Miriam Castilla 0:00 – 0:29
The way you feel about money will either make you magnetic to it or make you repel it unconsciously. Because if you’re somebody who, for example, feels really uncomfortable asking to be paid or invoicing people, that’s going to come through if you try to make a sale but you don’t really believe that what you’re offering is worth it or you’re worried that you’re overcharging or that the person can’t afford it, all of that will come through in your energy. And we all pick up on this unconsciously.
Aundefined 0:31 – 0:53
Do you think money takes up more life space than it should? On this show, we discuss with and share stories from artists, authors, entrepreneurs and advisors about how they mindfully minimize the time and energy spent thinking about money. Join your host, Jonathan Dio, and learn how to put money in its place and get more out of life.
Jonathan DeYoe 0:56 – 1:03
Hey, welcome back. On this episode of the Mindful Money podcast, I’m chatting with Miriam Castilla. I should have asked if it’s Castilla or Castilla.
Miriam Castilla 1:04 – 1:05
Castilla.
Jonathan DeYoe 1:05 – 1:36
Castilla. I knew I did that wrong. I’m chatting with Miriam Castilla. Miriam is a money mentor, author and speaker. She helps small business owners make a bigger impact and create a truly rich life. She has a background, very interesting. A background in engineering and finance, but she’s a hypnotherapist and is a student of metaphysics. Her journey has taken her from broke single mother of two to building multiple six figure businesses. I went around the show because she’s the founder of Magnetic money and the Magnetic Money Coaching Academy, where she marries the magical with the practical. Miriam, welcome to the Mindful Money podcast.
Miriam Castilla 1:36 – 1:42
Thank you so much for having me. I’m very excited about this conversation and where it’s going to take us.
Jonathan DeYoe 1:42 – 1:49
Oh, beautiful. I’m excited, too. Just real first, like, where do you call home? Maybe it’s in the accent, but where do you call home and where are you connecting from?
Miriam Castilla 1:49 – 2:09
Okay, so I am living in Adelaide, South Australia, which is a really beautiful part of the world. If you cut Australia in half down the center, basically we’re right down the bottom on the coast. I was actually born in Europe, though. I was born in Germany. I’m half german, half greek, so I’m a little bit of a citizen of the world.
Jonathan DeYoe 2:09 – 2:12
Did you grow up in Europe or did you grow up in Australia?
Miriam Castilla 2:12 – 2:40
So I moved to Australia when I was 13. My dad was in the diplomatic service. He was a greek consular official, and he decided that we really needed a sea change. So let’s get as far away as possible from Europe because it was the eighties, so there was a bit of turmoil and he thought, well, just why don’t we go to Australia? And we all went to where, sorry, what? And I’ve been calling it home ever since. And it’s a really great place to live.
Jonathan DeYoe 2:40 – 2:46
So I’m curious, in those 1st 13 years in Europe, what did you learn about money and entrepreneurship?
Miriam Castilla 2:46 – 3:46
Oh, in my 1st 13 years, I. Not much, to be honest. I lived a very charmed childhood. I got to go horse riding occasionally. I was that kind of kid that would go to the stables. We would drive to Greece because my father was afraid of flying each summer. So that was a three day drive, usually through Yugoslavia or via a ferry through Italy and go and spend our holidays. So it was a really peaceful childhood. And money wise, I didn’t really ever think about it. It wasn’t an issue. But interestingly, once we came to Australia, my parents separated and then the proverbial really hit the fan and I got to learn a lot about money and very much so different people’s money patterns because my parents, as it turned out, were polar opposites on that spectrum of how they thought about money, how they managed money and, yeah, everything they did. So that was a humongous learning curve.
Jonathan DeYoe 3:46 – 3:56
I’m curious if you can name. Maybe it’s the separation, but something that was like an experience in that process, like a specific experience in that process that sort of becomes integral to your money story.
Miriam Castilla 3:57 – 5:23
Yeah. So what I found really interesting was the contrast between my parents and that always struck me. So here was my dad. He was on really healthy six figure tax free income back in the eighties, so pretty good money. And he would always be scraping the bottom of the barrel for pennies because he has had this pattern of just spending it all right? And then hoping for the big win that would happen one day that would set him up financially. And then on the other hand, my mum, out of the separation, really was struggling financially. They didn’t separate on the best of terms and she was working for minimum wage and she managed to buy a house, a little apartment, pay it off, bought another one, paid it off, and she always had assets that were supporting her. And so by the time my father passed away, he actually passed away, leaving behind nothing but debt. And my mum is the one who one day, knock on wood, when she goes, I’ll probably have an inheritance. So it’s really interesting and it taught me so much about that. It’s really got nothing to do with your level of income it’s got to do with your money habits. And really, like you say, it’s about being mindful about money and really thinking about what is it I’m actually doing with the money I do have? Not when’s the money going to come that will suddenly magically change everything?
Jonathan DeYoe 5:23 – 5:36
Right? Two perfect teachers. You could have had two better examples on how this stuff works. Can you give us kind of a thumbnail sketch of your career arc? So what is it that you did before that led to the book and the magnetic money?
