The J The Be [Laughter] Be Yes love Love Div 1 2 20 Establish in the mode unalo goodness the man whose mind has been enlivened by contact with devotional service to the Lord gains positive scientific knowledge of the personality of godhead in the stage of Liberation from all material Association very inviting let go for report should in the B
7.3 it is said that out of many thousands of ordinary men one fortunate man Endeavors for perfection in life mostly men are conducted by the modes of passion and ignorance and thus they are engaged always in lust desire hankering ignorance and sleep out of many such manlike
Animals there is actually a man who knows the responsibility of human life and thus tries to make life perfect by following the prescribed duties and out of many thousands of such persons who have thus attain success in human life one may know scientifically about the personality God had treated Krishna
In the same babag 1855 it is also said that scientific knowledge of Shri Krishna is understood only by the process of devotional service Yoga Yoga the very same thing is confirmed here in in the above words no ordinary man or even one who has attained success in human life can know scientifically or
Perfectly the personality of godhead the next sentence is underlined in this book Perfection of human life is attained when one can understand that he is not the product of matter but is in fact spirit and as soon as one understands that he has nothing to do with matter he
At once ceases his material hankerings and becomes enlightened as a spiritual being this attainment of success is possible when one is above the modes of pth ignorance or in other words when one is actually a brah by qualification a brah is the symbol of satuna or the mode
Of goodness and others were not in mode of goodness or either chatri V Chas or less than Chas the bical stage is the highest stage of human life because of its good qualities so one cannot be a devote unless one at least qualifies as a Brahman the devote is already brah by
Action but that that is not the end of it as referred to above such brah has to become a BN in fact to be actually in the transcendental stage of pation of it is a liberated soul and is Transcendental even to the position of a Brahman in the material
Stage even a Brahman is also a conditioned so because although in the bical stage of conception of Brant or Transcendence realize scientific knowledge of the Supreme Lord is lacking one has to surpass the rical stage and reach the vave stage to understand the personality God chrish
The science of the personality of God it is a subject matter for study by the postgraduate students in the spiritual line foolish men or men with a poor fund of knowledge do not understand the Supreme Lord and they interpret Christian according to the respective whims the fact is however
That one cannot understand the science of the personality of godhead unless when is freed from the contamination of the material mods even up to the stage of a brah when qualified Brahman fact becomes a in the alen state of Liberation he can know what is actually the personality of
Godhead here’s the chicken or the egg question which comes first the chicken or the egg which comes first becoming a prominent or becoming the persuasion in this seems to be becoming a brah because without becoming a brah you can’t become a Bish so if we’re not yet Brahman are weas the question
And who could say I’ve had her medical fies we can say we have some other qualities we have some qualities and we can also have some other qualities so therefore we’re not in the SE yet so we not bu yet by that logic in the a that we read yesterday
Evening and again now this morning the stage of perfection is the topic that’s being discussed so being aava means the mature stage of vava the mature stage of vava surpasses that of a brahmanam say it again the mature stage of VN surpasses that of a brah supposing
What is not yet at the M mature stage of VN that’s most of us we’re on the path we’re striving to become thank who can raise your hand and say I have all my polies so there’s there’s the sad and there’s the S the goal and the means to reach the
Goal the means to reach the goal that’s been discussed by these verses it’s the B process B process is the process to reach the goal let’s do this one Another you know the verse the verse says theas those who are not Bas of Mah they don’t have Mah they don’t have good qualities and the Converses B in relation to Ban where is a good word where there isn’t some material attachment or mat sense material possessor to such persons all good qualities come so that sounds like become a b of H and all good qualities come that’s what that one sounds like and this one sounds like you’re not
Going to have the qualities of B until you first become a Brahman does sound like a contradiction chicken in the egg so then it goes back to earlier verses what’s the seed of bti looking so we just used this example yesterday there’s a telsy plant over there in the other
Side of the room and where did the telsy plant come from came from the seed where the seed come from a tel pl we come many leaves and they start to produce mes that’s a tall seed or next the mes produce seeds or all of the above which is the tel
