’m Superman in my story like you cannot beat me I will not stop and that that’s my mind said that’s how I think about myself I I know Superman isn’t real obviously I’m not saying I’m having these fantasies where I can jump
Off my my deck and fly but what I’m saying is when you when you look at this like when I look at myself dude I think I am a monster in the best of ways and I think every man should think that every man should think of themselves like yeah
This is a great story let me show you how your dad lives it you’re talking about man of steel look I go and I do this and I make sure I take care of that you know with this one hand I can throw the hardest punch you’ve ever felt and
In this hand I can hold a baby that is a hero man you can sit there and you know take your photos for the press and you can sit there and fight the bad guys if something goes knock at that door right now or in the middle of night
Or at any point it’s not my wife or kids who are gonna get up and go after it maybe my son he’s he’s 14 he’s becoming a man of his own there but that’s me I’m going to see what just happened there I’m the guy who’s going to save this
Family and when when things hit the fan I’ve been working to not swear on my podcast recently so when stuff hits the fan I like it when stuff hits the fan stuff hits the fan my family doesn’t freak they look to me they look to the hero of the family and
I wish more family men would stop offloading that responsibility and that that sort of not not worship but that just like looking up to and idolizing all these other men and start looking at themselves along with their family saying hey you can be that man in their
Story you should be that person you’re real you’re here you can do all those things right amen amen I feel like I should be saying go baby that’s why we’re doing this podcast it’s start inspiring people now talk to me about so fraternity of Excellence I’ve looked in
I looked at you know obviously I’m I’m seeing what you’re posting on Twitter and then I went through kind of dude it it looks amazing now you started that a few years ago is that correct fraternity of Excellence I co-founded fraternity of Excellence with Craig James we worked
Together and on January 1st 2018 we launched that Community very cool and what was you you briefly mentioned it uh a veteran and and you had your brother hood and then you know you’re out of the army and you you lose the Brotherhood was it was it something to to keep the
Brotherhood that you had before or was there a different like a a motivation that motivation with it and then something else moving along for it what what led you to say this is something that’s needed for you for other men out there and then push you to start it yeah
Absolutely first I have to set the record straight it was the Navy you can’t go around telling people I was the army man it’s out there we’re gonna have issues they’re GNA love no looking at thatp up here’s the thing when I I am a like I said a motivated Driven Man I
Wasn’t always like this I became this way when I joined the military prior to in high school before then I was insecure uh I just had a lot of self-doubt issues um I wasn’t motivated and I was on a very destructive path I joined the military and that really got
My mind straight is the man that you know today all the stuff that I’ve written since then has stemmed from that decision point I was a confident me well even when I say insecure like I was I played football very confident if you
Told me to do a job I was going to go do the job the best I could do so like I was I had the skill sets and belief in myself in that sense but I didn’t think I was worth love I didn’t think I’d be successful like things like that and so
It’s funny like very confident in the football field very confident when it came to physical events but very insecure every single other place right military fix that and to drive that point home you know when I left the military I left that and as instructor
Of the Year sailor of the year I was on a really fast path I was advancing like I was doing exceptionally well and I was very proud of that and I just walked away and so to me that speaks volumes to the character of a man who can say
You’re having success in one business but if it’s not aligned with your goals it’s time to step off family is the Cornerstone of me you know of Zach of everything that I am family is the Cornerstone of that and the military was taking me away from that I could not be
A good dad and a good husband I mean I I could not be a good dad and the good SA or a good husband you know it had to be I had to pick family or the military because I was out there volunteering for every deployment I was volunteering for
Every school I was volunteering to go because in the military that’s number one you know country and so I I put it in that order and I realized I didn’t want to not know my kids I didn’t want to miss more events I missed my son’s first birthday first steps a lot of
Milestones there and that he doesn’t know that he’ll never remember that but I do and I was like that’s not what I want and so at the Apex I kind of like like I dropped the mic retired on top and left and when I did that I found out
A part of what made me so successful was having other men that I could work with and jive with and swap notes with and lean on and I lost that because the Brotherhood carries on and we all know this when we leave you can say like yeah
I’ll call you yeah I’ll see you the reality is if you’re part of a Fraternal Order like that police firefighters military obviously college sports high school sports when you graduate or you leave or you move on on you retire whatever it is they have to keep going
The fight doesn’t stop and I can’t get mad at them for moving on with whoever took my spot because the mission goes on but I was left there trying to like look around I’m not going to be the the fat veteran who wears all veteran gear and
Talks about how I used to be somebody and then I’ll be 60 years old I used to be in the Navy you know back in I joined 2006 and I did all these thing like bro what have you done since that that I refuse to let that be me right and so so
I started looking around I realized the men in my local network they they didn’t have it The X Factor they didn’t have it so I went online I didn’t really find it and then I just started creating it I started talking about what was important to me I started talking about what I
Needed what I was seeing what was working for me I created a program called 31 days to masculinity where we kind of as a team we work together for 31 days to build ourselves back to being the best man and I had done that off seeing what was missing but I was
Missing it and so I was able to lead I was able to motivate people I was able to connect and people resonated with what I was saying Craig James understood how to get a system that could build like a home for us and so he built the
Community and so basically we we we merged together our skill sets and that’s where F we was born I needed that Brotherhood I still need that Brotherhood I’ve got people in my innermost Network that I call and talk to every single day I am a pack animal I
Can go out I can do great things alone I’m very fine I can eat by myself you know I can like some uncomfortable having a coffee I know that’s weird to say but I had a whole discussion where people are very uncomfortable eating at a restaurant by themselves I can go to a
