Whom do I have both on? Am I good? Okay. Wonderful Good afternoon everyone one it is truly wonderful to see you. Thank you for braving the cold. Thank you. Um, I am Celeste Watkins-hayes, the Joan and Sanford while dean of the Gerald R Ford School of Public Policy at the University of Michigan.
I’m also the founding director of our center for Racial Justice here at the Ford School, and I am delighted to welcome all of you here this afternoon for today’s Policy Talks event. The Ford School’s annual event in honor of the Reverend Doctor Martin Luther King, Jr, featuring my friend and a great
Public servant. Montgomery, Alabama mayor Steven Reed. Thank you. Thank you so it is so good to see our Ford School community gathered here. And welcome to the many of you from across campus and beyond who I know are tuning in virtually. This event is part of the University of Michigan’s annual Reverend
Doctor Martin Luther King Jr Symposium. This year’s symposium theme refers to a phrase and Doctor King’s I have a Dream speech with this faith, we will be able to transform the jangling discords of our nation into a beautiful symphony of brotherhood, he said. And it was his belief in the transform
Power of faith, hope and love to mend the risks in society like Doctor King, our guest speaker today is a graduate of Morehouse College, an HBCU in Atlanta, Georgia. Also a graduate of Vanderbilt University’s Owens Graduate School of Management. I was fortunate to get to know him
When he was at Morehouse, and I was attending Spelman College just a few years ago. >> That’s right. I like that. >> Mayor Reed was sworn in November 2019 as the 57th mayor of Montgomery, a destination known as the birthplace of the civil rights movement. He’s the first African American to hold
This position. His public career began when he served as Montgomery County’s first African American and youngest elected probate judge. In that position, he served on the Department of Homeland Security’s Election Integrity Commission and initiated a statewide campaign to educate the public about voter ID laws. He was the first probate judge
In the state to grant same sex marriage licenses. Following the Supreme Court ruling. As mayor, he has led the efforts to increase funding for Montgomery’s public schools for the first time in 30 years. He restructured the city government to increase efficiency and effectiveness, while ensuring the city maintained a balanced
Budget without having to touch reserves, borrow money, or initiate layoff offs. Mayor Reed has been recognized by route 50 as one of ten leaders nationwide who are tackling some of the most pressing issues facing America’s cities, and is one of the ten most powerful and influential local officials by Yellowhammer News. He received
The Martin Luther King Leadership Award for government service. He reflects on his journey and the lessons he learned from his father, a civil rights activist. In his book First Best Lesson in Leadership and Legacy from Today’s Civil Rights Movement in his introduction, he writes, reaching the promised land means
Winning the fight for our democracy. It demands that we eradicate the racial wealth gap. It requires us to end the horrors of mass incarceration and restore opportunity, dignity and hope in our most vulnerable communities. Above all else, reaching the promised Land calls us to cultivate the next generation and pass down the
Culture, the teachings and the value system that our forefathers and foremothers carried before us. Beautifully written and just a portion of this great book. After he joins me in conversation, two Forest School students, Kenneth Wilson and Christiana Verdelis, will read audience questions, which you can submit using using the
QR code on cards distributed here in the auditorium, or which can be submitted online. Line. I would also like to acknowledge our co sponsor, the center for Local, State and Urban Policy and our media partner, Detroit Public Television, which is rebroadcast and distributing this program across the PBS network with that, please join
Me in welcoming mayor Reed. Thank you. Thank you for being here. >> Thank you. >> How are you doing? I’m well. >> How are you? >> Good, good. So I feel kind of bad because you got off the plane coming from Montgomery, Alabama. And it is us now.
>> See, I thought you were going to say you felt bad because Michigan beat Alabama. That’s true. And the Rose Bowl and I had to come in, you know, one week after and saying, hail to the victors, right? >> Right. And play nice at University of Michigan.
>> Yes, I will do just that. >> So welcome, Chris. Do you want to just. >> Oh, all right. >> That might help. How’s that? >> All right. Thanks for all the mics on. >> Yeah. >> So I thought it would be very interesting to, um, move through this journey of this
Conversation, thinking about about the importance of different destinations on your leadership journey, but also thinking about our students. But the larger audience. You all have to think about a journey through their lives and the ways in which people at and places and policies end up being so, so
Influential. So I want to kind of walk through that journey with you, and I want to start with the importance of place. The importance of place. And I wonder if you can situate Montgomery, Alabama, for us. I wonder if you can situate it historically. And I wonder if
You can encourage us to see it not just as a city in time, but as a current and vibrant and dynamic city to the present. Right? >> That’s a great question. Um I think Montgomery is a city with different personnel cities, if you will, in different identities. Mhm. Um, Montgomery
Was founded in 18, 1918. Uh, and became one of the largest places for Slea waves to be traded, um, in the South because of its proximity to the Alabama River. And when you think about that led to the growing economy, which was based around cotton at that time, in particular in
What’s called the black belt, not because of the population, but because of the rich soil that so much of the farmland had and the color of that soil. And it then became the state capital. Uh after a few moves and it served as the permanent capital for the state of
Alabama. And since then serving as a state capital, it was the place where, um, the telegram was sent about the Confederate states seceding from the Union. And Jefferson Davis has a star or a spot that’s designated by a star on our state capitol steps still to this day, uh, where he
Was sworn in. So our state capital is that state capital of the Confederate States of America. And when you consider all that happened during that time and post Civil War and Reconstruction, and then obviously the advent of Jim Crow laws, a lot has taken place there, only to then be, uh,
Challenged, if you will, by people like Ed Nixon, uh, who was leading marches on City Hall for the fair treatment of colored at that time, school children. Um, something that we still wrestle with to this day when it comes to school funding and equitable investment. Uh, only to be challenged by a
Pastor by the name of the reverend doctor, uh, Vernon Johns, who was an Oberlin, uh, college graduate who led Dexter Avenue, uh, Baptist Church, uh, and challenged our city government to do right by the, uh, Negroes. Notice the change in terminology, uh, that I’m using. And so when, uh, Reverend
Johns got a little bit to, to, uh, controversy all the church brought in this pastor by the name of Martin Luther King Jr, who was not controversial at all, who was a son of a prominent, uh, Baptist preacher in Atlanta and who would not cause any trouble.