Miriam Castilla 5:36 – 7:47
Right. So yeah, as you said in my intro, I started out in a career in engineering and corporate development. Because it’s just what you do out of school. You go to university and then you get a great job in a petroleum company until you realize that that’s not you at all. And so after taking a break from that, having children, I found myself in a place where I had to start all over again because my marriage had broken down and I wound up in the finance industry. I got a job as a relationship manager for a finance company, which suited me because it was flexible. And from there I went on to actually start my own business in finance. And what was really interesting once again about that is that I realized that the people on the larger incomes often actually had more money stressed than the people on lower incomes. And they usually had a lower net worth even than the people on lower incomes. So once again, it was that reinforcing that message that it’s not what you earn, it’s not your level of income, it’s what you actually do with your income that really makes the difference. And also I recognize that people have next to no financial education. And I’m not talking about stocks and bonds and where to invest. That’s great. We have financial advisors for that. But I’m talking about just how do you manage your everyday personal income, how do you make sure you pay the bills, accumulate some savings to then be able to invest and still have some fun along the way. And that was lacking right across the board. So as that business matured and I was able to step away from it, I decided that I really wanted to go into teaching. And I’d always been a big fan of law, of attraction and the power of mindset. And it’s kind of what got me through going through the divorce, broke, single mum, trying to figure it all out and having to really pull myself together. And I recognize that when it comes to money, how we think and what’s going on inside your head is such an important thing. And so that’s what I do now. And that’s why I ended up studying hypnotherapy. Because to me it’s a really shortcut way of addressing some of those deeper issues. And that programming and conditioning that we’re subjected to usually as children by our unwitting parents.
Jonathan DeYoe 7:47 – 8:34
Yeah, for sure. So many people disbelieve hypnotherapy, I gotta tell you, I had the experience when I was nine years old, I had an issue. And it was my aunt, who was my crazy aunt who came in and gave me hypnotherapy. Like for a week, one on one. And she gave me a tape and I listened to the tape every night, just like religion, before I went to bed and she went away. So I’m a huge believer. I’m a huge fan. I know that it works. You gotta be open to it. So just. You mentioned the law of attraction and I’m glad you did. Because when your team reached out to me and said, hey, I think you have a good guest, I think Mary would be great. I was like, manifest money. And I just have this, like, ugh, totally impractical. Magic doesn’t exist. Like, I’m a finance guy. What are you talking about? But I read further. Like, I dug in and I see, I love your phrase. I mix the magical and the practical. So you just speak to what you mean by manifesting money.
-:
Okay, yeah, I’m so glad you bring that up because a lot of people will hear that and think, come on, you can’t just wish it and it starts dropping out of the sky and no, of course you can’t. So law of attraction is this really interesting thing. Because when you actually sit and study it, you can look at it from all these different points of view and through all these different lenses. To the point that I spent six months watching Stanford quantum physics lectures on YouTube. And looking at it from that point of view of quantum physics. Where this world is really just an ocean of possibility. And really it’s our observation of it that shapes a lot of it. But when we’re talking about money and law of attraction, it really comes down to the way you feel about money will either make you magnetic to it or make you repel it unconsciously. Because if you’re somebody who, for example, feels really uncomfortable asking to be paid or invoicing people, that’s going to come through if you try to make a sale. But you don’t really believe that what you’re offering is worth it. Or you’re worried that you’re overcharging or that the person can’t afford it, all of that will come through in your energy. And we all pick up on this unconsciously. You know, when you walk into a room, if there’s been some weird argument, you can feel it in the air. So it’s definitely a real thing. And the way I translate it is it just comes down to how we feel about money. Because when we feel great about money, when we feel supported, when we feel abundant, our brain chemistry literally changes as well. And we’re open. We’re open to ideas and possibilities and then always looking for more of the same. Whereas when we feel let down by money, when we feel resentful and those negative feelings, we shut down. We shut down energetically, our brain shuts down, and then we just get stuck in this victim mentality, and we just see more of the same problem. So, really, that’s how I translate that whole law of attraction thing to something that’s maybe a bit more practical. And really, that’s where I start. So I run a group program, and I start people with, let’s just start shifting the way you feel about your finances and help you actually start to see that you are supported and you do have plenty of money. It’s just that you’re a little bit too focused on the money that’s not here yet, that you’re still wanting to create. Does that make sense, Jeff?
Jonathan DeYoe:
It does make sense. It dawns me in the way you’re describing that, that we’re raised and the soup that we swim in as we’re raised, and I think I live in Berkeley, California. We’re a very affluent society, but the soup that we swim in is one of lack. It’s one of adulting is hard. Getting money is hard. If you go on TikTok or Facebook or any of these little video streaming things, it’s all younger generation saying, I can’t do this. I can’t make rents. And I just watched a couple of these this morning. There seems to be this. You can’t, you can’t, you can’t. That’s just built into culture. How do you overcome that when there’s no education, there’s no one here to tell us that anything’s different until we meet someone like you or someone like me. It’s all. This is dark, and this is dangerous. How does an individual or overcome that just in their lives?