Bar or a table whatever sit and I’m happy with my thoughts usually I’ll bring a laptop and I’ll edit but I’m very cool just being lost in my head and when I was able to get out there and connect with others though that’s how I found the ability to really bring me to
The next level and how do I know I’m a strong man or a smart man or a good man unless I’m around other men I can’t say I’m a tough guy because I’m stronger than my wife and kids you know like that’s not how that works none of us if
You’re not measuring yourself to other men who are successful and objectively achieving great things then you don’t know where the hell you rank you don’t know how you’re doing as a man and so the fraternity of Excellence was the the inevitable outcome of that because I
Needed it and I was either going to form it there I was going to form it at home like I needed the Brotherhood and that became the outlet because it was able to transcend physical proximity and I was able to connect with people who think
The way I think and you know and they they saw a lot of what I was doing I’m able to intimately every single week day in and day out give them everything that I’m doing to help them level up and go and since then we’ve evolved you know so
Now I’m partnering with Anthony miglino who runs peaceful fathers.com right and then we’ve got a team leader Colton and so the three of us I’ve got a team leader that’s taking care of the guys Anthony and I are swapping and controlling our roles to make sure the
System works best and the men are growing at a rate that I can’t even properly describe but that’s that’s for those guys on the inside to know about that yeah and and what are some things when you were looking to get it started and did Craig James am I getting the
Name correct yes so when you and Craig were getting things started what were kind of I guess pillars that you wanted to focus on when it came to being men being leaders being a Brotherhood did you have certain things in certain requirements or or non-negotiables where these will be the
Pillars of of who we are and what this is Craig and I did and it’s evolved so I’m going to go through what we had and what we currently have you know I’m going to kind of blend them together because the answer here is going to help
Anybody that’s looking to build a team or a network and so one you had to be a man this is was a men’s only group so it was very easy for us to say well yeah we’re cutting our consumer based in half you know but what are we doing we’re
Looking to help men and so we made a clear decision who we’re looking for from there there was no age or any limits like that we weren’t chasing an avatar I’m going to go for 30s married with kids you know looking to be better
No right if you’re a man you can get in doesn’t matter age doesn’t matter anything else outside of being a man you know from there authenticity was the number one message that I drive everywhere be you you have to if you join our group you have to be yourself and this we’re
Going to blend it with our current rules is we have no aons there are no Anonymous accounts you’re not allowed to have a fake profile photo if you’re not allowed to hide if you’re not posting we’re reaching out you know if you’re if we don’t know what you who you are what
You’re doing we’re reaching out to you because I don’t want to I’d rather less people in my group that I know than more people that I don’t know you know and so that’s how we operate is be who you are have your name all that you know but
Outside of that man it really fell into what we’re seeing with men Mind Body Spirit health wealth relationships very simple your mind has to be right your body has to be right and your soul has to be right and then obviously you’ve got your health not just literally your
Physical health here but also just like the lifestyle that you’re living you know if you have addictions if you have certain habits whatever it is so you have to address these things your wealth make sure that you get your money straight we have everything I listed health wealth relationships Mind Body
Spirit we have a coach for all of those inside our walls we have personal trainers we have nutritionists we have freaking lawyers we have everybody you could think of and our motto inside is we have a guy for that because we don’t have apps I’m not going to say send you
An app if you need help I’m like hey Pat come talk to this guy and he’s going to help you with your like you’ve got a person and these dud are more than happy to help to give back but the pillar is it had to be focused on that you had to
Focus on just all that makes you as a man because if we work on that we can fix that all those other things grow so our father we have a fatherhood Channel I mean a fatherhood call every week led by Anthony and that’s been going for like four years now and people are
Always attending like we are always talking fatherhood so when when women say like I want a man who’s six feet tall um making six figures and has a six-pack we’re helping you do that but we’re also throwing in and is a good father and is healed from all his childhood trauma and
Doesn’t have any crazy Secrets hiding like we’re helping the men become the best men they can be and in doing so we are helping wives we are helping women we’re helping children we’re helping Society at large yeah that’s powerful it’s imine that’s the thing like it works you know yeah and you have
It’s is it 160 members now now in the fraternity is that correct think we’re floating around 140 right now 140 a briging yeah that’s crazy though it’s it’s crazy that I mean just what it must be what it must be like just in that having that Brotherhood yeah it’s it’s probably tell
So powerful the Brotherhood is is so strong and I can’t speak to that enough but again we’ve been doing this for over six years now and looking at it the thing that hits me the the most is what we’re doing right now and so we’ve done
Great things for a long time but what are we doing right now we’re still growing we just last weekend had our F first fraternity of Excellence family event I saw that I wanted to ask there man that’s so that’s so amazing dude wives kids my son was there he got to
See all these other men um their spouses were there one of the things and I said this at the event one of the things that really stood out to me like hit me right in this the heart is in the military I talk about you know this brother Hood At
Camaraderie that’s where we came from yeah but what I skipped was in the military if I snapped my fingers a family would show up like our for a cookout or for a football party whatever all of our kids would be together all of our wives would be together all the men
Would be together we kind of like float apart at different phases of the house and we’d all come together and then we’d all float apart and have like cigars or hang out come together talk about work come together like we would interweave with our women and with our children and
We were able to successfully do that with foe it was awesome right that that’s just so cool was that something that you guys have been maybe what you saw that was not lacking but something that needed to be there and that’s why it was just such a
Strong emphasis to just get whether it’s it’s families children whoever everyone there and then all just hanging out together is that just something that yeah you guys just just really wanted to have that yeah I mean it was an inevitability again because it it everything’s headed towards this one