SE the above they’re different stages so here is speaking this is at least how I understand what PR is communicating the mature stage is where the brahmana quality has already been surp reached and surpassed and thus it’s the state of perfection which not just the seed because the seed was several verses
Before the seed was hearing topics about one become Pious when becomes bestowed with good qualities by the process of hearing and that’s that’s B so one who’s engaged in hearing we’re engaged in hearing and chanting so we’re Baptist because as we Baptist by definition we’re engaged in bu so it’s
The process it’s the seed or the couple of leaves come out the seed when you’re sprouting the seed so there stages that there not a contradiction it depends on the lens through which you’re looking and if the topic if the the focus is the stage of perfection then
One can say the stage of Brahman has already been surpassed the qualities of Brahman have been attained but how does one attain them this is this AG of is ocean of FS not do ocean of faults so from that ocean of faults how can one have good qualities one doesn’t have good
Qualities one has bad qualities and that so maybe relatively better and relatively worse but not the process of bti has a beginning it has a seed and it has a nourishing of that so where’s the seed come from and then comes another question you know is is B inherent or
Inherited is both not or B is within but dormant like the seed and the seed becomes awaken by contact with water and sunlight not too much water not too much anything this the little so the cultivation of the seed of bti that’s Krishna it’s already within comes by
Contact with one who’s carrying Baki Baki awakens Baki so they’re not contradictory it’s just describing a process and stages in that process which is one can say the nine stages of bakti which rup Swami presented Inu and is further elaborated upon in and is further elaborated upon
In the stages of are outline here their outlines they’re they’re drawing from the scripture the scripture gives it in a nutshell and then it’s expanded so there stages no problem this is describing the stage of perfection and to attain that stage of perfection the hermetical status must be
There the seed doesn’t have to have the mature stage but the mature stage has to have the seed within it or having surpassed it so bakti gives rise to bakti and the seed gives rise to when the process of cultivation of the seed is properly performed it it it
Gives rise to the the mature stage and that’s what this is describing that’s the second paragraph I’ll read the underlined section again Perfection of human life is attained when one can understand that he is not the product of matter but is in fact spirit and as soon as one understands that he
Has nothing to do with matter he at once ceases material hankerings and becomes enlightened as a spiritual being so this is same as the 551 that we heard the other evening UMAS spiritual happiness happiness Brahma spiritual happiness that’s unending brah that’s the spiritual position that spiritual position is attained by buy
However we heard one may be try for that spiritual Brahma as imp personalist so they’re not discounted they’re just not fully matured yet but they’re aspiring for that means leaving behind the material Affinity so that rajas and Thomas that’s prominently material Affinity that’s awarded to someone who wants mature
Enjoyment covered by R covered by Thomas or combination and then Mo of goodness doesn’t mean sh here is specifically the phras is used V stage here it is free from all contamination that’s the Sher stage That’s The Liberation stage and there the approaching Liberation stage so the aspiration for Brahma or sh
Sa is best achieved by and then comparing the Brahma of the impers and the Brahma of baka the BR the bakas brahmas is complete because it’s only through bakti as the ver that’s quoted in the purport by B one can understand the Supreme person and by understanding the Supreme person by Baki
The coverings are reduced eventually the coverings are eliminated and the real happiness that we’re seeking is awakened that’s a nice promise how we’re not experiencing got a lot of covering and not a lot of submission some covering there should be some submission and a lot of
Covering to have work to do so it’s not mechanical it’s devotional process and their degrees of progress in that submission activity while the enchanting giving up offenses and engaging instead in faithful hearing that’s where our work Po and to be we do our work or do our follow properly the process it is
Effective now there’s impacted for built within the verse is the statement that when that Baki is awakened then positive knowledge or scientific knowledge about the object of V becomes un liment he gains positive scientific knowledge of the personality godhead in the stage of Liberation from all material Association so it’s gradual like the
Rising of the sun this morning I was thinking of being with Dina bundo at requin because they’re looking out the window and looking at there’s this really bright star that moves in a trajectory like this but that it goes like this and if you over over the season it would start
Over here on the horizon and then over here and then over here so he he point din appointed where this was early in the morning over there is nand and over there is the Sun so in the in the winter the sun rises that direction in the north part and as the season