Miriam Castilla:
Yeah, and that’s a really good question, because when it’s all around you, it actually spirals and it builds momentum. And I often say that law of attraction really is just another term for momentum. The more you feel a certain way and start convincing yourself that this is what life is like, the more of it you attract and create, the more you see, and it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy. So it’s really challenging when you’re in that space where you’re making. Maybe you’ve been raised in that environment and you’re surrounded by that environment, and you do really need to make a very conscious, powerful decision that you’re going to get yourself out of it. So things like turning off the news, changing who you follow on TikTok and Instagram, because there’s a lot of really great and inspiring things you can follow that will open your mind to all the possibilities. You’re starting to read some biographies, like things like Richard Branson’s biography and so on, where you think, do you know what? If this guy who is dyslexic and really impulsive and smoked a lot of weed in the seventies can do this, maybe I can do what it is I’d like to do as well. It’s just about really tipping the scales of the input that you’re consciously allowing in, because if we just walk through allowing the world to program us, we’re going to be a product of that. So we really do need to just, yeah, take charge.
Jonathan DeYoe:
So important. The media diet and what we’re taking in is just such a big deal. So do you have a favorite TikToker or Instagram channel that you go to for the motivation or inspiration?
Miriam Castilla:
Well, you know what’s really interesting? Back when the secret came out, I was very, even though it’s very superficial when it comes to law of attraction, it’s really just the headline. And I think that’s why the critics really didn’t get it, because they thought, well, it’s not that simple. And. No, it’s not. It was kind of the headline tip of the iceberg, invitation to look a little deeper. But just that message was really important and powerful for me. So this was a while ago, of course, but I would just literally, I had borrowed my friend’s dvd and I would just play it over and over and over again because I knew at some level that I needed to reprogram myself and start to believe that change was possible. So out of that, one of the teachers I really loved following was Mike Dooley, because he made it very simple. His whole mantra is, thoughts become things. And the really interesting thing is that this is actually somebody I work with on a regular basis now. I’ve become part of his program, and we actually certified trainers twice a year in his infinite possibilities program, which is an amazingly charitable program that actually started in jails. And it’s just about getting the message out there that your thoughts are really powerful and they shape your reality. So in back to your question of who do I follow now? I actually try to follow as few people as possible. So my Instagram feed will be full of art and funny things and inspiring more generic things. But I don’t follow specific teachers because I’m very much at the point where I have learned that trusting yourself and allowing yourself to be guided is actually really important, especially when you’re teaching this stuff, because I don’t want to start echoing other people. So I try to very much stay in my own lane. But if you’re asking, like, who should people follow? Eckhart Tolle is fantastic. I read the power of one every year. It’s on my bedside table. Michael Singer is amazing. I don’t know if you’ve ever read the surrender experiment. Oh, you must read it. It’s just the most fascinating story. How we went from being a hippie who just wanted to be left alone to meditate in the woods and have everyone leave him the hell alone to building a billion dollar company. It’s just a crazy, crazy story. So that’s a great book to read as well.
Jonathan DeYoe:
I like the fact that the things you’re quoting are books like, let’s Eckhart Tolle and books not. Well, you have an attention span, and you’ve developed an attention span that’s really, really important, actually, to learn things. You mentioned a second ago, or you talked about how thoughts are important. Talk about money mindset versus wealth mindset.
Miriam Castilla:
Oh, that’s a big one, isn’t that? When I first started teaching in this space, I use the word money mindset a lot. And what I eventually recognized is that when people think about, I need to have a better money mindset, they’re still caught in a space of, I need to shift my mindset around money because I feel like there’s not enough. So what it actually means is that kind of energetically and the underlying messaging and programming in that is I’m not safe. It’s not okay. And you’re still coming at it with this sort of underlying sense of desperation, and that’s not conducive to what we’re looking to achieve. So I now encourage people to actually uplevel that and think more about a wealth mindset, which is more that mindset of abundance. There’s plenty for everybody. The economy is not a limited size pie. It’s constantly growing and expanding, and we’re constantly developing new industries and jobs and technologies. And when we participate in that, we help expand the pie, and that means more for us and more for everybody. And also wealth mindset from the point of view. I don’t just want to generate enough income to pay my bills and to get by. I want to generate enough income so that I can have fun, I can pay the bills, I can live a life that gives me joy, and I can set myself up to be financially independent. So it’s actually about up leveling beyond enough. I want enough. I want to have more than enough, and I deserve it, and it’s possible. And also I have the belief in myself that I can do that. So it’s a big switch, actually, it’s a very big switch.
Jonathan DeYoe:
Does this dovetail, I mean, I think you say that more money doesn’t change patterns. So what do you mean by that? And does that sort of dovetail in here?