Thing you know this one thing is is Excellence that’s why it’s called fraterna of excellence and in the process of getting to Excellence we have found what what could we do to be better what can we do to be more excellent how can we better deliver our message and so
This was a part of that recognizing that the families had to know each other was a part of that I would say for like three years now it’s been tossed around the last year it was really like all right we need to make this happen and
Then one of our members his name is Matt wer he he took point on it he’s like hey man like I I want to run with this I’ve got the perfect spot I know where to go I know how we can do it we can do it at
A cost-effective level you know so we can do this way it’s not going to break the bank because times are weird right now and so people are not like choosing where do they want to spend their funds we’re able to do this up breaking the bank you know you see some Retreats and
It’s $10,000 you see some Retreats even ,000 you know which to me that’s not an insane number but at the same time that might not be something a family of five is willing to commit you know and we were able to do this and just knock it
Out like I said at an affordable level where family could get involved they could all travel together and we we were able to do the thing we knew we should have done but when you saw it play out dude it was better than we could have imagined like it was everything that we
Thought it would be and then now and what are you guys doing like while you’re all so in my head on picturing just awesome spot maybe like barbecu grilling playing sports football baseball soccer Hawks like am I on the right path here or kind of yeah so you’re on the right path but
We weren’t able to do it all and so if you dial all that in yeah we the cigars were had so the men were smoking cigars and having a good time great discussions we had meals together um one of our men his name is Don Hickman you should wake
Him or check him out his wake up call LLC on Twitter awesome D great dude um he brought a b he has Nerf nights like his family fun Friday Friday family fun nights and they he goes out with his community they have like these Nerf battles and have some fun with the kids
And so it’s like paintball but like kids can play and so he has like these huge Nerf things and like like all right what the hell are we talking about just think paintball with Nerf and so we set all these boxes up and like we played with
The kids the adults played each other it was a really good time so we had that little battle going a lot of we were playing volleyball like I said uh we had arts and crafts led by one of the moms she was reading books they had a movie
Night at one of the men’s businesses dude we it was everything and like I said the wives would be together then all the couples would be together we’d all be together and then just the men and so it was very good and especially my son and I my wife and daughter had to
Stay home which is she’s the Founder’s wife but dude when before we got on here we’re like yeah it’s busy like dude our lives are busy yeah and so when you were saying everything that you’re involved in my first thought was D I can’t believe this guy found an hour to to
Talk to me holy it’s very there are some days where we’re high-fiving like last night she had to bring her daughter the cheer and I was bringing my son and I to go take photo the football game and it’s like we high five in the way in and out
And we make time for each other at night like during the day is difficult and so she wasn’t able to go to the family event which she was not happy about but it gave my son and I A A Reason Not re really reason it created an opportunity
For us to just bu ourselves go on a road trip have some fun meet all these men my son got to meet the men that I’ve been speaking about for a long time you know so I’m there with him dude and like we’re standing there and I’m just like I
Told him when we got there I’m not going to offer you any top cover you know and I’m not like you’re not here just as my son you’re your own man and so like like feeling good like shoulders back like all right now get to go he was having
Indepth conversations with these men because remember in foe they’ve seen my son grow but he hasn’t seen them right so they’re like hey you know Kota it’s nice to see you heard about baseball you know how is everything going all these things and as his own man he’s out there
Speaking Standing Tall shaking hands eye contact all the things that you like you measure a man by like body language he had it locked in and I was so proud to see that because I’m like this is as we’re talking men Mee men this son is seeing these new role models his Heroes
Aren’t going to be these fictitious characters they’re going to be the men he knows who run businesses who are leading their families you know their mind their body their Spirits are dialed in these men are getting on my son’s level and talking to him as as I’m
Talking to you right now that’s the level of respect they give that’s the level of respect they expect and so seeing that play out man we did everything that the military does and what I mean by that is my experience in the Navy what I was missing F we hit all
Those boxes and then some right that must yeah that must just be a crazy experience just for him and then also for you just to to almost watch I mean i’ so I’ve got two little boys one is one’s two one’s four and then we got we aren we don’t know if
It’s a boy or a girl but one on the way but I mean they’re still they’re babies in my eyes they’re like I mean the four-year-olds they’re still young kids though they’re still very young and I think it’s Patrick Bet David who go who says like your sons go through three stages
He says first they idolize then they demonize and then they humanize and those are kind of three stages that Sons go through with their fathers now I I don’t know if he’s fully correct on it but I can kind of see what he’s getting at but they’re still just little kids in
My eyes they’re I mean they are little kids they’re four but for you just looking at your son a 14-year-old you know shaking hands looking people in the eye shoulders back what was that moment like for you where was was it a switch of heyy like
My boy is now he’s a young man was there was there just a just a switch in your mind or just seeing it or was it something that You’ just known and then you’re able to just sit back and and just be super proud of them it’s a good
Question because it really puts me in the uncomfortable seat who likes to talk about the kids growing up man no I I really like it and I enjoy it I enjoy the process entirely it’s one of those things where when you look at it you know from the literal state M of I’m
Watching my son become his own man that can there could be like an unspoken negative kind of air behind that like oh he’s becoming his own he’s going out he’s independent he doesn’t need you dude I could not be more proud and you know it wasn’t a surprise to me at all I
Know who he is I I treat him in our home like he’s his own man you know and I would say to a degree this is why other fathers need friends they need men they conect can connect with and I’m not even putting that from the position of hey
Check out F A we I’m pitching this as like literally your church you need just friends you need men around you because look at the opportunity I had to see my son becoming his own man that’s only possible when my son is no longer just inside this home with me or with his