>> Right. So they thought at the age of 26, just out of seminary, only to be asked by again, the leader of the, uh, black community for so many decades, Ed Nixon, um, to lead the Montgomery Improvement Association, which was the organization, uh, that that led the initiated the Montgomery Bus
Boycott, which was supposed to be one day and ended up lasting 382 days. >> I think it is the blueprint for civil disobedience and commitment to, uh, move and impact in this country. I don’t think that we’ve seen since anything like that at. And so Montgomery has really seen the
Arc of the pain of this country, as well as the progress. Yes. And I think what we have seen since then have been starts and stops of progress, politically and otherwise, lies in Montgomery and in Alabama, but not at at the level or at the pace that I think many would
Have liked to have seen. Whether that’s been through the challenge of state government or whether that has been through just the national politics and the policy that come out of that. We have not been a part of the growth primarily of the New South. Uh, like parts of Georgia
In particular around Atlanta or the Carolinas and other places as well. And so Montgomery has kind of had this push and pull about. Well, how far do we want to go and how fast out, um, do we want to pace ourselves? And what are we willing to do in
Order to get there and I think prior to, uh, my election in 2019, which you know, ironically came 200 years after the city was founded, um, the city has had a benefit of being able to be known as a birthplace of the civil rights movement without practicing what the civil rights
Movement really was about. And that is some of the hypocrisy that we challenge, uh, today from City Hall, those are things that we wrestle with, uh, we have to have open conversation about now. And those are things that I think still make, you know, people, uh, some at least
Uncomfortable while, uh, in our city, in our state, because we’re having our honest conversation, it’s very easy to have superficial conversations about change. Uh, that is very easy and always has been. Doctor King wrote about that in many, uh, and several of his books and talked about it, many of his
Sermons. So it’s very easy to talk about that, uh, coexistence , uh, versus not existing at all . Um, and we have to think that through in a place like Montgomery. And I think that’s where we are. And I want to credit, um, so many who have
Helped us get to that point in different layers, but certainly in the last ten plus years, it’s been Bryan Stevenson and the equal Justice Initiative and the Museum, um, uh, of the Legacy Museum, as well as the memorial for Peace and Justice, which is shone a light on, um, really the
Impact of slavery, not just in the South, but throughout this country. Uh, the companies, the families, the institutions that benefited from it, uh, from the East Coast, uh, through the Midwest, all the way to the West Coast. It is a fascinating look. And I think for us to really be
The city that hosts this museum, not only to bring in leaders in from the public sector and the private sector and philanthropic sector, as well. But everyday citizens who want to learn about the true history of the country is certainly significant. And that is where Montgomery is and
Where we’re poised to go. I think is really being much more than just a place that talks about or is reflective of the past, but one is building toward a bright future. >> So the way that you’re using the past as, first of all, a place of recognition to understand how inequities have
Gotten generated and how they’ve been perpetuated. But also using history to really situate yourself in a national conversation around racial inequality. Sure. Um, I can imagine often there are people that were really resistant to the building of the museum or to situating Montgomery in this way. I can imagine someone
Saying we should move on. Um, you know, we don’t want to be known and reminded of our history there. It just reminds people of a past that we want to forget or pretend or some would say, didn’t really happen in the way that that that we all know
That it happened how how do you respond to a critique that is really kind of challenging? The idea of owning Montgomery history? >> Well, I think it’s the old axiom of if you don’t know your past, you’re bound to repeat it. Right. And I think that we’re in very, uh, sensitive times right
Now that everyone in this room and those that are watching ought to be, uh, under standing of and, you know, you see this in the rhetoric that’s used you see this in some of the tactics. I think that’s a part of the, um, political discourse and has
Been for the last few years that for whatever reason, we’re accepting as normal when, uh, in the past, they would be shamed and, uh, in the past they would be pushed out. And so we really have to figure out as a nation, who are we and where do we want
To go? It’s not now just about the deep South. It’s about the nation as a whole. And what I’d like to think is that Montgomery can serve as a place that people can understand the arc of this country, but also can understand, again, you know, how you move in a positive
Direction, maybe at a slower pace again than many of us would have liked. But how do you move forward, and what are the tough conversations? What does that really entail? What are the tough decisions? You know that you really have to consider? And I think when you you really
Factor in our city’s place not only again in the past, but where we are in the present, we welcome those discussions. And so when we have of board leaders, we have presidents of institutions, or we have cabinet members from the president of the United States all the way through influencers,
Entertainers and actors, people who have platforms that are coming to learn. It’s fascinating. Uh how much people don’t know about one American history. Uh, but also just about public policy. And it’s something that no one in this room or those that that are watching virtually should forget. There are a lot of
People who don’t understand civics 101, regardless if we may believe that, or we were taught it in elementary and middle school and high school, most Americans don’t understand that. And so it’s up to us. I think, to kind of translate that and make sure that people can follow
It and connect the dots a little bit as to why these things make sense. And from Montgomery standpoint point, you know, our city boasts of being the place where Mrs. Rosa Parks, uh, made a courageous stand where Attorney Fred Gray and others, uh, helped her through legal challenges. And judge Frank
Johnson through the courts, uh, assisted uh marchers to get from Selma to Montgomery, spurred on by the, uh, killing of Jimmie Lee Jackson in Marion, Alabama, the home of Coretta Scott King. And really brought about by the arrest of James Orange. So when we think about the domino effect
, these things didn’t happen in isolation. These things were happening coordinated, and it took all of government. It took all of, you know, activism as well as those that were really on the right side, even in Montgomery, to understand what was at stake. And I think that
The final thing that I’ll say is I’m, um, really surprised by how many local residents we have, uh, who did not understand what was happening in Montgomery, uh, at the time, whose parents or grandparents did not share with them all the things that were taking place, who have a
Knowledge to me that, you know, we have a lot to learn. I’m embarrassed to see my parents and my grandparents name on this list. On these documents. We had no idea. And so it is a an opportunity to reflect, but it’s also, as I shared with a lot of