Miriam Castilla:
Yeah, it kind of does. One of the things that I tried talk about is your money habit archetype, which is very simple. I just. There are three basic categories, right? There’s the overextender, the person who will always get themselves deeper and deeper into the poop. Yeah. And I always say, and, sorry, I’ll go through the three first, and then I’ll explain kind of the difference. So there’s the spender, which is money in equals money out. And then there’s the accumulator, who’s always squirreling some away. So my mother, who was working for $5 an hour at one stage, she’s the classic accumulator because she managed to save for a deposit and then actually buy a property and pay it off. My father, total overextender. Money would come in, he’d go, great, can I get a car loan to buy a fancy new car? I actually have a quiz on my website where people can do that and find out which is theirs. Because the interesting thing is that most accumulators don’t think they are, because they are programmed into this feeling that it’s still not enough, I’m still not safe. And they actually beat themselves up and go, no, no, I’m a spender. Like, I just don’t have enough. And so that’s not healthy. Right. It sounds good on paper to go, yeah, I want to be an accumulator. And we do. We want the accumulator pattern of accumulating wealth and financial stability. But we don’t want to be driven by a sense of, I’m still not safe. And so these patterns, they will keep showing up over and over again, whether you’re on 50,000 a year or half a million a year or 5 million a year or 5 billion a year. There’s a story where he’s got a client who’s literally a billionaire and argues with his wife about the cost of the toilet paper she’s buying. So it’s crazy, right? Your net worth is fluctuating by hundreds of millions of dollars a day, and you’re arguing about the cost of the toilet paper. So these patterns don’t change. And so I’m interested in not just what are we doing with our money, that’s a really good, healthy, productive thing, but also how are we feeling and thinking about it, what’s driving it is that healthy. And we want to bring the two together.
Jonathan DeYoe:
So I don’t know if it was a. I think it was a podcast, but a video of a podcast where two guys were talking. One was worth 60,000,001 was worth 20 million, and they were talking about how they were still both stuck in this. One of them is a university of New York professor, actually. Nope, don’t have the name. But they both were, I mean, multimillionaires, very, very successful. Multiple businesses run, multiple businesses sold. And they’re both seriously coming from the scarcity mentality. Like, they didn’t think they were safe if someone’s there, because I kind of fall into this category. So I was raised very poor. I really, really wanted to have security, and I wanted to have safety, and that’s been really important. I built a business. I sold that business, merged into a larger firm. I have everything I ever need. I know that. I look it on paper, and I know that, but then I go, no, that paper is lying to me. Like, in my head, I go, nope, that can’t be true. Right? I got to keep going. Got to keep going. So how do you make that transition? What is the program that lets you open that back up?
Miriam Castilla:
Yeah, see, that’s so common. And I love that you had that experience of listening to that conversation, because just because people have a really high net worth or highly successful does not mean that they think, feel abundant. And this is the thing. You know, I love the intro to your podcast where you say it’s really about not really having to think or worry about money because we want the joy of life. It’s not about the money at all. At the end of the day. But money’s the symbol, and to a lot of people, it’s a symbol of security, right? And so if you have an internal feeling of lack or fear, like your experience, you know, going through a really tough situation as a child, that does program you and you, we are innately programmed to stay safe. You know, we still have our ancient lizard brain that says, you know, don’t do anything crazy. Stay safe in the cave. And when we have an experience that leaves us feeling really vulnerable, we literally make a decision, which becomes a belief that you can never be safe. You can never just relax and rest on your laurels. You always have to keep making, keep going for more and more and more because it’s never safe. Anything could happen. The rug could get pulled out from you, from underneath you at any moment. And so it doesn’t matter how much money you accumulate or what your net worth is, that feeling doesn’t go away. And this is why I talk about the money habit archetype, because it’s then you would recognize, hey, yes, I’m an accumulator. Is it a healthy thing that’s driving it? Maybe not. Okay, what’s the story that I’m buying into? And the story might be as simple as, you can never be safe. It’s never safe, right? No amount of money is going to guarantee you’re safe. So this is why I love hypnosis, because it allows you to get past the, you know, trying to rationalize your way through it to the actual part of you that is driving the bus, because that’s what your unconscious mind is doing. You know, it’s running all these programs on autopilot, and you’re just going through the day, you know, doing your thing, not even recognizing what’s going on. And hypnosis allows you to step away from the conscious mental gymnastics and actually connect with that deeper part. And then it’s literally just about pulling back the curtain, giving you the space and. Yeah, an internal space, I guess, just like a very deep meditation. That’s really all it is. It’s a state of trance where your brainwaves just slow down and you chill the hell out for a while. And it allows you to re examine those sorts of decisions and recognize that, oh, well, I was a kid. I was vulnerable. I observed this and I made it mean that. But that’s not the truth. That’s just what I interpreted it to mean. And it can be different, and I can make a different decision, and then you can walk away from that with that understanding. And having made a conscious decision to start telling yourself a new story, and then you build from there.
Jonathan DeYoe:
So let’s say you have someone that comes to you and they express the exact thing I just expressed. What’s the prescription? You do this for a month? Is it a week? Is it a session? Does it depend? Like, how do you know what’s the cure?
Miriam Castilla:
Is what you’re asking me, Jonathan, isn’t it?
Jonathan DeYoe:
I am. But it’s interesting because I spend. I’ve been meditating for 25, 30 years. Like, I interview people like you a lot. I’ve read the secret. I’ve read a bunch of these kinds of things. Like, I do spend time in the space, and I am still infected with this fear. So if anyone was going to overcome this, it’s me. And I haven’t. So how? Square this for me.