Friends I got to see him with my friends and how he carries himself right and so if dads don’t have that you never get to see that if you don’t get to see that how are you going to know it like where is the opportunity for that that data
Point on his right of passage to manhood where’s that going to be found you have to expose him to other men but how can you expose your your son to the masculine Network the hierarchy that you’re a part of if you’re not a part of
It and how can you expect your son to have friends and to grow and find good people around him if you stop doing the same because you thought that getting married having kids was the finish line and so when I see it dude I know my son
Like I see him every day I speak to every day he’s he’s a free individual who kind of just like lives in my home and we get along very well we have a good relationship yeah and he eats all my food he’s always trying to grab my
Protein so there there are things that we’ve got to figure out and some boundaries there but he’s an individual that’s growing up and we’re learning to grow together and I would say that seeing him there at that event and like you said those three three phases I told
My wife we’ve already gone through those and so at 14 like we’ve already gone through I I was his hero I’m Superman and there was a time where like him and I were butt and heads and I I couldn’t figure it out but I also couldn’t back
Down and he wouldn’t back down and I didn’t want him to like the bars we had is like you need to speak your truth and it’s not going to align with mine all the time but after that now he sees me as the man that I am I’ve sh I
Shared I can’t like who I am everything that I am I have shared with that kid and why I am the way I am he knows more about me than almost anybody but my wife because I talk to him he asked very good questions about um let’s talk about the
The road trip to Charlotte and from Charlotte during that time we listen to Andy Priscilla’s real AF podcast right and we’re talking about Israel we’re talking about God we’re talking about politics we’re talking about health wealth we’re talking about all these things this 14-year-old is asking me the
Questions that would make you and I very uncomfortable if we were to be asking each other right now right like oh exactly how much money did you make uh in the past three weeks hey what ha exactly tell me what happens when you die okay Dad why aren why don’t you
Drink alcohol and all these other dads do and I’m sitting like I’ve got nowhere to go and I’m not like squirming in my seat man but it’s one of those things like these are not comfortable things but if you learn those answers to me you
Know me better and so I want my son to know me the absolute best and so so I answer but then I ask him similar questions like so what’s what’s your choice here what are you thinking about doing there what’s what’s influencing you to make the choices that you make
And so we’re learning about I mean each other obviously but how each other are operating and navigating this world that we’re in and dude I’m you likely haven’t really seen the full you nature of it but as your boys grow and you said youve got a little lady on the way uh we’re
Not sure still still early on on the way potential little lady the world they’re living in is so unique to our own but not even in the sense of like our parents to say to us our grandparents like oh the world has changed like yeah obviously the world’s changed like we
Have pronouns and things like what whatever I’m not talking about that you’re parenting your kid differently than you were parented and you’re going to see your child operate differently than you operated and I I did not grow up in the atmosphere my son’s being raised in and so I’m almost I don’t know
My son because he’s not doing any anything I did the way I did it outside of like the core pillars and so it’s almost like I’m watching a whole new child at 14 I wasn’t doing half the he’s doing I wasn’t and so he is but he had the environment because I’ve made
Fatherhood priority and so that’s a very long way to answer the question of yes I was very proud of my son for attending the event and very Co shout to all the F men you know who shook his hand and gave him the time of day yeah that’s that’s
Really cool that’s really cool I’m just thinking back to I mean I’m I’m very I I always say like very blessed very fortunate really it was just my parents made a lot of sacrifices for me and my siblings so we we I guess my my parents growing up they
Just defied you know all the cultural norms they had a big family so there’s seven of us I have five sisters and a brother and what was really cool was uh my dad’s best man at they were each other’s best men so so we they live in
The same town the same town that we we live in right now up in uh Canada actually but so they also did something similar so there’s there’s eight kids in that family and just growing up it was always we just always grew up together there was always a bigger community and
Then people just slowly moved in and and like you said right you need you need some pillars so church was definitely the big one for us where people move in big Catholic families and and there’s just such an awesome Community it’s strange though growing up with someone for that long so some of
Those that other family I mean I’m I’m 30 now and it’s it’s no lie to say like my whole life I’ve had though that other family in my life like there’s a brother older than me there’s one the same age there’s a one younger there’s my brother
So I’ve known them you know from zero to 30 right but what’s funny is is the relationship with the parents because you know you’re a six-year-old and you’re over playing with your friends and then there’s there’s that person’s dad and then it’s slowly as you grow up
There’s a transition of okay I’m your son’s friend and I’m just a kid now I’m a teenager and then all of a sudden it’s hey we’re both men and it just becomes a weird phenomenon and still still talking to you know my buddy’s Dad I’ll still
Shake his hand call him by his first name he says the same thing and then we have a conversation and and in my head I always think hey this is this is the way men talk but I shouldn’t I’m almost like I’m not I’m not worthy to be talking to
You as an adult but it’s just it’s such a strange thing to to grow up with someone and then realize that you know what we’re all we’re all not equals but we’re all men we talk the way men do and it’s going to be I’m really excited just
The way you expressed there just to watch my kids grow up and and see that transition from child to to young men to then men adults and and see what it’s going to be like and see how they interact with you know my friends who their their children are going to be in
Their lives and they’re always so I’m I’m just really excited for that basically I’m excited for I think you said your son was 14 so 10 years from now being able to to watch that and to witness that and and be proud the same way that that you are of your son I’m
Really excited for that the the complexity of it grows but so does the appreciation of it you know and so like the the relationship we have now at 14 is different than when he was four but in such better ways it’s so much more intimate like you deeper thoughts in his
World and coming from my mind like as well and they’re just meeting up it’s a great thing and people who say like oh the terrible twos oh you know when they’re teenagers oh who the 16 oh well when they’re it’s always like just wait till like gets worse dude I’m telling