Them in opportunity not to correct any wrongs of any ancestor or someone that is no longer here, but but to correct the right now and that is where you’re playing at in this moment. What are you doing right now? It’s not about what happened ten, 30 or 50 years
Ago, but what are you doing right now to address these same issues that Doctor King and so many others were talking about at that time? >> Mhm. When you talk about I really like this notion of correcting the right now. And one of the things that our students think about a lot is,
Is how to correct the right now. And they’re faced with a choice of do I do that work back home where where I was born and raised and have these roots, or do I go and explore other places to contribute and make a difference? Talk to us about
Your decision to focus your work on Montgomery, where you’re from. You talk about in your book that it was a bit of a circuitous path to end up back in Montgomery, but you found this calling of your family and your parents and their legacy and their work kind of drawing
You in. Can you talk about the importance of place? >> I love how you said it poetically. I found this calling. Um, it really the calling kind of found me. Um my goal coming out of business school was to build wealth, was to start businesses and if not, go back into corporate America
And really help others do that, because I kind of view that as really the next leg of the journey. Other civil rights movement, not necessarily the political side, but I think getting back home, not seeing the progress, uh, mentioned in First Best that, you know, me running for office was, uh, came
Out of a sense of frustration and inspiration and frustration that those in office had not done more and weren’t really weren’t willing to do more for, uh, and the inspiration of President Obama’s run in 20,007 and 2008. And so those two things really helped me, you know, come to the conclusion. I
Also helped that as I was trying to get friends to run in, none of my friends wanted to run for office. Those that wanted to, those that wanted to run were people who I didn’t think should run, and those that I that I thought should have run, didn’t
Want any part of it. Right. And you know, I think that it was a friend of mine who said, well, you know, Steve, if you think it’s so important, why don’t you run? And you know me for a long time, I just said, well, I just might, you know, that was just
Kind of the response, right? That was kind of the clap back. I didn’t have any intent on running at that time. It was just something to say. Just to shut them up. But you know, I ended up kind of getting to a point where I started to give it serious consideration because
Not only was it impacting the city, it was impacting the state . And I just didn’t see why people didn’t have more courage, why there was more focus on being reelected as opposed to doing the right thing. A lot of those people were quote, uh, anyone that we think is worth
Quoting, but, you know, practicing it was something different. And and, you know, now we post and we share all these things on social media. But at that time, it was just it in a speech, in remarks. And I just don’t really operate, uh, like that. So I decided that,
You know, I would pray about it, talk to my family about it, and, and I think in speaking with my father in particular, uh, who had met Doctor King in 1960, um, as a SGA president of Alabama State University and was asked to go to Raleigh with other student leaders. Um uh,
Representative Clyburn and John Lewis, Diane Nash, so many other luminaries that we know. But hundreds of people whose names we don’t know. And he always brings that up, who were from around the country, in particular the South, to help start the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee. His thing was, well, you know,
You’re here if you want to make change. Often you have to do it yourself because until you do that, you probably aren’t going to be satisfied with what other people consider to be good progress. And that’s really what what came about. And, um, you know, I ran and the calling was
Really just to make change. I’ve been active, you know, on boards and nonprofits. And so I was very, very active in the community. I just was not in elected office. And I try to stress that now, now, having now been in elected office since 2012, that that, you know, it’s
Important for people to understand that everyone has a role to play. Some in front of, in, out, in, out, front, some kind of behind the scenes, uh, some through their, their Rolodex of being able to help run campaigns and finance campaigns. Importantly um, those . Things are important. But I
Would share with all of the, uh, folks here in is wherever you decide to run or to get involved . I think it’s just know why you’re getting involved. It’s less important where, in my opinion, as to the why. And I think if you focus on that, then
You can truly, truly have an impact. And communities are welcoming of people who are, um, you know, really sensitive and really invested for the right reasons in it, community is are resistant to people they view as opportunists. Um, uh, they view as kind of, you know, using them
As a means to an end. And I think that if we can kind of keep that in mind and we can get , uh, talented people, uh, like these students and graduates here to consider that the local, state and federal levels. >> So when you ran for office
And within in your time as probate court judge, you started to really find yourself on the forefront of some of the kind of hot button issues of the day. Same sex marriage, voting rights . And I, I started to, you know, as I noticed your career, you were operating at the local, but
You were participating in these national conversations and really showing how local government is such an important conduit and where the rubber meets the road for so many of these national debates and conversations. So talk to us about your time as a probate court judge and those those moments where you took a stand
Where you really you know, took on an issue that you thought was important locally, but that ended up having these kind of national ramifications. >> And so one, I ran on the issue around voting rights. So in Alabama, the probate judge is the chief election official. So long before our elections got to
Be controversial, they were boring as watching paint dry, right? Nobody cared about us counting votes or who the registrar was were. I mean, it was just old ladies and, you know, retirees who kind of wanted something to do in the election office. So for years, nobody cared about elections.
But that was one of the things, one of the reasons why I ran, because the board of registrars had been using Alabama to keep people from voting, even after the, uh, the passage of the voting rights Act and certainly before that. So it’s important to understand kind of the levers
Of power when it comes to those things. And they were appointed by the probate judge, one by the sheriff. And I think one by the circuit clerk. But they could basically strike your name from a roll or your ancestor’s name from a roll, or, or just say, well, you know, you can’t vote
Here. That was a major issue. Uh, in Alabama, for instance, my grandfather was able to vote long before most were in Alabama because he had a farm. But more importantly, he paid his poll taxes. Um, that was not the case for 99% of black people in Alabama during that time.
>> So, you know, because you, you know, you said like, oh, he paid his poll taxes were only charged to black folks, correct? At the time. That’s right. Yeah. And this was a way to disenfranchize. Yes, absolutely. >> And so I ran on, on on that.