Miriam Castilla:
Okay, so I actually do very few one to one sessions these days. I created a group program and I created some processes so people can take themselves through it and so that they can keep repeating it as they need to. Because what happens is the first pass, you kind of get to a certain level of understanding and you go, okay, and you start making some changes, and then you grow, you settle into that, and then you can go back and maybe go a little deeper. And so it’s great having these tools and knowing how to use them. So for us, that literally looks like a pre recorded hypnosis. So, you know, just like your aunt gave you. And then I have a process that people go through like a worksheet. And so they go through and they recognize what that old money story is and get as much clarity as possible. And the way I explain it is we all have lots of limiting beliefs and we can spend the rest of our lives and give mindset coaches a lot of money trying to chase them all down and wrestle them to the ground. But when you actually operate at the level of story, that’s a much higher level. That’s like the umbrella that colors your world and all the limiting beliefs just hang off of that. So that’s why I like to operate at that level. So once you recognize that, hey, no, I’m just. Just bought into a story that you can never be safe, or that for people like us, it’s never going to happen, whatever the story is, you know, there’s so many variations once you get clear on that. Number one, whenever something is going on, you’re conscious enough to go, well, that’s just part of that old story. I’m not going to go there. So that’s a pattern interrupt. So it then comes down to just continuing to chip away at it and weakening the old pattern while you start getting busy installing a new one. Because your brain is a very efficient organism, right? So if you keep running a neural pathway over and over again that says, I’m never safe, I’ve got to keep finding more nuts to put away for the winter, then anytime you interrupt that pattern, you go, that’s not true. That’s not true. Like, my stores are full and overflowing and winter isn’t even coming. We have global warming. Every time you interrupt that pattern, you weaken it. And if at the same time, you get busy laying down a new path, consciously laying down a new path where you’re constantly reinforcing that I am safe, there is more than enough. I’m well looked after. Oh, look at that. There’s even more money coming. And you learn to actually shift your focus on the positive rather than constantly worrying about the negative. What happens is the new pathways naturally take over while the old wants atrophy. You can’t run both. And as we go through this process of trying to change, we go through this cognitive dissonance stage where it’s like the old pattern’s still running and you’re trying to get the new one up and running, and it can cause a bit of havoc. And most people at that point will step away and get scared and go back into the old, and then they might try again. And so that becomes a lifelong pattern. So you really need to make the decision, have the tools, and have the support and environment around you to go, you can do it. You know, you’re almost there. You just have to break through that, what Bob Proctor called the terror barrier, which is pretty awful name.
Jonathan DeYoe:
So I don’t mean to push this because I do mean to push this because I’m a podcast host. This is what we do.
Miriam Castilla:
Go for it.
Jonathan DeYoe:
So I’m wondering if it’s possible. So I think I have the new pattern going, and I think I just still see the old pattern and I see it pop up and I go, no, no, no, that’s silly. But I do. I still see it. I’m aware of it. And it actually just comes up. It comes up right here in the back of my head, like in the amygdala. And I go, oh, there it is again. And I can point at it, laugh and say, it doesn’t apply anymore, but it’s still there. Does it ever actually go away?
Miriam Castilla:
You know what? It never really fully goes away for anyone. Is my belief, I think it’s always going to be there because it’s how we’re biologically wired and that’s what we’ve attached that needing to be safe thing to, and that’s okay. And so I think maybe, yeah, it sounds like you’re putting way too much pressure on yourself that you need to kind of reach nirvana. I know you did buddhist studies, but it’s not really possible for any of us. So, yeah, it’s always there. And I think we can use it as a tool. You know, we can really start to embrace it and use it as a tool we can recognize when, oh, I’m pushing myself beyond my comfort zone. I feel uncomfortable. Isn’t that awesome? It means I’m about to grow, you know, so you kind of get addicted to overcoming that pattern and noticing it getting weaker or softer or just appeasing it. And so we have tools like you can just, depending on how extreme it is, you can just breathe your way through it, because physiologically it’s just excitement without the breath. That’s what fear is. So excitement stop breathing, you create a state of fear physiologically. So just breathing is really good. Just reminding yourself that it’s okay, I am safe, right. That calms that amygdala and then just getting on with the new, and I’m really big on that. Like, let’s focus our resources on building the new, not dismantling, breaking down the old, because we don’t actually need to. That’s not productive. That’ll happen automatically.
Jonathan DeYoe:
You talk about the hypnosis as a shortcut. I’m wondering, and this is probably completely out of left field for you, but I’m just curious. Michael Pollan talks about psilocybin as a way to rearrange your default mode network. I’m wondering if you’ve read anything about this and if it’s or done any journey work yourself and what you think about that as a way to change that default network, that the default choices or those grooves in your brain?
Miriam Castilla:
That’s really interesting. You’re the second person this week who’s asked me about that on a podcast. Wow. So there must be something in there for me to pursue and look into. So it’s something I’m aware of. It’s not something I have studied, but from what I do understand, and my kind of intuition on it says that it’s probably quite a similar experience. This is a personal thing, right? I’m a little bit. If you can get there naturally, I prefer that. And that’s why I’m big on meditation and like, I prefer not to drink alcohol even because I don’t like that hangover. But then part of me is also going, oh, is that a little bit closed minded of you, Miriam? But I believe that it’s probably very similar in terms of giving you access to an altered mental state that allows you to see what’s really going on. And if the end result is that that’s a great thing and if there’s no hangover or negative side effects, then great. And maybe for a lot of people that would actually be a, I guess an potentially an easier, more accessible way to do it and potent. But you just want to be really well guided, obviously, with that kind of thing.