You right now they’re all wrong it only gets better so long as you’re honest in the relationship you know if you treat your kids like somebody that you like they’re going to treat you like somebody they like they’re going to like to be around you and so the way that I see it
You know is our job as fathers is to just lead these lives and be honest about it and kind of just like do our best and let them know who we are along the way that’s it’s not difficult you know people make it very complicated and to the point the relationship you have
With that other man you know that’s a very intimate one I mean your whole life you’ve known this family they’ve watched you become aen it’s it’s interesting when you see that play out because you find yourself in that position you’re like oh this we are men now like there’s
No like day it’s not like oh you’re 18 you’re a man it’s like something inside of you changes and you’re just standing taller and you’re speaking to him or you’re confronting him I’ve seen a lot of people say like oh I I wasn’t a man until I was able to tell that other
Older man that I have listened to forever no that’s I knew I was on my own ground and I’m making my decisions for my life and that could happen at 30 that could happen at 40 you know there have been men who joined foe who had no confrontational bones in their body they
They were almost a boy their whole life because nobody ever gave him permission nobody ever told him time to man up or the path they chose was not a very masculine one it was very like passive and letting the world happen to them even from their spouse and kids and
Never kind of like injecting themselves into the conversation to where they could control what’s happening in their own life and so like to me manhood is not a number I look at my son now I would say he’s damn close he he’s so close it’s not going to be 18 thing it
Might be like a 15 or 16 thing maybe when he has his own like his own job that’s those Milestones his own money to go do things like but as far as being a man I we’re really we’re knocking on that door yeah that’s so cool that there
Was something you said even just going back to you know oh terrible twos and then wait till they’re a teenager and then they’re 16 it’s something that I don’t have there aren’t many things I try to almost be a stoic when it comes to what other people do and and not let
Myself be reactionary to maybe their their mindsets I’m going to say uh whether it’s you know a passive or a victim mentality but when I always hear people you know talking about oh this is bad now but wait until the future it’s even worse it’s one of those things it just
Makes me sick I I worked a job thankfully I’ve I’ve been able to go out and start my own but I was in a job where it would be Monday morning would show up and everyone would complain because it was Monday for no other reason other than the fact that because society says
Mondays are a bad day and I found myself falling into it and then one day I I just I I said this is so dumb like why am I complaining that it’s a Monday it’s it’s literally just another day it’s not that the work is worse on a Monday it’s
Not that the people are any worse it’s the exact same it’s just well it’s basically that everyone hates their job and no one wants to be there is essentially what it is and then it would be Tuesday would come around and people would count it down till Friday and like
Three more days till Friday or and it’s just one of those mentalities I just said to myself I’m going to stop complaining about this and it totally changed and then you see other people saying like well at least it’s Friday right it’s a good day or
It’s Monday it’s a bad day right the terrible twos they’re bad wait till they get 16 and now I I almost have these like no life is good I’m excited for when they’re 16 but it’s it just makes me sick to hear people say that because I mean you speak things
Into existence and if you’re wishing if you’re say it’s a terrible day because it’s a Monday it it probably will be a terrible day and if you’re saying that the terrible twos are real then they probably are going to be real for you if you say when your kids are 16 they’re
Going to be a pain when your kids are 16 you’re probably going to think that they’re a pain and it’s just one of those things I I have no patience for and I’ve I’ve always got to check my tongue depending on who I’m talking to
Not to not to get too fired up from it no I definitely I find myself I can’t help it it’s just like I have a thought the words come out like I I even in environments like it’s like I create my own conflict and I’m like I can’t help
Getting my own way sometimes but it’s just like I can’t also not talk it’s it’s a gift and a curse fortunately I’m very good at the bait and I can talk my way into and out of a lot of things and so right I usually win the arguments I
Find myself getting into caused by me looking at that it’s like you you have to man like that’s why you’re doing this podcast you’re not doing this podcast for people not to listen to you you wouldn’t start this and start like I would hope you’re not having me on here
To not post this or have a discussion on actually apply this it’s like oh this is like my little secret stash because I don’t want people to get mad that we spoke about fatherhood you know like there’s a a a right way to parent there’s a wrong way to parent and then
There’s other ways to parent and the way I look at this man if I treated our relationship like oh just wait until the second time you podcast with Pat and it’s going to be freaking terrible he he choke the second one dude you’d be like what is wrong with you yeah it’s like
Why are you waiting for your kids to be bad people why do you think that that’s what’s going to happen it’s the same thing as some people say oh your relationship with your your girlfriend is great wait until marriage that’s when it’s all over wait until kids then it’s
All over what are you talking about I can’t wait to marry this woman and create these babies we’re going to create a Wonderful Life and and that’s going to be filled with love physical attraction you know romance all the things that you’re saying that are going
To die that’s going to bloom oh wait until your kids turn teens so I can do more with him my son can go to plan of fitness with me now he can be a legit Black Card guest you know how pumped he is about that you know going to the gym
Um doing obstacle course races he can now do the adult ones dude his aging has been the best thing because now we just have more things we can go do and I told you if something goes bump at night my son might be the one running out after
It I I call myself a Silverback Gorilla that’s my spirit animal like I love gorillas and I it’s I explained to my wife it’s it we’re at the point now it’s like two gorillas are in this house I’ve got another man I can rely on for a lot
Of things he does a lot of landscaping with me he does a lot of U when we have to repair things he does that with me it’s no longer sit there and hold the flashlight like he’s actually helping me you know what I mean yeah and so with
You if you’re looking at the relationship with your wife and you’re like oh just wait until you know this happens and then it’s going to be trash well yeah you think she’s a person who going to be trash soon you can’t look at those little bodies and be like oh when
You guys grow up you’re going to be I can’t wait for that to happen like why would you think that why would you put your kid in a track where they’re going to be somebody you don’t like dude my son said something and I think this would be good advice for