Moves it goes over in that direction towards nund and as the season go then it starts Rising going back so the rising and setting just a detail rising of the setting of the sun doesn’t change always on the Eastern Horizon but sometimes more in the northern sometimes
More in the southern side it’s just made it mology which is another topic but the sun always Rises gradually that’s the point and we can count on it we can count on the sun rising they you the annihilation of the universe it won’t rise because universe is annihilated so is the
Sun but as long as there’s Universe the sun r slowly and B Rises slowly no little by little by little by little and this is describing the perfectional stage and in that perfectional stage something arises scientific knowledge the prophet used the word scientific knowledge a l by contrasting Faith or belief to a
Fact and the way that you can get facts is presumably by science but it say spiritual science is fact and menal science keeps changing it’s not fact in spiritual science there is it’s a process and it’s predictable the outome that’s science experimentation hypothesis experiment ation observation conclusion you know went to college and
He knew that process so he described you can’t make an experiment to verify but you can have the experience it’s not by direct perception it’s by realization the realization of scientific knowledge Rising when one’s heart becomes free from aure contamination and there’s a process to become free from mat
Contamination supposing that’s not my experience then you won’t experience the personality of godhead and then because you don’t experience something doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist when the sun sets I don’t experience the sun doesn’t it doesn’t not exist do Seas to exist because they don’t see it etc
Etc so seeing is not believing seeing is imperfect with imperfect senses and what’s then what’s Experience by Awakening of transcendental knowledge and the transcendental knowledge is within and it can become confirmed without by Guru sastra but the alignment of the experience should be in the light of Guru sastra and
Otherwise they left to the side I’m pausing because a question came up in Portland I think it was yeah in Portland about how do we understand statements that are realizations by our aaras that differ from another acharia all we to accept those realizations or are we to take them as poetic and not
Factual of course it depends but there so we in that discussion what scientific knowledge of the personality of God had anyways so there needs to be inment with scripture but there may be some things that are chares there many things that are chares have written that’s not found in the pages of
Shim or other pamas at least not one that we familiar with so what about those I mean the specific topic was one we many of us have heard my mother just s was binding my mother just s was feeding Krishna because he wanted her to stop churning
The butter she looked out of the corner of her eye and she saw the milk boiling on the stove and she ran to regular the milk was boiling on the stove so there’s this statement that’s the B and other piranas many other piranas have the same leing but there this realization that
Many of us have heard that the milk was boiling over because the milk was ready to commit suicide that that’s not in the B where does it come from we all know it and there’s there’s other nice examples we don’t know where does it come from so it come from the realization of
A poet the of a pure devote poet and there is there’s a name for that poet one of the when har par translated harri’s commentary on the 10th Kanto and in two verses he describes the milk contemplating suicide and they jump into the fire with use of my
Life because Krishna Will Be So Satisfied by the breast Lo of Mother D I’ll have no service with you my life better J into fire it’s a realization so are the question is or was are we to accept that as fact or not and there so many other
Examples R go Swami’s experience of of p time between R and Krishna that are not within the Bible T not within any scripture we to accept them as fact then everything depends upon the caliber of that person is he on on this platform where positive scientific knowledge of Personality godhead
Arises there’s a phrase from Brahma like that and there’s many there’s similar sour repeated many many many many times by our charas that that Sanskrit is very similar and it says essentially that according To according to the faith according to the focus because Faith guides our Focus supposing people don’t have strong faith unfocused opposing they have strong faith then it becomes much easier to remain focused so faith is very important Consciousness Guided by faith and faith in what faith in scripture
Reality of the existence of the personality of God so that comes by hearing and chanting the coverings are removed that’s previous verses in this chapter coverings are removed and then something else is left what’s left who we are is left and when that that’s a statement in this little section when we
Come to understand who we are not the body but part of the Supreme then that’s receptivity for scientific knowledge to arise that should be must be in alignment with gur sastra but maybe you know very specific realization that you can’t confirm from Guru from chra but it’s really realization of a of