Jonathan DeYoe:
For sure. It’s not like back in the day, a bunch of friends off in a forest taking drugs.
Miriam Castilla:
It’s totally different these days. Yeah. And the thing is, it’s not just the actually being guided through the experience. I’m also thinking about, you know, what is it you’re going to do with what you learned? How will you use that? Because it’s great to have insight. But then, okay, what do we do with it? Like, how do we use that as a resource and a tool to really create that life that we’re looking to build for ourselves.
Jonathan DeYoe:
Yeah. Yeah. So you work with generally small business owners. Right. One of the things that we, I hear about is there’s this period of this honeymoon phase of starting a business. You know what you want to do and you’ve got this idea and you’re all excited, but then there’s a speed bump and a roadblock and doubt creeps in and your brother says, what are you doing? And the glitches happen. How do you get past that? Like, how do you energetically get beyond the glitches that are literally inevitable when you’re starting up a business of any kind?
Miriam Castilla:
Yeah, that’s a great question. I do, I mainly work with small business owners. And usually by the time they come to me, they’ve been going for maybe three years or so, maybe longer sometimes. And they’re in that state where they’re frustrated, they don’t want to go back to their day job, and they don’t feel like it’s quite happening yet. And so my actual thing is it’d be great if everybody did the mindset work and figured out how to operate their money system before they started a business because, you know, a lot of people go into this building a business because they want to leave the job. They’ve got something they’re really great at or that they’re really passionate about and they’re all in and that’s wonderful and they put so much energy into it, but they have expectations of it’s going to translate to this in this period of time. And when it doesn’t, that’s when all that old programming starts creeping up, going, see, told you. What were you thinking? You should have stayed in your job where you were safe. Then your brother’s comments start bothering you, rather than you going, listen, you stay in your job, you have a great time, apply for you and you’ll leave. I’m going to the gym right now. So it’s really about prioritizing the mindset work. And I think that it’s a tricky one because most people go into business not realizing that it’s going to be the biggest personal growth journey of their lives. It really is. You’re not trading a job for I get to be my own boss. You have to show up, you have to carry the lot. So you really have to grow hugely. You have to become a giant in emotional resilience, in creativity and keeping your energy high. So it’s about actually having those practices in place before you start. If you can do that, you don’t need me.
Jonathan DeYoe:
That’s great. I don’t think I’ve ever heard it presented that way. But in terms of if you’re going to start a business, you have to be prepared for growth. But that’s so true because there’s more challenges and more voices coming at you that you’re more on more changes, more things that come up in that process than anything else I’ve ever done. So I totally get it. I want to shift towards the practical a little bit. So there’s a couple of things you talk about, I think audience would like to hear about. For a business owner who has like, cash flow, up down, up down, up down, you talk about how to smooth that cash flow. Could you just talk about that real quick?
Miriam Castilla:
Yeah. So what I see a lot of is that small business owners will be on this roller coaster of income and usually their emotions will follow along on a similar roller coaster. It’s like, yeah, let’s book that trip. And then, oh, my God, we have to eat baked beans this month. The problem is that they, because they don’t have the financial education of just how do I manage my personal finances, how do I make sure my business pays me and that I get to do what I have to do with my money, let alone, you know, actually build financial wealth, because they don’t have that education. It tends to just become a little bit of make it up as you go and madly shuffle money in circles. And then maybe a tax bill comes up as well. And it just creates so much stress. So often they’re just making it up as they go along, juggling money here, there, and everywhere. And so smoothing that cash flow and smoothing the emotional roller coaster ride that comes along with it is really, really important to make sure that they’re actually getting ahead, to make sure that they can pay their tax bill, that they are getting paid, and that they actually have some money to start building and accumulating wealth. So I keep it very simple, and it comes down to, you know, most people will think, oh, I need a budget. I need to track my expenses. But that’s all about closing down. That’s all about lack and limitation. So I say, don’t track your expenses. Track your progress. So for most of my kind of students, they tend to be in service based businesses. And it makes sense to actually do this on a weekly basis. It only takes five minutes. And I literally say to them, okay, we put their whole money system together so they know what their goal and target income is, but then it’s okay. How did we go this week? Do we have surplus or do we maybe have a little bit of a shortfall this week? And if you have a shortfall, you don’t just ignore it, hope for the best and hope it goes away. You have to actually track that, and you have to then make that up the next time. So you kind of set up like, internal lines of credits or buffers, but you actually have to use them and always pay back your shortfall, whether that means you had a shortfall in your tax account or your business account, or maybe you couldn’t put aside the money that you do for other things, but you might have to make that up first, because a lot of business owners, when the surplus, a big surplus comes in, they’ll spend it all, usually mindlessly, without a plan, which is a whole other issue. And they never make up that shortfall. And so it just becomes an accumulating, growing problem over time.