And it was really a quote that I heard from Congressman Lewis. And it was great to end up getting his support and all of my races, including that 1 in 2012. Uh John Lewis called the voter ID at 21st Century poll tax. So that became something that I would say all the time
While quoting him. So we went into it with a political, uh, mindset. We’re going to level the playing field here about what’s happening. And some of the you know, erosion of progress that we’d seen. But when it came to, you know, judgments and legal actions like the, uh, Obergefell decision and
Implementing that at state level, I’d love to tell you that, you know, I just knew I would be nominated for a Profile in Courage Award, but it really was you know, a matter of my colleagues stepping back as much as it was me stepping forward. So an overfilled decision was
Handed down legalizing same sex marriage. Uh, we got on the call . There’s a probate judge in Alabama again, very, very powerful position. I encourage everyone. Understood your local government because the power may not be where you think it is. Uh, the notoriety may be, but the power is not there for
Instance, in Alabama, it’s a sheriff. Sheriff has immense power, even over elections because he tapped. They control the tabulation of those votes, uh, and a number of other things . So in the code of Alabama, it is referenced as the high sheriff. Right. So we still call our sheriff, who is a fraternity
Brother, mine. And, uh, actually the first black sheriff in our county’s history, the high sheriff. But I say that because it comes with immense power. But most people would think the police chief, uh, uh, the sheriff has ten times more power in law enforcement than the police chief. Uh, and that’s in
A lot of states. So it’s important to understand that. And you know what responsibility is, uh, and what’s codify in your state constitution when it comes to these things. But for that, I mentioned it in the book . Uh, we’re on a call, and the Supreme Court issued the ruling
Around same sex marriages. Well the probate judge also issues marriage licenses in some places . It’s a county clerk. But in Alabama comes under the probate judge. And you have probate judges saying they weren’t going to issue marriage licenses. Amazing. To me. I mean, it just I mean, I was caught flat footed
On that. Like, what do you mean Supreme Court? Pretty simple. And it was this political. And what I’m going to call this sanctimonious reaction to what people believed about same sex marriage. Well, you know, we take an oath to uphold the Constitution. It’s pretty simple . What you take an oath to is
Not to your political philosophy. This is what it is court rulings handed down. But you got to understand that Alabama, for as much as much of the South, uh, has still been, uh, you know, as we like to say, not not the show me state that Missouri is but the make me
State and that’s how Alabama has been where it was. Brown v Board of Education. Uh, and the laws that would go on the lawsuits would go on for 8 to 10 years before schools and public facilities were truly desegregated, uh, all the way through decisions like this. And
Um, I said along with the mayor, I’m sorry, the probate judge of Jefferson County. Well, the Supreme Court has issued a ruling. We have to abide by the law, and we’re going to issue these licenses. Well, I didn’t realize that my colleagues were taking a step back as much as it
Wasn’t me taking a step up. Uh, but what happened was. Um, when I kind of heard the argument, it was reminiscent of what I’d heard from my parents, from my aunts and uncles around civil rights legislation, around voting rights legislation. I mean, very similar tone and tenor. Uh, just around a
Different issue. And I just said, well, you know, if you guys are going to take this approach, then mine is going to be a little bit different. So I took a very proactive approach, one that was media driven and a way to kind of shame, um, and to draw attention to what was
Happening. And and I had a few other colleagues that came along with us, even in terms of legal briefs that were filed. But it was done intentionally to really show and shine a light that, again, you guys talk a good game, but when it comes to civil rights, you aren’t practicing it
And you want the benefit of people thinking that there’s been all this progress made, which again, there’s been some, but not nearly enough in terms of the leadership. And that was the approach that we took. And I guess that’s how I ended up doing what it was. Um you know,
This week or other, you know, political shows to really talk about what was at stake. Because what I saw is not just the, uh, Obergefell decision and the issue around same sex marriage, but other decisions that would be made subsequently by the Supreme Court or other federal courts. And what might this set
The precedent for judges in Alabama or around the country to then do disobey them? Well, then that should come with a price. And I mentioned it, uh, first best that, um, we had a chief Justice by the name of Roy Moore who threatened to remove all the probate judges, which he does
Not have. The constitutional right to, doesn’t have the power to do as a chief justice, as a Supreme Court. And, um, I was talking with our sheriff at the time and I just said, hey, you know, I’m about to tell him where he can go. And I said, if
He tries to send some people down here, I got to make sure you got my back. And he was like, I got your front, back and side. He was like, I wish he would bring his down here. We’ll take care of him. And now that’s how sheriffs talk, uh, of my
Share of anyway. So that was pretty much, you know, what it was. And you kind of. You need that when you’re in those times, uh, of tension and, and, you know, uncertainty. And that did embolden me to, you know, speak a little louder and speak a little firmer about why we did
What we did. >> So let me ask you about that question of substance and substance and style. So clearly, you know. The policies, you know , the levers of power. But what I also hear is a particular style, um, there’s a grounding in the civil rights movement, but there’s also a grounding of
Kind of how local politics gets done. And the, the ways in which sometimes it can it can be a little rough and tumble. It can be a little profane. Um, it can be all of these different things. And I wonder if you can talk about, um, how you think about that stylistically, how
You think about about communicating in ways that are very formal and other ways that are very kind of profane and may get you into trouble and but, you know, never the less kind of move the agenda forward and understand and how to maneuver all of these different contexts.
I wonder if you can just talk about that, because I noticed that kind of shift in language, and I’d wonder if you can talk about how you use that as a tool in the work that you do. I think we all have in the style. >> Yeah, I think we all have to
Do that when you’re, you know, in a space of, you know, uh, making public decisions. Right You have to know your audience. There’s strategic communication means, uh, what words do you use? You know, who do you cite? What is the rationale, uh, what is the approach? Um, some may understand, and Shakespeare,
Some may understand. GZ so, you know, you’ve got to be able to speak a little bit of both. Mhm. Um, and you’ve got to be able to, you know, really be uh, channel, you know, James Baldwin and James Brown. Um uh, I mean, it literally is that dependent
On you know, who you’re talking to and really at what level, uh, that you feel you need to communicate. Because what I found is you can have the best idea, uh, you can have the most pure intentions, but if people aren’t able to be, uh, galvanized by this, then, you
Know, what does it do, right? Um, when we think about the civil rights movement, uh, the movement leaders understood the power of the press. They understood who they could talk to, what journalists they could trust. Uh who to tell about what meetings were happening when those things weren’t by
Accident. Yeah Um, and it was if we really think about a seminal point in the civil rights movement, the cameras capturing the marchers being beaten on the bridge at and Selma, that changed really, the trajectory of the movement. I mean, that movement had been stalled for a minute. Um, the Dallas County
Voters League had been working long before for Doctor King and Andrew Young and C.T. Vivian and so many others. You know, John Lewis obviously came there. So the ability to magnify your message and to reach sometimes even an external audience, one that is not, uh, local or sort
Of proximate to the issue itself is very important. And whether it’s, uh, you know, appearing on cable news now or whether it’s the use of social media with so many of us have the option to do, uh, in various ways. All of those are, uh, methods to really communicate that, you have to
Consider, depending on the topic and depending on the progress that you’re making and again, I don’t think Doctor King would have been as impactful without the media. Um as great as his oratorical skills were unparalleled in my opinion, uh, would not have happened. We can think about the election of the
First black president. Uh, to this country. Doesn’t happen without the 2004 convention speech. Maybe he’s still in the US Senate. Uh, maybe he would have run for governor or something. But he doesn’t go from unknown senator to presidential candidate in four years without that speech. So words are powerful. Imagery is
Powerful. But also the vehicles in which you have to use is also powerful. And I think when we’re trying to convey de messages and we’re trying to, uh, really justify outcomes, all those things are necessary. >> So I want to ask you about a moment where when you and your
City in particular found itself in the spotlight in a way that it didn’t anticipate, and you which way this time and you had to think about about this question of media. And that is in August, I believe there was a melee, a brawl. >> Oh, a situation, a situation.