Anybody listening to this he was talking to another F man he did not know I was EES dropping but I’m like proud of him so I’m like what are you guys talking about sitting there listening next to him yeah and the guy said something about oh you speak very well uh for for
14 and he’s like listen my my dad since I could talk I’ve had to speak for myself he’s like I had to order my own food I had to ask the Barbor for my own haircut when other adults would ask questions he would not answer them he
Would look at me you know and it’s real if you if you came to my house like hey how’s Cod doing with baseball I’d be like oh he’s good if you were talking to me and kot hey how’s Kota doing ask him he’s right here like I give him that
That level of respect in the same way I would with you and so that’s why I’m watching that relationship grow but when he said that I realized the freedom we give our kids in their youth to kind of speak up and be their own selves that allows them to sort of develop that
Skill set so when they’re old like so 14 16 all these Milestones we’re talking about you’ve already gotten to know them you already like you know their motivations their fears you’ve learned who they are they know they have the freedom to express themselves you’re not going to have that rebellious
Confrontational crap that you see in most families but those families are filled with do it this way because I said so I’m the dad well that’s why your kids flashing out at those ages you’ve treated them like they’re these things that you own like a dog or something
They’re human beings that we just are privileged to raise and Lead through life yeah yeah that’s so true even dude it’s 9:43 in the morning you’ve got me worked up I’m sorry man you’re gonna be fired up all day from this yeah and it’s I just remember when I was
Engaged there was so many comments of well your life is over now or six six months until your life ends and I remember just thinking so just feeling sorry for each one of the people that said that and I know sometimes people say it just because everybody says it
And it’s you know there’s there are people out there that just they don’t mean it they just regurgitate it but at the same time it just what you speak it slowly sinks into your life and whether it’s mediocrity or whether it’s complaining victim mentality it slowly sneaks in there and I remember just
Feeling sorry for each one of those people and now with kids right three-year-old four-year-old we’ll be out in public and you know they’ll act up or whatever and somebody will make a comment sometimes they’re positive sometimes be negative but the negative ones I’m always just in my head I’m like
I feel so sorry for that person whether maybe they didn’t have this in their life maybe they weren’t able to have kids or who knows but but just seeing you know two little boys playing and whether it’s at church right Sunday at church it’s an hour they’re supposed to
Be quiet so usually they don’t end up being quiet and right just but seeing two little boys and saying you know they’re two Terror or something it’s like no they’re they’re not like they’re they’re two little boys and they’re playing like the way that they should be
Sure they wrestling in the on Sunday and maybe it’s a little distracting at times but yeah of course man they’re like two bear cubs that we’re trying to you know bring them into this atmosphere but but just yeah feeling so sorry for people that think like that the the
Victim mentality that always complaining it’s it’s crazy how it can seep in and even if someone is just saying it and not meaning it it still just seeps in and that mediocrity just it it sinks into every part of their life and it’s just one of the things that I just can’t
Stand yeah I mean words have power there’s a reason you can read a book with black squiggly lines written on a page and you feel something in your soul like there’s there’s power in that your body will read words it’s crazy when you really think about what we’re doing even
Now the vibrations to my throat are making you think a certain way you’re changing your brain chemistry because of what I’m saying and vice versa yeah and so what you think happy wife happy life or I hate my life or the world hates me or everybody’s out to get me you you
Speak that enough times and you believe it dude you’re like creating this cycle you’re creating this reality that’s warped and twisted it’s like if you were looking right now and I put glasses on you that you didn’t need and everything got blurry you’re not the world is still
What it is and from your view it’s all jacked up though the world is still doing its thing it’s still crystal clear but for you it’s jacked up people when they say these things they’re jacking up their Vision they’re they’re they’re they’re looking for what’s wrong everything is like there’s a reason
Behind it instead of like you’re getting I know when I get in my own way because I’m very objective about it like yeah I screwed up you know like whatever I’ll fix it the world didn’t do this to me I did this to me I made the choices that
Got here I am my problem I’m also my solution so let me fix this thing that I caused and go somewhere I want to go you know and that goes for our relationships as well and that’s why it’s so important we let our kids be kids you know the people who we
Say what the hell you got to if you spare the rod you spoil the child if you’re not hitting your kids you know if you’re if you’re not controlling them and keeping them disciplined and doing these things then you know they’re going to run them up and they’re not going to
Respect you I was like dude if you if you act like a tyrant they’re not going to respect you they’re going to break away from this because they don’t want to be controlled like that if I saw your kids doing like WWE on a Sunday I’d like
Look at those kids having fun that’s awesome they they they’re not going to understand this message even if they were to sit perfectly and listen to it they’re just gonna be little robots sitting and listening because they were told to be seen and not heard and that’s
Not childhood Man kids want to play they want to run so give them the freedom to do that the world is going to be hard enough I don’t punish my kids there’s natural consequences that the world’s going to bring to them if you lie and something happens guess what you’re G to
Get hit and not literally physically hit but you’re gonna like the world’s gonna smack you with something for lying it always comes back yeah it it never you never you you never get away with something there’s it always comes back to you so why do we feel like we need to
Like hyper contr control all this as if our kids are going to become these these Nut Cases if we’re not you know being too heavy on them these same people who tell their kids do what I say because I said so are the exact people who on the
Other side of their head are going to say why don’t people stand up for themselves and defend themselves and you know do what’s right well because they were told not to and you told them to do what they were told but now you want them to speak against Authority it’s
Just it’s crazy the dots like the rabbit holes you can fall into are so deep it’s like aliceon Wonderland man you fall into like a whole another world when you see what childhood trauma does to adults and how the uh the The Duality I guess the dichotomy of what’s going on in