A person who is being described in this ver in purple do accept accept the words of Krishna because he’s the perfect person but we accept the words of the perfect person who is representative of the perfect person Krishna as perfect we have to frat and worry about
It wait a minute how how does this happen and where is it cerated and so the authority ultimately is is shastra and then through pure devotion scientific knowledge of Krishna the absolute truth awakens and there’s diversity after all what be to Sutra as the’s realization of the Vas it was
Sh according to the B it’s V’s realization ofra based on his meditation and chance K 1 chapter 7 instructed by Nar and it’s his realizations and here it is NRA that’s evidence that it’s his realization we accept it’s sh and so there only one person that can have that qualification or others could
Have that qualification others can have that qualification that exceptional but those that have that exceptional qualification scientific knowledge arises so then we have to examine or consider the source and then we can accept without worries so the source from whom we hear is very important last sentence when a qualified Brahman
Fact becomes a bnab in the alive and state of Liberation he can know what is actually the personality of God sounds really nice any discussion um pardon me my pardon if my question is not very well found so uh one one thought that was coming to my mind was
Uh uh the positive scientific knowledge so is this the um s ab and PR that it’s been talked about yes okay um so it’s the progena is but it’s it’s all three in one sense samband is the relationship anyway is all three or any part of any portion of
Those three and then one one slight confusion is kind of the same chicken and egg thing kind of thing so uh my aim in a way is uh you know I’m I’m uh inspired by the by the Brahman wives in the 10th Kanto where they are B bakas of
Krishna so that inspires me and in a way uh almost seems like after bti is established then you get the positive scienic knowledge so uh I guess my question is I want to still focus on the bti part does that make sense always okay Don’t Stray thank
You mahaj U so the the brahmana word that is being talked about here so it’s obviously by Guna and Karma right not not by birth I’m listening uh yeah the reason I’m asking is uh I heard this past time where when sh pra’s disciples went to
Vavan some of the vasis were you know blessing the Western vnas that may be you be of brahmana so they were thinking by birth is that what they were blessing what’s your question is that a blessing no I’m saying so so when they are blessing okay so what was your
Question so my my question is so if it is by Guna and Karma then if he practice as PR is saying if you practice the vnaa way of life it seems that the brahminical you know qualifications are included in that so one doesn’t have to Aspire to take
Birth as a brahmana in one’s next life and then practice vnsm and all that but you’re repeating yourself in the premise is in the question so I’m not I’m confused is there is is there substance to the vava sadu in bavan giving blessings to the Western vavas is there
A substance to that is that what you’re asking no no so when they are blessing uh the VN Western vnas that may you be may you be a brahmana in your next life so they are thinking by birth and thinking oh yeah yeah right yeah but but our understanding here from scripture
From scripture is G and Karm that’s ABC but you know some persons have a have a different idea than scripture har Krishna Guru mahaj uh you said uh vas he through his realization when he uh wrote bhagwatam it became a scripture but Rupa go Swami or
Harri SRI SRI harisu and Sh ragos Swami when there write the realization it’s a scrip it’s it is equivalent to a scripture for us God godna was it had it has weight like that it’s not exactly the same go ahead yeah that’s the question why did vas’s realization become scripture but not theirs
Well we can say specifically with Rupa go Swami he was instructed just as Yas was instructed by Naruto scripture chananya Maha pru instructed Rupa Swami here’s truths principles not all the details but many many many many details now write scripture and I give you I I I invest
You in the power to write and to understand scripture as good as it’s commentary one can say is commentary and one can also say is scripture just like batam is commentary and B down to suture so it’s it’s carries the same weight or comparable weight you want to get into a pans scale
Thing which which has greater weight we give special special weight to Vias and because of his position he’s an incarnation of the personality of godhead specifically assigned to that service of compiling and explaining as it you know so was Rupa Swami similarly empowered yes but we give special weight to
Vias and his is writing but it’s comparable is that right and to my knowledge har stor had a guru that it’s not quite the same as chananya Maha pru Krishna himself empowering grupa go Swami so gradations of weight behind you har Krishna I just had a question um
How does like family tree relate to Soul’s Journey back to godhead it’s like how does what relate family tree like you know like the family tree yeah type of like you know like in which family you’re born how does late how do like this do like Souls like travel through