>> That’s one way to describe it in Montgomery, where there was a dispute over boats ING and essential only how many, how many, how many of these folks know what you’re talking about? Can we get a raise of hands and it went viral. >> So if you don’t know, just Google Montgomery brawl.
>> Brawl. Yeah. >> And imagery of a hat going up. Imagery of a folding chair, imagery of the boats, imagery of people swimming across to participate in this. And that is your city. Right. So as mayor, how do you think about this moment where you see you’re
Smiling at me? But this is like really it’s a wonderful moment of, you know, we went to school together. So I can ask you this because I really think that you were faced with a question of how are you going to unite the city? How are you going to talk
About this to the country that is watching this? How are you going to navigate this landscape that you’re in of social media and high pressure? Uh, observation? >> Man, you made that sound so sophisticated. I’m going to simplify this real quick. So, you know, when somebody gets there, but they just get there
But hooked okay. So sometimes you just got to acknowledge that that’s what it is. Now I’m going to back up because I had just left there from a we had a back to school event on our riverfront. We weren’t gone 30 minutes before the call came across, the police radio, there
Was a disturbance. Okay so that’s how I get it. Is a disturbance on the river and the really? I hate to say this, but the first thing I asked was, are any weapons used? Was anybody shot? Okay, now, once you tell me no weapons at that time, we didn’t know no weapons were
Used. And more importantly, no one had been shot. I was like, okay, on to the next. All right. So we’re moving on. It’s not until the next day, uh, that my police chief calls me and tells me, I think you better check out social media. Now, usually I’m
The first one on or getting opinion or whatever. Anything that remotely might be viral for what that time means these days. Right Uh, but this one, I saw it Sunday, Sunday, midday or something like that. And I was just amazed. Now, for us, we didn’t see the view from from
The boat until hours later. So our cameras are from the land out onto the river, because really we’re worried about, you know, boats and things happening on the water, not anything happening on the docks. So for those that have seen it, you know, that that shows a little
Bit. But not a lot. It wasn’t until later that evening that we saw the guy jumping in the water and swimming from the boat to the dock and everything that took place. Yes. So you know, that just changed again, perspective matters, right? I can see one thing from this side
Of the room. Someone else can see something from the other side. It matters. And that just changed everything. And I think from there it was all right. Where is everything right now? How is it being perceived in, you know, at that time? So many things were trending to where I
Think by late that night, cable news had picked it up. All right. So this is now, you know, a little bit over 24 hours, maybe not quite 36 at and I was like, well, I think we’re going to have to say something about this because then it becomes even more of a crisis
Management. >> Sure. Moment >> And at that point you know, uh, social media has, um, indicted, tried and convicted those, those that were part of it, for better or for worse. And, you know, my standpoint was you just really not get in front of the story and not be the
Story, but to try to acknowledge what was going on. So we didn’t make comments Monday. Um, because we wanted to make sure we got all our facts together and by Tuesday we made, uh, a we had a press conference with our police chief leading it, just saying exactly what happened,
What led up to it, and what the steps would be from there. It was really kind of to, um, not get in the way of what had already happened and what had already taken place. And but more importantly, not to jeopardize legal process. And that was very important, a
Little bit different than some other times when the city had been put in the national media, where there was around the George Floyd protest, or in particular when it was around our decisions around Covid 1918 and things that kind of put us opposite our state government, that was a little bit different,
Where we had to walk a probably a tighter rope, if you will, on that, than we did with, uh, the riverfront brawl or the Montgomery Melee and everything else that social media dubbed it. But it was, uh, very ironic in terms of everything that happened. But the healing was
Not as did not really have. It was not as deep as I think most people would think, because I mean, I had a number of people across all colors, background, class cultures calling and say, you know what? Those guys and they didn’t say those guys, uh, deserve to get their butts
Kicked and I’m glad that they did. And that wasn’t just from Polarize the City in the way that it could have not. No, not not in any way. I mean, there was, uh, that’s probably been one of the best consensus moments in the community City, uh, was that, you know, they
Deserve to get what they got. And so that was the feedback that I got from, uh, many in the community. Yeah >> For sure. Yeah. >> I want to turn to the students. But before I do, I wonder if you can comment on one more. Um, Experian that you’ve
Had as mayor and that is navigating the Covid 19 pandemic. And and so many issues , um, that I know you’ve spoken about it in that experience. And one of them you just talked about, which was this relationship between local government, state government and national politics and the way in
Which the height of the pandemic got so politically polarized. And at the end of the day, you’re running a city where there’s hospitals, where there’s schools, where there’s family, Liz, where there’s grocery stores, where there’s all of these infrastructures that have to be managed. Can you talk to
Us about that experience for you and what it taught you about leadership? >> Well, one, there is no manual for how to deal with a pandemic. And so there was anything that we understood from mayors who had, uh, served maybe for 1 or 2 terms, or even mayors who had
Termed out was that they had never seen anything like this. Right And so, you know, a lot of it kind of comes back to your gut instinct. And then the team that you have around you to help make your decision. But I think it starts with a person and a