Their head they they can’t see that they are living a life that is opposite of what they’re saying people should do right yeah absolutely how do how does that change for you so you’ve got a 14-year-old son you have two kids so so is do you have a younger son younger
Daughter a daughter my daughter’s 11 how does that change for you with your daughter does it scare you more I don’t have a daughter i’ I’ve got two sons like I said one of the way I don’t know if it’s a boy or girl yet but if it’s a
Daughter I mean I’m I’m probably pretty freaked out at that point do that does that I I guess I don’t know different I guess new different see so you just said something but you don’t know why you said it why does it freak you out yeah
You’re right that’s a fair point got me no that’s good that’s good and so I’ll say this I always wanted the daughter and I I understand so here’s a a a live version of what we were just talking about you you said it but you
Know what’s going to happen if you have a daughter you’re going to be super pumped up man you’re you’re going to be fired up to have a little lady’s lead you’re not going to be freaked out at all and you’re going to do your thing and you’re going to find out extremely
Quickly that raising a daughter is like Raising a Son they’re just different gender it’s they’re the same thing they’re their own person because your sons aren’t you they’re their they’re their own men and so what you’re doing is leading two individual lives and this
Will be a third boy or girl it makes no difference boy or girl they’re going to have to develop their confidence boy or girl they’re going to have to express themselves the freedom it doesn’t matter what their gender is at all and so because you and I have never been girls
You would think and again this me saying I understand why you said it because they’re a girl we’ve never done that you and I have been boys we’ve been Sons we know what is we know what it is to be a man in the world there’s just that
Unknown of well when my kid is this age I’ll maybe have an idea of what when my son’s this age I’ll have an idea of what he’s thinking or but you won’t because you’re a totally different father than what they had the environment is totally different the world’s different and so that’s the
Point when I say like their own they’re in their own world world you I I thought I would know what my son was going through dude I have no idea this is a whole new world for me yeah and it’s wonderful I love it and so with my
Daughter it’s the same dude she is so unique in her own way and I’m very privileged to be the one raising her because it’s it it’s so foreign to how I think and operate and I love it it’s made me a better man cuz she she’ll stop
And notice a butterfly didn’t even know existed she’ll stop and see all these like she’s a total girl girl but even if she was a tomboy like the way that she thinks is so unique and kind of special to her that it’s you have two boys I bet you would say that they’re
Different I’m assuming they’re different it’s crazy it is it’s so crazy to see the difference it’s just it’s just a different person man but I will say that there are certain traits to girls that different than boys that we might not be well versed in but d That’s a part of
The the joy of parenting is learning these things and getting to know our kids and for girls having them show a side of the world that we might not have noticed when we were boys yeah but nothing to be freaked out about yeah no all right all right that’s good that’s
Good I like how you caught me in that right after I was saying that about other people see what I mean when I say like I can’t help it like we’re podcast recording and I’m like hey man you said the thing that you said you weren’t
Gonna say it is funny how you just maybe you just hear something and I mean you call me out like I I fully said it because without knowing why essentially it’s just it’s an unknown I would say but I probably it’s just I’ve heard people say that
Before I’ve heard dad’s men say oh raising a girl would scare me and then you’re just repeating the fact but it is just crazy I mean before kids you always just look at the parent then you look at the child and you think oh you know you must have done something differently for
The first one and the second one because they’re so different but having my own kids like the four-year-old is he he takes so he’s so quiet takes so long to process things and if it’s a new activity like he’ll just sit and he’ll watch it for 45 minutes to an
Hour and he won’t say a word and then whatever the activity is won’t take part he’ll just watch but his eyes are locked in and then an hour goes by and he’ll be able to tell you like what was happening who was going on he’ll be able to go through the whole
Process he’ll do it on his own after afterwards like his eyes are just locked in and the 2-year-old is just total opposite he’s he’s the first one to jump into things he’s tackling kids he’ll be running around not paying attention right they’re just Polar Opposites and
It’s so crazy to watch cuz I haven’t done anything differently for them sure one has one’s the older brother one’s the younger brother but their personalities are Polar Opposites and it’s so wild just to watch and say like they’re both brothers they both came from my wife and I but they are two
Totally different human beings as as almost as opposite as you could get when it comes to just being loud being crazy one super quiet diving into things not wanting to try anything new but just laser focused on everything that’s going on it’s it’s crazy to watch it’s crazy
To watch how different they are what I like about that too is it forces you to really de so let me share a little insight into what goes on my head when I have these discussions you know I’m thinking about how you are now forced to be an even better leader than
If they were the same you are forced to learn how to interact with two totally different if they were the exact same you only have to be one guy that one guy can control like both of these guys you can control like the the environment the atmosphere like you know what’s needed
What’s not needed you can help set them up for success with using the same template to set your sons up for Success you need two totally different templates yeah how you talk to them how you engage them the activities that you do the way that they respond to things your skill
Set as a dad is so much broader which is a great thing it’s more challenging for sure but what else he going to do with your life man like he’s going to try to be comfortable all the time like it’s good that you’re being challenged and as
They grow it’s not that they’re going to divide further but as they grow it’s going to be more like the contrast is going to be so much more clear because they’re doing bigger things and more things it’s less blocks and small Sports it’s like bigger decisions life decisions careers things like that and
You’re going to find yourself having to give guidance to two totally different men that’s awesome that’s a great experience for you and like I said with the daughter my daughter’s the second one so it’s it’s very unique having a boy than a girl because I can’t tell you
Maybe I got better as a parent from the first to the second one because your four-year-old and my 14-year-old they’re the oldest child we have Ever Raised every single day is a new PR right as our first kid so we’re we’re learning with them the second one we had an idea
So we’re like all right so here’s how sleep schedules I guess work and don’t work because we tried in the first exact here’s the gifts to get not get foods to get to not get um the things that to treat or address and to not treat or