The family or like I mean like it seems like they they like come like you can be you know with the next birth you can become you know somebody else like because of your karma and but it’s like but it’s also seems like that people who are like the certain tradition like
Children are more usually advanced in the same tradition you know and it’s like is this I’m it’s kind of confusing to me you know like to um how important is it what’s the role yeah it’s kind of like how what’s the role of it it’s um it has weight but it’s it’s it
Can be become weightless okay meaning let’s take the example of Barat maharash next life he became a deer in the next life he became the son of a brahmano quick jump from a deer to a brahmano because you know the deer per X XYZ reasons but his deeper quality was
Pure devote so he took birth as a brahmana or you know you can think prad Maharaj in which family was he born not an elevated family and then there’s different they different days at Brahma so there’s different experiences of who prad was in his previous life which is related to your
Question but in in either case whoever he was in his previous life he took birth in a demoniac family so his qualification was hearing from Naruto not the family in which he was born and one could say his previous activity in different days of Brahma there’s different who was prol in his previous
Life so there’s some correlation but it’s not a one to one it can it can completely dissolve here’s another valmiki who was fiki before he was fiki but he became a pure devote by association with Naro correct Nar himself so he was you know the son of a shter and he became Nar
In his next life so it’s it’s not there is a there’s some correl there’s continuation from One Life to the next life but it’s not and largely where the mind is is where the the soul goes after this life but then then there’s there’s the rule and there’s exceptions to the rule
Or factors to to way it’s not always by birth and even by birth when it completely change by sad there’s rules and there’s transformation that comes by S and exceptional circumstances too I mean going from a deer to a brahmana that’s like Quantum Leap but he but it’s because of Super
Soul even when he in the body of the deer he remembered his previous life now most of us don’t remember our previous life what to speak of being in the body of a deer and remembering his life as a king So Super Soul factors prevails in some circumstances
But generally the Super Soul principle is according to G and Karma and that determines the the family in which we take birth Etc it’s all in krishna’s hand there’s rules and there’s exceptions does that unconfuse you or makes it more confusing kind of stabilizes confusing confusion ultimately Super Soul Supreme
Lord is in charge of everything and there’s patterns that he establishes that that’s the rule and then there’s exceptions to rules that he establishes as he if he so desires for whatever reason he doesn’t need our you know approval or are okay now I I understand why he did what he did
Do it’s not subject to our understanding why he did what he did he can make exceptions to his rules and he does sometimes for whatever the reasons so that believe that like look that family kind of like is like attachment I know like especially in the beginning of the
Movement there was like the children are like attachment and treated and separated like it was all kind of stor so but like also like some families have like very negative relationships and I feel like if you treat them like attachment like you kind of let them go
It makes it easier to to follow this path yeah but at the same time it’s like a kind of like I know it’s like it is your tree you know like it’s your roots and it’s kind of it’s makes it kind of hard I mean like I’m trying to
Find ways to I guess to to leave that attachment to get separated and just I don’t know gradual it’s just like the rising of the Sun or the growing of a Tulsa from a Tulsa seed it’s gradual so the the principle is affinity for Transcendence or affinity for
Krishna or Affinity from knowing who I really am because the family Roots is not who you really are there may be attachments okay that’s the material condition now who are you and if you really want to know who you are scripture will help you and Krishna will help you and doesn’t you
Know doesn’t require something rough or abrupt or abrasive or just trashing because that’s artificial it’ll come back so grow in the Affinity of knowing who you are and then just like it was in this purport and then knowledge scientific knowledge can be yours who you really who your real family
Is it has connected to who you really are but as long as bodily identification is there the PO will remain sometimes greater sometimes lesser and the the maturing stage is not just trash it maturing stage is the gradual rising of the Sun and then there’s still respect without
Attachment the respect on the spiritual platform and the gratitude for so much ser service has been rendered by family members etc etc etc etc but that’s it’s gradual so allow for that don’t worry thank you you can harur Krishna but you can’t hurry Krishna okay she
Has mahaj two questions I had uh first was in context of offenses of offenses offenses because like you mentioned that uh uh and also in purport like uh we have to go beyond these modes and offenses are ALS a big obstacle so like uh offenses you mentioned that