Jonathan DeYoe:
It sounds like you’re pulling from your, not to be too personal, but your father’s experience and your mother’s experience, and just sort of putting those two together and kind of saying you want to kind of be in the middle here a little bit and not have the emotional issues with being too much of an accumulator, but not having the pull of spending of the, too much of the overextender. Right?
Miriam Castilla:
Overextender. Yeah, it is. It’s about finding that happy middle ground. Right. And having just a really simple process and a system that you can follow so that you’re not emotional about it. One of the things that I don’t ever want to hear from someone in my program is, oh, I’ve had a windfall. What should I do with the money? I’ll literally look at them and say, well, you should know exactly what to do with that money. If you set up your money system the way you’ve been taught, you know, there should be no question, it should be awesome. I have a plan. I have a mantra that says every dollar has a job to do, and some of those jobs are for you to have a fun time with your money, because that’s important in terms of generating that feeling of abundance and plenty. But the surplus money as it comes in, that’s already got a job before it even arrives. So there should never be a question mark about how do I best spend this money? Because the problem is most people, they’ll have, you know, either a great income month or a windfall or something like that, and they’ll try to stretch it across lots of different things. They’ll put a little bit more on the home loan, they’ll pay off some debt, they’ll put some extra in their business buffer. They’ll spend some of it, maybe book a holiday. But then a little bit further down the track, they feel like they didn’t really do anything substantial with that money. It didn’t really help them move forward. So I’m all about, let’s focus on what the next logical baby step is for you. Maybe for some people that’s paying off debt, for others it might be, no, I’m going to just really smash my investment accounts so that I can invest and grow some assets there. So it’s different for everybody. But everyone should be crystal clear. If I’ve got a spare 10,000, 50,000 or $500 coming in this week, I know exactly where it’s going to go.
Jonathan DeYoe:
I’m wondering if you have that, and maybe this is part of the program, but if you have that set up, you’re almost building the expectation that there will be days or weeks or months where you have access. You’re planning, yes, if someday in the future I have this massive excess. But when you’re planning, it’s like when I had. But now you just throw out in the universe the expectation that it could happen. And so when it happens, you know, what to do. And so somehow you’re causing it to happen. Is that an argument that we can make?
Miriam Castilla:
Absolutely. Like, you’re setting the expectation right when you expect something to happen. It is so much more likely to happen when you don’t expect it to happen. And, you know, this happens in business all the time. People might pitch for a project or a sale or a new customer, but they don’t really expect them to say yes. Well, guess what’s likely to happen, right? So again, it’s that energetic component, and it’s your beliefs. Your beliefs are reflected back to you in everything that happens. So having a plan for it. Absolutely. Like it puts you into that space of, yeah, I’m ready for the extra money to come in. Whether that’s just a little bit of extra income in my business or whether that’s some forgotten aunt that decided to leave me her fortune. Doesn’t matter. Yeah, money can come from anywhere.
Jonathan DeYoe:
So another one of the practical issues is, I’m waiting to hear the answer to this question. How do you attract more premium clients? You said you work with service people. How do they find more premium clients?
Miriam Castilla:
Yeah, that’s a really big one. And it comes down to being as simple as you need to value your service as a premium service. And the thing that I find most gets in the way for service based business owners is they still have this mentality of charging by the hour. And so they’ll pitch for a contract or something and they’ll say, okay, well, we’re going to spend 10 hours together and I’ll be charging this hourly rate. But you can’t think like that when you’re running a business, because the value of what you bring is more than those hours you’re spending with the client. You bring your experience, you bring all your training, and also, if you can get the job done in half the time, that’s more valuable. So it’s really about upgrading your own thinking and really seeing and believing in the value of your service. And when you do, you naturally attract the clients who match that. You know, if you’re out there discounting and pitching for really cheap hourly rates, well, you’re going to attract the people who. That’s all they can afford, or they just want to try you out, but they don’t really value you. So it’s really about, you need to become the person you want to attract. It’s the same in relationships. I know you talk about the money thing reflects in every facet of life. It absolutely does. I find that after people join my program a little while into it, they go, oh, this explains so much. And I’m not talking about money. This explains why I keep having the same issues in my relationships, in my friendships, in every area of life.
Jonathan DeYoe:
So true. We’re getting close here, and I ask everyone to simplify stuff for us. So let’s say you’re talking to a business owner and they’re struggling to grow their business. What is one thing, just one thing that they should do today that would lead to greater personal and financial success tomorrow?
Miriam Castilla:
Okay. One thing I think do one thing is actually the answer I would give you. Do one thing that you absolutely believe makes a difference, stand behind it, focus on that, and get excellent at it, and just leave the rest. Like, pick the one thing to focus on, to talk about, to market, to sell, to get awesome at, because most business owners tend to try and spread themselves wider in order to try and fix things, but then you’re just spreading your resources and confusing your audience.
Jonathan DeYoe:
Good answer. And then the flip side of that is, what’s one thing they should stop doing? One piece of advice they’ve gotten that’s just wrong.