Address the second one you kind of have it polished so I can’t tell you my daughter is very similar to my son also very different and so their differences are obviously the ones that stand out more because when it’s the same it’s I know how that works but when they’re
Different I realized is that because she’s a girl or is that because I was better as a parent that changed the way that she was brought up one of the things that I explained to my son and I think you should explain to your oldest at some point is acknowledging that is
Telling them that like when the third baby comes in and they maybe they like oh well you didn’t do that with me or how come they get to do that it’s I didn’t know better I’m learning with you and so I’ve told my son multiple times
I’m like yeah but with you we did this but with my daughter’s name is AA with AA we did that you know when we tested this we realized you didn’t like this but we didn’t know until it happened now we knew so we just skipped falling into
That hole and so I’ve told my son like give me Grace you know when we go through these things just understand I might make a mistake because I’ve never raised somebody your age before I’ve never done anything like this before and during this car ride I was like I’ve
Never spoken to his son about this things these things before and it was about Israel and all the things that were going on and so I told him straight up I’m like buddy you’re going to hear these things if not for me from someone else I don’t have a fatherhood handbook
And so what I’m going to do is I’m going to be honest with you and I don’t know if that’s the right thing right now but I’m just going to tell you the truth and it’s like you can do with it what you want and just let me know if you have
Any like issues it he was asking like how could people do this to each other there was a very uncomfortable conversation and I told him the real like my understandings and like what was really happening to people and it’s not good to talk about death man it’s not
Good to talk about destruction with your child but when they’re asking the questions it’s like it we’re now at that point you know it’s like a new hurdle to to clear together and I didn’t have a template I couldn’t be like hey Pat what do I do you know yeah exactly’ be like
Hey man I got a four-year-old you tell me what to do so looking at that sometimes you wing it and after that conversation maybe he comes back and he says oh I wish you had told me that earlier or helped I explain that better I will then be able to tell my daughter
Earlier or better the conversation him and I had yeah that it’s I just love the the openness of again I always think back to to Patrick B David’s just those three stages and the final one is is he says humanize where the children just realize that their parents are humans they’re
Not they’re not God they’re not these Supreme Beings they’re humans and he said that’s the final stage but he also says the beauty of that stage is that that’s when the relationship becomes the closest where it’s not it’s you’re not just you’re not idolized by your children like you are when they’re 2
Three 4 he’s like they they don’t you know they don’t only see your flaws but they see you as a human and that’s when they realize this person is is so similar not similar as in like personality or how they act but but in the same stage as we’re we’re humans and
And just figuring it out and it’s just really cool that you’re able to do that with your son I mean that that’s so powerful one of the ways and your military guys will catch this when I went through boot camp and then a school you pretty much like rever officers I
Was enlisted and so it’s like they’re they are Gods you know what they say go is like they they have the nice uniforms they’re the officers they’re in charge and I remember we were on the ship we were doing whatever and one of the officers wives flew in and we might have
Been Italy and we’re walking on the street we see them sitting eating and like oh come on over you know have an Espress or whatever so we sat down had a coffee and I remember in that moment thinking this is just a dude this is
Just a man who like had a degree and join the Navy too he’s just a man like him and I are exactly here to here he just gets paid more than me and has like more responsibilities that blew my mind dude that when that really clicked because they obviously they brainwash
You a little bit to like follow Authority but outside of that part of it I think being able to be open and have your kids see you for who you are it’s so liberating for them as well to be like yeah like I don’t have to be
Perfect when I if I make a mistake I’m not a bad kid because my dad makes mistakes he’s an adult and you kind of set the picture to like when I grow up I don’t have to have XYZ like I grow up I’m free to choose what I want to do
Like because my dad made his choices I don’t have to make the choices he made and also you know if your kid grows up and you makes a financial error uh gains some weight you know he makes a mistake in a relationship whatever he doesn’t hate himself because he’s like yeah my
Dad told me about this about how he made a financial error and then he fixed himself how he uh let his weight slide and then he fixed himself I’m whatever you can think of how he got fired from a job or he was laid off he wasn’t
Prepared how he didn’t get you know depressed you know if share that with your kids they’re prepared for that when it happens in their life and it might be something small they might get fired from McDonald’s like I did you know they might find themselves yeah like having
These micro issues they know how to deal with it because you’ve shared the issues you’ve had and to me like you were just saying they see the real you they don’t they don’t have to have this like on this pedestal it’s like no that’s a man
I can be just like him I can be strong too my own way I can be confident too my own way you know and someday they hear a podcast like this like yo my dad did this because he was working on himself he was talking to other people about it
I need to surround myself with good people I can work with and talk to about it yeah yeah I love that well Zach I won’t take up any more your time dude this is this is just so awesome I really appre we we went over the hour Mark um
But I just really appreciate you sharing I mean this is it was just super cool talking to you I just love love again when you I’ll see whether it’s like a Twitter post or a PO it’s just it’s so real just the way you’re like sharing it and I was like man I
Just got to talk to this guy because this is going to be so cool so yeah thanks so much for this Zach I really appreciate it yeah absolutely thank you for having me on but I mean you know the thing that really stands out is we barely scratched the surface yeah I mean
There’s so much to talk about and like there’s so many things to get into and I was just thinking I was like oh well we didn’t talk about this this or this and I was like man this so we’ll have to have another one either I can get you on
To the Daily draft podcast come back on but it’s a good discussion when I just checked the time like oh we did go over an hour like when you’re talking interesting and just kind of actually matter time flies you know it’s crazy how quick it goes it is crazy all right
Man I I just really appreciate it
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