Leader. And I think from, you know, from jump, we decided we were going to, uh, follow the data. We’re going to make the decisions that were in the best interest of, of our residents and we will let everything else kind of play itself out. So for us, it was really a matter of,
You know, what’s the science telling us? What’s the best approach to this? Certainly pinging of the mayors and other colleagues about things they were doing, whether it was across the state or across the country, uh, in their community. But that really was a touch and go, you know, situation when it
Was trial by fire and, and I think, you know, kind of leaned back on some of the basic leadership principles that probably all of us have read about or heard about at some point, regardless of our journey, you know, what do you really utilize to make those decisions? What helps you come
To a decision in a crisis and, you know, you just really have to trust that. And then be willing to, uh, not navigate and adapt where necessary and I think that was our approach. We ended up being drawn into the, I guess, national political discourse about that, because so
Much was happening with, um, conservative leaning states taking one position versus, uh, mayors of more moderate or progressive cities taking a different position. And again, for us, it didn’t get personal with our governor or myself or, or really that political. It was really more about, look, I, I’m making the decision over here
That I think it’s right. And I’ll let the governor, uh, and others made the decision. They think is right. But this is what we’re going to do in the jurisdiction that I lead. And because of the research we were doing, because of the team we had around us, and I think
Because of the depth of our, uh, argument, we came out, you know, really looking as really looking like we one had the most information to that we’re making the right decision. And it was the least political. And it was. And that’s not to say that there weren’t people who disagreed
Where they were supporters of mine or weren’t you got to be ready for that. I think in any at any level of leadership. But but, you know, we were grounded in our approach and we felt very confident in our rationale for why we were doing that during Covid. But make no mistake, it
Was a very tense time for a lot of leaders, not just mayors, schools, superintendents, university presidents. Uh, I mean, so many people that I spoke with that were in you know, public facing positions, you know, really had to deal with this challenge in a way that was really unique. And I
Want to say this to this audience, you know, listen, there’s some things that are just political, right? Uh, I get that. But some things we have found a way to make political. I spoke about it a little, a little while ago around how boring elections really still are, but certainly were they’re
Still boring, but some things have been made to be political. And you have to ask yourself, why is that? You mentioned in my, my bio that I served on the, um, United States Election Integrity Commission. Well, that’s a bipartisan commission that was set up by the Department of Homeland Security,
One Republican, one Democrat from every state and territory in the country. Uh, whether it was a secretary of state and a local election official or what have you. I mean, those conference things were pretty mundane, just really talking about the mechanics of carrying out election. Now that organization, that entity has
Really been afraid, for lack of a better terme. So there are some things that we have to make sure we kind of get back to a sense of normalcy around. And when it comes to public health, that shouldn’t be something that’s political, that’s something that we have to, you
Know, really call out the BS when it’s necessary and it doesn’t matter who it is that it is that. Because, again, you may think that your neighbor or your friend understands civics the way you do, they don’t. So it’s up to the leaders and the subject matter matter experts to
Really kind of explain some of that, whether it be through your own platform on social media, whether it be through a more public facing opportunity that you have because Covid 19 really got politicized in a way that I think cost people lives, um, cost people their lives. And I
Think it cost us a lot more as a regard in the trust around government and just institutions as a whole than it should have. >> Um, one, uh, we have really great. >> Thank you so much for that. We have questions from Christiana and Kenneth. So take it away. Yeah.
>> So the first question, um, how has the reapportionment of congressional districts response to the Allen versus Milligan ruling impacted the electoral terrain in Montgomery and greater Alabama? >> Great question. So the reapportionment, um, uh, plans now have drawn a new district in the second Congressional District, of which Montgomery
Makes up the primary voting block of that district. Uh, it’s an area that, um, I considered running for the position I considered running for, but just had too many things that I wanted to finish, uh, as mayor to, to run for Congress. And I actually like to get things
Done. I don’t know that our Congress people really want to get things done. They want to just talk about what needs to be done. Uh, but I’m much more of a implementer than I am a talker. When that where that is concerned. More importantly, though, I do think it sends a
Positive message around the country that that I hope will not only impact congressional races, but I think will impact state House races, school board races, county and city races as well. So just anytime we can make the process around redistricting fairer, I think is better for our democracy. And
That is something that, again, given the history of Montgomery and the role Alabama has played in helping this nation really fulfill its true responsibility to each and every citizen, I’m glad that that decision came out. It’s impacted Louisiana. They will have to redraw districts. Uh, Georgia. Uh, other parts of the South as
Well. And I think we’ll see, you know, high on some other states have to do the same thing. Um >> Thank you for your answer. Um, the next question is take this off. The next question. We have a lot of us in the audience are public policy students. And,
You know, we come to the Ford School having to learn about policy agendas. So members of the audience wanted to know, what’s your approach in deciding the strategic priorities to cater to in Montgomery, say that one more time. >> What’s my approach to deciding the strategic priorities to cater to in Montgomery?