Uh when whenever we consider something spiritual to be material uh that’s where we usually commit the offenes but I was I was also uh contemplating on like we understand uh that um we we we don’t need to we don’t want to take it as a material uh and we are aware of that
Fact but but still mistakes happen because of our own limitations so essentially we are not uh thinking in that way but mistakes to happen and because of lack of capacity we let the mistake happen and we just let it go many times so I was realizing that we
Usually speak in context of ninda means offense about you know blaspheming the devotees and all but also like in SAA and like so many offenses are being committed time to time so it feels like sometimes that wow it’s there is no way out no that’s not true you know murya condomin holds
Scriptural evidence to help you in this Quagmire searad is very quickly instantly dismissed by the holy name but supposing I or You anyone none of us are not chanting the pure Holy Name even in that abas chanting it has the power to instantly dissolve all sa apparat the
Reactions so it doesn’t mean okay great I can do Saad and I just chant so not that’s not that’s sitting on the strength of chanting but that’s another that’s not so you just you strive for shoot an arm by avoiding offenses now suppose I’m not there yet or you’re not
There yet so then what continue chanting with faith that I let me let me desist from such and such tendency mistake tendency and strive for the other and keep good Association to give me the strength to go beyond my own strength in in good Association so you just follow the paky process properly
Not mechanically but properly devotionally and that that such tend mistak making Tendencies will subside and supposing there’s a very elevated devote not you but supposing there’s a very elevated devote and they make a mistake so we know from bhag Krishna considers that person satu and Krishna corrects the
Situation so you’re not there yet you’re not such a person but the principle is Krishna is kind and Krishna will do the course correction to stay fixed on the destination and striving by right means one is assured of success so you say back to you looks like there’s no way
Out that’s darkness of ignorance don’t submit to that go to the light so my second question was with regard to the realizations um like uh like in devotional service also many times heart wants to feel good not essentially enjoyment but wants to feel good in relationship with Krishna uh to keep that relationship
Alive so we get some realization even among devotees we talk about krishna’s mercy so much uh so just a thought came to my mind and it felt so good that narim uh told uh I mean pralad maharaj’s uh Seven Generations forward and backward yes all were liberated so just a thought came
That since narima bhagan loves pralad Maharaj so he loves all those who are related to pralad Maharaj that’s what love is so that’s why probably this connects to the previous question the family tree question go ahead so there was again a fear that it could be a speculation it is not
Mentioned in the shastras but then it is what’s not mentioned were you saying it what’s it that since since narim loves pralad Maharaj that’s why he loves all those who are connected with pralad Maharaj and he gave this Liberation to all of them so that that’s just a
Logical connection that my brain was trying to make uh but then I felt good about it but then again I went into this fear that oh it is it could be just a speculation that that’s not how I should think that what narim bhan thought so I don’t like this fear basically well
Don’t speculate very unsettling you ask here’s here praat was asked by brahmananda many years ago when it says seven generations Seven Generations what’s that Liberation PR said they’ll get the opportunity to engage in devotional service clear yeah so then if you if you don’t know you ask you get this
Idea you you go to Guru s shastra and say it’s this idea in line with gurus sastra or not you don’t have to have fear so my main point was not what kind of Liberation but why he gave I understand the question I understand your question and then you take your
Question and you go to Guru sastra don’t be in fear don’t be paralyzed but we get many such thoughts so how many okay you go gurus become experienced devote by sadu don’t whine and complain and be in fear don’t stay there you have a Baki process follow the
Process and you may not get an answer immediately that’s okay put the the thought in the parking lot and when you get the answer you got the answer until then it’s in the parking lot it’s not in the oh I’m fearful because I came up with this speculation you just follow the
Process and then like the the purport said and it’s underlined in your book when that stage comes then scientific knowledge awakens of the personality of godhead so what was he thinking you know just yupa go Swami had the capacity to know what Krishna was thinking and being so empowered so we go
To ragos Swami what does he write in Baku what does he write what does Jos Swami WR in the Saras so go study them put your question in a parking lot and go study g s shastra you can have a really big parking lot that’s okay but follow the process okay I’m
Going to end there Sheila thank you J
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