Miriam Castilla:
Stop listening to everybody else. Oh, well, stop listening to everybody else.
Jonathan DeYoe:
You said that earlier.
Miriam Castilla:
Yeah, absolutely. I think that, you know, when we feel like things aren’t happening the way we’d like them to, we start looking for answers and we start listening to more ideas, and we start questioning everything we do. And I think it’s really, and that makes us really ungrounded and unsettled, and it puts us into a state of confusion, and then we’re not really following our inner guidance and our inspiration. And so just stepping away from it all, and maybe you need to go and do a five day of the pasana and sit in silence, or maybe just do an hour walk in nature and just pull back from everything and go back to trusting yourself. I think that’s an incredibly powerful resource. We all have that in our modern world. We just don’t take advantage of as much as we really ought to.
Jonathan DeYoe:
Okay, so I’m going to take a little detour here, because you said something that I think is kind of juicy. And with all respect, like, I don’t mean to be disrespectful at all, but I think that I’ve been on podcasts where podcasts call me on, the host calls me on something. And the thing I get called on a lot is, Jonathan, it sounds like what you’re talking about comes from a real place of privilege. Like, there’s many, many people who simply can’t. And their circumstances are such that they’re just the ability to trust themselves. There’s nothing in their history that suggests that they should trust themselves. What do they do? Like, where do they go? I mean, a good mentor. What do they do?
Miriam Castilla
-:
Yeah. So, and it’s interesting that you using the example of not being able to trust yourself. Right. And so if somebody came to me, I mean, having privilege, having education and so on, that’s one thing, but feeling like you’re in a place where you have no reason to ever trust yourself, I would actually say that’s a person who has never trusted themselves, who has never actually trusted themselves, who has always, who maybe thinks they’re trusting themselves, but really they’re just following. They’re trusting this person. They’re trusting their decision to follow this person or to follow this path that they’ve been told, but trusting, in my opinion, because I do have a very spiritual side. If you truly trust yourself, you get your guidance from a whole different place. You get your guidance from a place that has your best interests at heart. You know, you tap back into the magic and wonder of life itself. Like, the fact that we’re even born is pretty crazy. The odds are so stacked against us. So I think that the person who says, I have no reason to ever trust myself, if they’re honest with themselves, they’re probably somebody who’s never dared to trust themselves. And often that’s also somebody who will kind of be in that place of blame and denial like it’s everybody else’s fault. It’s my circumstances. And I know this sounds really, you know, it’s a bit of tough love back, but it’s true. Like, we need to be really, really honest with ourselves. And if you look back and go, did I really trust myself, or did I just trust myself in following that person or doing what they told me? That’s a different thing to trusting yourself. Like, have you ever actually learned to just sit back and decide what you think and how you feel?
Jonathan DeYoe:
Scary. Right?
Miriam Castilla:
Yeah. So I threw it right back at you, didn’t I?
Jonathan DeYoe:
Yeah, I did. That’s fine. It’s fine. Just before we wrap, I want to come back to the personal again. Is there anything that people don’t know about you that you really wish that they knew?
Miriam Castilla:
Oh, yes. Actually, people will often look at, you know, my bio or what I do, and they think that I’m so accomplished and industrious. Right. The german side of me really comes out, and I wish people knew just how flipping lazy I actually am. And that everything I do is either because I’m intensely passionate about it or because I’ve actually spent a lot of time thinking about that. This is a great use of my resources. I think that when you follow anybody, if you put them on a pedestal, you make all these assumptions about them that then make it really hard for you to emulate, I guess, their results or even follow their teachings. You’ve kind of put them up on a pedestal and you’ve dehumanized them a little bit. And I am really, really lazy. Like, I put on makeup just for you today, Jonathan, so, you know, and a shirt, an actual shirt. Don’t ask me what I’m wearing from the waist down, but yes, that would be the one. I am wearing clothing. I will just say that.
Jonathan DeYoe:
Okay, that took a weird turn, but okay, awkward. Anyway, Mary, what’s the last thing you changed your mind about?
Miriam Castilla:
And I have a really weird sense of humor. That’s the other thing. I wish people knew about me.
Jonathan DeYoe:
Now they know that. Now they know.
Miriam Castilla:
They know. Yeah, they know that. Sorry, what was the question then?
Jonathan DeYoe:
What was the last thing you changed your mind about?
Miriam Castilla:
Oh, the last thing I changed my mind about. Oh, that’s a very good question. Hang on. I’m not prepared. I’m not prepared for this one. So the last thing I changed my mind about was we’re going on a little, actually, this is very personal, but just and simple. We’re going on a road trip and to visit some family interstate. And I had said to my husband, you know, we’re just going to camp along the way. Like, I just want to make it really simple. I don’t want this to be a holiday because we’re actually going away to Europe for three or four months. And I just changed my mind this morning and booked a really nice place to stay along the way.
Jonathan DeYoe:
Perfect. That’s exactly what that question’s for. I just want to say thanks for coming on. All that stuff’s going to be in the show notes. I appreciate your time and it’s been lovely getting to know you a little bit.
Miriam Castilla:
Yeah, great conversation. Thank you so much. I’ve had a blast.
Aundefined:
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