>> Sure. I think my approach is one that’s people led and driven . >> Uh, what the feedback has been from, uh, our residents about what is needed. The unique thing for being the first, uh, it comes with, you know, it share roses, but it also comes with its thorns, too. And I
Think that’s important to, to understand for many of you who will be the first. And I’m sure the best in what you decide to do, because it’s not always easy, because once people see someone that is a change, there are a lot of expectations. Uh, there’s a lot of, uh, immediate
Gratification that that’s expected. And it doesn’t always happen. Like that. But for us, it happened very quickly. One was around funding public education, very, very important. That was at the top of the list for most people, even though in my city I don’t have any, uh, responsibility. For or
Accountability, I guess I should say for public education. But all the responsibility for it. Right. Um and I think that’s something that has guided me. But really listening to the people in terms of what they would like to see from their government and, and what they don’t want to see, both, both
Have not really informed us. And I come from the school of thought that’s a little bit different than many even if I don’t know if I had the votes, I will bring the issue up. One I want the public to know that I hear you, uh, we’re going to you
Know, debate this issue and if the if the ordinance is killed, um, or dies on the floor, then you know who’s behind that. But we’re not going to play this shell game of never bringing it to you. Uh, out of some, you know, false sense of political solidarity. My thing is,
Everyone that has a vote on our nine member council, I do not have a vote as mayor. Some mayors do, depending on city. Um, but we’re going to bring up these issues so the public can understand where and why we’re making the decision on that particular policy. And I think
That’s the best way, uh, to be transparent and trustworthy is to hear what the public is asking you to do. And bring it up for a debate and bring it up for a vote. That’s the great part of our democracy. Mhm. >> Wonderful. >> Yeah. So with the recent
Assaults on the truthful and critical teachings of American history, um, how does a city such as Montgomery that has played such a pivotal role in racial justice respond in the implementation of education policy and specifically the teaching of American history? >> We do more of it. So you
Know, we are we’re going to speak truth to power regardless. We did it with when it wasn’t, uh, an acronym associated with it. We did it when there was, you know, far more on the line. Uh, and we’ll continue to do that. And I would encourage, uh, others and I think that people
Are adapting to where this is, um, to really speak the truth about the, the history of the country, both good and bad. It’s important for all of us to understand that it doesn’t mean that no different than anything else. Uh, you have to paint it one way or the other. The truth
Is what it is. Uh, and I was grateful to take a walk around the campus and see what you all are doing here at the University of Michigan. And whether it be from the art museum and those that are depicted in the art and some of their stories about who
They really were and how they came to some of those positions and, and adding that truth to it, because it gives us context. And I think as Americans, context is important. So we don’t just see things as, uh, you know, very simplified picture, but we see things as really, uh, complicated matters
That people were having to wrestle with and deal with so that we understand how to address those, uh, similar challenges in our own time. Um is there an issue policy or program that you encountered after becoming mayor that you came to see as more important than you did before? Uh, I think
, um, yeah. Municipal court reform around fines and fees. I did not understand, you know, how that impacted people. I mean, just simple parking tickets, uh, fines around speeding and just how that impacted particularly people who were right at the poverty line. Um, and why they weren’t able to
, uh, pay those things off. So we have done an audit, and we’ll release that study, see the results of that study here in the upcoming weeks about how we’re changing, uh, our municipal courts and again, coming from a different type of court system in the probate courts. Uh, I didn’t have an
Understanding of those that were coming into contact with our city through municipal courts and the financial challenges and the, uh, ripple effect that had on them. So that has totally given me a different position. And I’ll say one other thing. Both are kind of, I guess, law enforcement related is really
The interaction with our police department and making sure that now we’re implementing 21st century policing practices. And I think for a lot of cities as, uh, the George Floyd murder, uh, highlighted that for, for our city, we had had an unarmed black man shot by a white police officer, uh, within probably two
Years of that happening, um, which had illuminated that issue before. But I think those two issues certainly have been, uh, areas that I’ve kind of got more informed about than I was coming in and about how we can provide solutions to address it. >> Um, maybe one more question for me.
>> I’ll make it short. >> You all right? All right. Um, so knowing history is one thing, but doing something about it is something else. And so is there a possibility of passing legislation to establish reparations for black Montgomery residents? And what would reparations possibly look like in Montgomery and greater
Alabama? No chance. >> Uh, in our legislature, uh, we can’t even pass a minimum wage increase, uh, to $15 an hour because of our legislature. So that that’s something that, um, and maybe in some other states, they have the opportunity to do, um, but when we have encountered, uh, issues
Not even near as, um, as challenging as that, we’ve had resistance and in our state, like a lot of states, your legislature has the majority of the power. Uh, that’s where home rule really resides. And we’ve seen the city of Birmingham, um, as well as our ability to tax
Ourselves and those that were commuters, um, taking away by our legislature since I was elected and so for us, um, my, my mantra is to figure out those things that are really, uh, practical and I think that address some of the same underlying issues that we’re asking that question. Um
>> I’ll ask one last question. >> Um, you talked a lot today about the benefits of being mayor as opposed to different levels of government. So what do you think are the limitations of working on a municipal policy level, and do you think there are fewer than the benefits?
>> Well, I think you know, listen, the I tell people this all the time back home, uh, the government closest to you is a government that impacts you the most. So you know, there’s one critique that I have and I’ve said this to my friends in media, national media in
Particular, is that they don’t cover state houses enough. The action right now is not in DC. The action is in your is in your state legislature. It is bill by bill. What’s in Michigan is then cut and pasted and replaced with Mississippi. What’s in Mississippi is cut and replaced
With Missouri. You catch on. So for a lot of things that used to happen at the federal level, bills legislation isn’t moving there. So what’s happening is the legislation is moving state by state. And I think that more of you are needed both to help drive policy me, as well as to
Help drive outcomes at the state and local level. As much as the federal level. Now, that’s if you really want to get things done. It’s not sexy. Uh, it’s not pretty. But you know, that is really where the sausage is being made, is at the local level. And from my aspect, you
Know, as a person in that, you know, serves as the first vice president, African American Mayors Association is on the board of directors for the US Conference of Mayors, which is the largest, uh, bipartisan organization for mayors, um, working with mayors around this country. I think that mayors probably the best job in
Politics. It is a place where you are are the big baller shot caller. You are the person that is the thermostat and not the thermometer. You are putting your finger on the scale, probably more there than you can in any other position. Now, that’s not to say that if you’re
A council member, you’re a county commissioner, a school board member, or, uh, those aren’t important roles. They are very, very important. Even more so now, uh, I think, than maybe even just a decade or two ago. But I think at the local level, you’re able to drive change. Uh,
Much more than you can at a higher level. So it’s a matter of, you know, where your priorities are. And I think in terms of cost benefit analysis, um, you know, the benefits at the local level and what type of change you can drive there far outweigh, um, you know, the cost
Of the type, time, effort and energy it takes to get there. So I really enjoy those, at least to have some start at the local level. And I think when you even look at our more effective of, uh, policy makers at the national level, most of them
Have been at the local or state level at some form of their career. If you look at their bio, you hear them talk. They’ve been elected at the local level, so they understand government and really where it moves. And that’s across the board, not related to any one party. So I
Think it’s important that we have, uh, top talent like you, um, at that level to really help us drive the change because again, that’s where the action is, the distraction is in Washington. But the action is in your statehouses and your city halls across the country. Wow.
>> As we close, I wonder if you can comment on the legacy of Martin Luther King Jr, the connection between been where you are from, your family’s relationship to the civil rights movement, your time at Morehouse College, where King went, um, how you think about that? Um, helping to enact a vision that
Is consistent with King’s work? I just want to lay all of that and just invite, invite you to invite you to plug in where you feel so moved to reflect on King’s legacy. >> So I wear this pin, which is a pin of our city, um, a flag.
It’s a pin of our flag, which was adopted after, uh, integration orders were issued by the courts. It is basically on the, the, uh, motto of the Confederate flag. So I wear it as a reminder of where we have been, but yet where we still have to go and, you know, when I
Think of Doctor King and I talk about this in the book, I mean, I had the opportunity to be around Mrs. Coretta Scott King several times. One of the things I share in the book was, is, um, probably back in middle school when she came to stay with us on
A trip back to Montgomery because she was from the same hometown as my mom and my mom’s side of the family. Marion, Alabama. So for me, you know, their words in a lot of the things that I heard and did not appreciate at that time are ever present with me. Uh, it’s
Interesting. Now, going back, having gone back to read those books that Doctor King wrote, uh , about Montgomery all the way through. Uh, where do we go from here? Chaos or community? In 1967 to look at the books that what he was writing and what he was talking about, and
Particularly toward the end of his, um, life speaking more about economic injustice, things that, again, that we’re still talking about, we gave our sanitation workers a case in point, um, a 19% increase during Covid or right after Covid. They had never had that type of, uh, pay increase. And in my remarks,
I quoted Doctor King as he was helping those sanitation workers in Memphis and talk about a dignity of work and talking about why that was so important. Regard If you were a street sweeper or not. And in Montgomery, what I feel the challenge in particular to be of
Some of the city and have been around so many people, uh, whose names we know, but most people don’t, who are part of the bus boycott all the way through that decade of the voting rights movement. Uh, just things they would say and making sure that our city and our state actually
Live up again, uh, to its fullest potential and not just talk about it. We make a lot of money off of civil rights tourism and one of the things that I shared is we aren’t going to profit off of those that have gone on in our practice. It
That’s hard for my chamber of Commerce to understand. That’s hard for our, uh, our business community to understand and listen again. It’s one who, uh, came through Morehouse College. Uh the finance background degree , um, went to business school. I understand the power and the impact of capitalism and the
Dollar as well as anyone. Um, but it has to be done with the right lens, and it has to be done with an inclusive economy and one that furthers, uh, where I believe a 95 year old Doctor King would be. And I’ve had the blessing to be around, um, his
Colleague, former Atlanta mayor Andrew Young, and Ambassador Young talks about this all the time. Again as someone who was there, someone who was on that balcony in Memphis, but some one who was there in Selma. And so many other places in Detroit. 1962 he comes to speak here, I
Think what Hill Auditorium, uh, if I got that right, um, here, the university of Michigan. And one of his topics was, what does the want? So we can still ask that question. You know, now, just changing the, the terminology. And so, so, you know, when you look at his
Writings, it was really just fairness. Yeah. It was really justice, really. You know, between those two words and through policy and through our approach at City Hall, we’ve been trying to do that. And we try to model that for other communities to do. And I think that for a city like ours that
Served only benefits from the blood, sweat and tears of who I think are some of the most courageous people who’ve ever walked the soil of this country, uh, to stand in the face of domestic terrorism and state sanctioned segregation on each and every day. Knowing your car, your house, your church could be
Bombed just by walking outside because you were in here at this meeting. Uh, didn’t matter your religion or your color, uh, just who you’re affiliated with. There’s a lot more for us to do, and I don’t. I don’t apologize for, um, those that, you know, wish as mayor that I wouldn’t
Talk about it. And I tell them if you would do it, I wouldn’t have to talk about it. So just do it. And we have less talks, and we’ll have less meetings around this. But um, you know, when you win with two thirds of the vote going in, you know, I
Call that a mandate. And I think that for us, us, it’s important to force our city and our state to look itself in the mirror about what have we really done, uh, to be proud of some of Doctor King’s work. And Reverend Abernathy and Missus Parks and Attorney gray and so many others
. Uh, and the work that they did , but also recognize that there’s a lot more and I mean a lot more that we have to do around racial justice and economic, um, equality and opportunity, uh, just for everyone in, in our city. And I think then if we would do that,
When we talk about Doctor King’s beloved community, we will have a, um, better ability to sit up straight and to have our chest out about what we have really accomplished. But but right now, channeling all of that is something that I do each and every day. It impacts every
Decision, not 1 or 2. It impacts every decision. It impacts the lens of which I view things not just politically, but just through the standpoint of what is fair, what is just. And again, what would Doctor King say and what would so, so many of those foot soldiers say if
They had had a black mayor, um, and someone who went to their alma mater who was a part of their fraternity, who lived in their neighborhood, someone they could talk to very casually, uh, what would be their thoughts? And I shared that with, uh, Doctor Bernice King. Uh, Reverend King’s daughter. Uh
Last year, that those are things that kind of impact my decisions and the fact that our city, uh, still isn’t where it needs to be. It’s good because we know we’ve got a challenge, and we know we’ve got our work cut out for us to do. But I think that,
By and large, our community wants to meet that challenge. And is committed to doing so, even if it makes us uncomfortable. >> Well, thank you so much, mayor. >> Read the book. Is called First Best Lessons in Leadership and Legacy from Today’s Civil Rights Movement. I encourage you
To check out the book. It is wonderful. I encourage you to visit Montgomery, Alabama. It’s been so helpful and interesting and exciting to hear about the historical legacy of the city and its contemporary free future. It’s a city to watch and we’re very excited, and I want to thank you personally. Um,
This means so, so much to me because we knew each other when. Yes. Right Um, so it’s really, really great to have you here at the Forest School of Public Policy. >> Congratulations to you. And thank you for your leadership. And thank you for the invitation . >> Thank you. Thank you. Let’s
Thank you. >> And on behalf of the Gerald R Ford School of Public Policy at the University of Michigan, thank you for joining us for this policy talk with Mayor Steven Reed. >> Thank you a
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